Complete beginner - Which craft + legal questions

[warder54]

Originally Posted by Fenlander

If you notice in that video the Excursion 5 stays on the lawn. Best place for it. Put water in it... rather than it in the water.

Totally agree! That looks like a capsize looking for somewhere to happen.

[warder54]

Myself and a friend had a "boat" each - similar to the Intex. We used them on a very small inland Loch near Blairgowrie (Clunie Loch) 2nd time in a mild breeze. Sold them after that, directional control due to not even having an inflatable keel was ZERO, we ended up beaching, deflating and walking back to the car park. Sold them on as Pool toys and bought a Waveline SIB and a 5Hp 2 stroke outboard.

[Steve509926]

I could be completely wrong and totally misjudged Metrotrekker, but I have the distinct impression that advice was sought and because it differed to what he had hoped, it has been completely ignored.

[Pikey Dave]

Originally Posted by Steve509926

I could be completely wrong and totally misjudged Metrotrekker, but I have the distinct impression that advice was sought and because it differed to what he had hoped, it has been completely ignored.

Ahhh! You fell into the old trap of confusing someone seeking advice, with someone seeking affirmation. [emoji57]

[Steve509926]

[willk]

Originally Posted by Metrotrekker

Alrighty, noted. We'll take this all on board and have a look at training then, thanks everyone for your answers

Ah! I initially thought "Jeepster" was back. But that reads EXACTLY like John Kennett when he's being as rude as he possibly can...

[Pikey Dave]

Originally Posted by willk

Ah! I initially thought "Jeepster" was back....

Ahh! Those were the days. Proper trolls, not like the lightweights that blow in now.

[Mikefule]

Trying to respond directly to the OP rather than to any specific comment further down the thread:

It is not so much that the modified Excursion is "top heavy" in terms of weight — although it may well be — but that it has a lot of "windage". That is, it's a light and not-especially stable boat, with lots of high flat surfaces to catch the wind.

Wind can be the enemy of even a conventional inflatable boat. It can affect speed, steering, stability and comfort. the extent of the problem may depend on the speed and power of the boat, how it is loaded, how choppy the water is, and the direction and strength of the wind.

It s possible to pick up a conventional small inflatable with a small-medium engine for a very reasonable price. A good starting point for searching is apolloduck.com .

If you take to it, then your first boat will not be your last. In this sense, you don't need to get it exactly right the first time. Get one, try it, work out what would suit you better, and work towards getting it.

However, the flipside of that is that if you get it badly wrong, you will find boating hard work and unenjoyable, and you will be put off.

For the rules on boating on rivers and lakes, the simple answer is a Google search for "launching on [river or lake name]".

Pretty much every stretch of non-tidal river (and some tidal) and every lake and reservoir is owned or managed by someone. There are often rules about speed, and in most areas you need either to pay for a short term licence or at least pay for a day launch.

Although there is no strict legal requirement to have insurance, most authorities will not give you permission to launch without making a declaration that you have insurance. In some cases, they will ask you to prove it.

Examples from my own neck of the woods:

Rutland Water, reservoir owned by Anglian Water. Charge for day launch, insurance declaration required, no petrol outboards.

Trent, Soar, and most local canals: managed by Canal & River Trust, buy a short term licence online, make an insurance declaration. It is also possible to buy a short term licence at certain marinas.

In reality, you are extremely unlikely to be challenged and asked to produce a licence if you don't misbehave and attract attention to yourself, and as long as you don't try to pass through a manned lock. Whether you pay or risk it therefore becomes a matter of conscience.

There is no legal requirement to be qualified or to have formal training. Most people don't. However, there is a lot that can go wrong, and even if you don't do formal training, it is always worth putting some time and effort into learning and practising skills.

Any beginner can go fast in a straight line on a calm day, but often the hardest part of a journey is the setting off and coming back in, when you are making low speed manoeuvres, especially if there is a brisk wind. Trying to hold your position waiting for a lock when it's a windy day and there is a current can be a real challenge. The most likely time for a "man overboard" is setting off or coming back in, when people are leaning to tie/untie the mooring lines.

Always carry an anchor with a couple of metres of chain and a decent length of rope. If you break down, you need to be able to hold position while you sort it out. Starting a reluctant engine is less stressful when you are not drifting rapidly towards a weir. Stopping for a picnic and a swim is far more enjoyable anchored in the middle of a quiet stretch of river than moored in the shallows next to a bank full of nettles.

In the OP you asked about specific trips. Start off small, get to know the boat, get used to how long it takes to get back into a headwind or against a current/tide on a cold day. Build up to more adventurous expeditions.

You also asked about radios. Some harbour authorities require boats over a certain size to carry VHF. Other than that, it is sometimes a sensible precaution but seldom a necessity. It is a legal requirement to do the VHF course (which is simple and reasonably cheap) and to get a licence.

[willk]

Originally Posted by Pikey Dave

Ahh! Those were the days. Proper trolls, not like the lightweights that blow in now.

Yer - I can go "trip trap, trip trap" all day long and nobody gobbles me up...

[jakew009]

For someone who’s clearly intelligent and capable of clear written communication, the OP has shown a remarkable inability to both do any prior research (which would have answered all of his questions) and take on any advice from anyone on here.

[HDAV]

Originally Posted by spartacus

Anyone can buy a hand-held VHF, but to transmit, and more importantly have it registered you need a licence which you can obtain via RYA approved centre, after you have sat and passed a short range certificate exam. Apply to Ofcom for the licence. Useful about understanding channels, how radio signal works, what to do in an emergency and distress call, rules, etc.

No need to have an SRC to “register” a DSC handheld and no need to register a none DSC unit

MMSI is issued to anyone who applies as part of the free “licence” from ofcom if that’s what you mean by register?


£400 won’t buy you a useable boat and engine combo I’m afraid, it will barely cover basic accessories need for 2 adults (new at least)

Might get a bargain used package but likely more aggro than it’s worth it would buy a used kayak or 2 perhaps even a canoe

[HDAV]

Originally Posted by jakew009

For someone who’s clearly intelligent and capable of clear written communication, the OP has shown a remarkable inability to both do any prior research (which would have answered all of his questions) and take on any advice from anyone on here.

Intex marketing dept?

[Steve509926]

Originally Posted by HDAV

Intex marketing dept?

To be honest I don't think so, I think it's a genuine post. I think the OP wants a party boat for him/her + partner and friends. Perhaps just off Studland would be more preferable than Durdle Door.

[paulbrown22]

Originally Posted by HDAV

No need to have an SRC to “register” a DSC handheld and no need to register a none DSC unit

MMSI is issued to anyone who applies as part of the free “licence” from ofcom if that’s what you mean by register?

Not that it seems that getting a VHF radio is probably the most immediate concern of the OP given the above discussion, but if by "register" people mean obtain a valid licence from Ofcom, then technically yes, for a non-DSC radio it needs to be covered either on your existing Ship's Radio Licence (can be added there if you already have a Ship's licence issued for a fixed set), or by obtaining a Ship's Portable Radio Licence for your handheld, which will issue a T-prefixed callsign for it. Clearly if it's non-DSC then an MMSI isn't required, and won't be issued, but some form of licence from Ofcom is still technically required.

But I agree, there is a distinction between the VHF SRC operator qualification (issued to an individual as a result of a course/exam by the RYA) and the Ofcom radio licence for the actual hardware itself, and whilst technically both are required (in non-emergency situations at least), there is no link/dependency in obtaining them.

[Poly]

Originally Posted by Mikefule

You also asked about radios. Some harbour authorities require boats over a certain size to carry VHF. Other than that, it is sometimes a sensible precaution but seldom a necessity. It is a legal requirement to do the VHF course (which is simple and reasonably cheap) and to get a licence.

Do you know which Harbour Authorities require VHF for boat of this sort of size?

Whilst a VHF course is not expensive, it’s a huge part of the budget for buying this toy. He therefore has three (legal) choices:

- don’t bother with a vhf and take a phone in a waterproof bag; far from ideal but is common in the SUP community and the actual use case for this won’t be that different
- get a vhf but don’t do the course; technically still legal if not used to transmit other than an emergency, but having an vhf and no experience using it is far from ideal when you really need it
- get a vhf and do the course and spend half the whole project budget on those two things; I think that money would be better spent of the boat.

[spartacus]

Hard to believe we're two pages in discussing the pros and cons of an inflatable pool toy.

[willk]

Originally Posted by spartacus

Hard to believe we're two pages in discussing the pros and cons of an inflatable pool toy.

Dry January is a long month. BRB, I have a hole to drill.....

[Pikey Dave]

Originally Posted by willk

Dry January.....

What! Ehh?? Did I miss something?

[Ferryman]

I just found this, it took up the 15 minutes while my wife was on the phone and I was waiting to put the movie back on! Cheers!

[Searider]

Hi Metrotrekker,

You will be OK at the top of the Hamble. Last summer you could almost walk across the water there were so many paddleboards and inflatables there.

However, the money you'll spend on the Intex Excursion is likely to be wasted as you'll soon want something more substantial and the Intex will have minimal secondhand value.

You might be better to up your budget to something like this:
https://www.gumtree.com/p/boats-kaya...1m-/1394237244

Avon - a quality brand that is well known. Granted this one is a bit scruffy but it will be fine inland and close to the shore and on a calm day no reason why you shouldn't venture out of the Hamble and turn right towards Southampton. If you stay on the Hamble / Netley / Weston side you're well out of the shipping lanes and the busy area where the yachts and motorboats are.
Training, as a proportion of your budget, is quite a lot. A Powerboat level 1/2 course is normally run over a weekend and costs a couple of hundred pounds. I'd suggest getting some of the RYA Guides to see what would be included in the courses. https://www.rya.org.uk/shop/Pages/pr...nal-watercraft
This will let you kniow what you'll need to learn to be prepared. Basic tides and chart use etc. As an example unless the tide is right in you can't turn right at the bottom of the Hamble - theres a long shingle spit there!

Have fun and know what your limits are. I hope that the advice on here has been informative - don't be put off but a little caution will pay dividends.