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Old 05 May 2022, 22:22   #1
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2009 evinrude etec 40hp tt

Anyone know of any active workshops still working.on these engines, I'm based in Edinburgh but prepared to travel. If I could get this diagnosed quick time. Up here I only know of 1 Mitchell's, Glasgow been told to call back in a week with a possible 6 week wait.

Problem is engine will start and idle. But try to engage forward or reverse it stalls the engine. Also top 2 led lights lit on EMM when engine running which as far as i have read could be charging and ignition/injectors. It's deffo getting fuel and can here the pump click with turn of key
Have had fuel filter changed. Also clean fuel attempted e5 ran fi e for about 4 outings approx 3 hours each. Last.outing bogged down. Then cleared again. Now seems to be stick as per mentioned symptoms. Will rev o miffs at home but I don't wanna rev to hard. But once submerged at harbour. Engine cuts out as son as motion is selected

Dont have much history on the boat /,engine as not had it long.

Any suggestions welcome. Cheers.
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Old 06 May 2022, 06:18   #2
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So starts and runs on idle fine? Can be made to Rev out of gear in a bucket but doesn't really want to? When put into gear it just dies?

It sounds like you've headed down the right path thinking it's a fuelling issue. Those are the symptoms of either a load of excess air getting in or not enough fuel and you'd normally guess the latter.

I like to start at one end and systematically check through, so starting at the tank is simplest. Obviously the first check is that we've opened the tank breather as you're not really a boating pro until you've been that daft. Then you want to check the flow through the pipe. I'll just push the engine end ball bearing seal in with a Philips and then prime the bulb to look for a good flow. After that it's on to the engine, you've done the filter and can hear the pump so being impatient I would jump straight to the end, the injectors (I assume it's an EFI engine?). It it were an older carb then I'd by this point assuming grit in the needle.

Are you able to remove each injector and test for a good squirt? Do they have any additional filters before them as is sometimes the case. And ultimately you have little to lose from cleaning the injectors.

Have you flushed out the fuel system since buying the engine? Has it been idle over winter with some fuel in the system? Or was the first run this season using fresh fuel put into a clean tank?
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Old 06 May 2022, 06:35   #3
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This would be a good place to start

https://www.etecownersgroup.com/
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Old 06 May 2022, 06:54   #4
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Hi TM and Pikey.

Yeah I've been on that site read everything I could pointing to my issue. Reading could be tps sensor. But again seems to be you need the diagnostic to confirm this. Also watched a vid that says they're is a couple of filters in the pump itself. I think within my capability to strip and check that. Injectors ive never tampered with but I'd imagine can't be to hard. Spark plugs seem to be indexed on this engine have to be a certain way again I think within my capability. I'll just mark them with sharpy or something. It's the emm lights that's concerning. And everything I'm reading says diagnostic required albeit these lights can mean more than the sticker says on the engine. With key on , not running the self check on emm looks all good 4 lights on. But when running 2 stay lit which is not good as far as I'm aware. Ive always put e5 fuel in. Tanks clean pick up in tank is clean. And primer bulb when squeezed is getting fuel right up to inline filter no probs. Good squirt. But I did change filter anyway. No one I scotland seems to keen to diagnose that I can find. This engine does not have a water seperator either being told that's a must for these engines. But I think at this pont that's a future thing to consider after I get the thing running properly again.
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Old 06 May 2022, 07:05   #5
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Originally Posted by Scomich View Post
Hi TM and Pikey.

Yeah I've been on that site read everything I could pointing to my issue. Reading could be tps sensor. But again seems to be you need the diagnostic to confirm this. Also watched a vid that says they're is a couple of filters in the pump itself. I think within my capability to strip and check that. Injectors ive never tampered with but I'd imagine can't be to hard. Spark plugs seem to be indexed on this engine have to be a certain way again I think within my capability. I'll just mark them with sharpy or something. It's the emm lights that's concerning. And everything I'm reading says diagnostic required albeit these lights can mean more than the sticker says on the engine. With key on , not running the self check on emm looks all good 4 lights on. But when running 2 stay lit which is not good as far as I'm aware. Ive always put e5 fuel in. Tanks clean pick up in tank is clean. And primer bulb when squeezed is getting fuel right up to inline filter no probs. Good squirt. But I did change filter anyway. No one I scotland seems to keen to diagnose that I can find. This engine does not have a water seperator either being told that's a must for these engines. But I think at this pont that's a future thing to consider after I get the thing running properly again.


Will the engine rev in neutral?
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Old 06 May 2022, 07:13   #6
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2009 evinrude etec 40hp tt

Quote:
Originally Posted by Pikey Dave View Post
Will the engine rev in neutral?
EMM LED codes

You can download the workshop manual here.
https://www.manualslib.com/manual/13...age=109#manual
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Old 06 May 2022, 07:31   #7
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Hi pikey,

Call me ignorant. I'm not aware you can rev in neutral. But if you mean the lever next to throttle yeah I can push that up and engine will rev. Same as if I put in forward or reverse engine will rev on muffs with garden hose it's just when under load down at harbour engine dies as soon as forward or reverse engaged. Again I can use the lever next to throttle and engine revs.ill take a loom at that manual. Cheers.
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Old 06 May 2022, 08:02   #8
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If those symptoms were on a carbed outboard I would be convinced that the issue was grit in the needle. A little bit of fuel starvation can mean the outboard appears to absolutely fine when not being asked to do any work, just make noise and then as soon as a load is applied it can't get the extra fuel and dies. For me the speed of the death gives a clue as to how far away the issue is from the combustion chamber.

If it's instant death as you suggest then I think I'd be tempted to run the theory that it's the injectors or a blockage very close.

To clean injectors I've jury rigged a can of MEK to one and then simultaneously sprayed the carb cleaner in while activating the injector Orr a 12v battery and some that until the jet of MEK looks even and right.

If you can get to the injectors you could also remove the fuel feed and see how much fuel flows when trying to start (obviously taking car re spraying flammable liquids all over the place ).

But if accessible I think I'd remove one injector at a time and just check how well they're spraying and whether you can see anything obvious.

It can always be an electrical gremlin but it's probably best to rule out mechanical issues first.
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Old 06 May 2022, 08:14   #9
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https://youtu.be/Cnvspzx9Dms

This looks like a good vid for injector cleaning. You use a section of the fuel line from the tank and a tyre pump to create the reservoir and pressure.

Once you know your injectors are categorically clean and working properly then work back along the line.

If you find nothing then maybe the fuel starvation is an electrical issue.

Incidentally, I assume you've checked that you haven't got something like fishing line melted in around the prop and that the prop turns with the expected resistance when in gear? It doesn't seem likely to be the issue as it runs in gear out of the water.
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Old 06 May 2022, 08:15   #10
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Hi TM,

Had a quick look thru the manual pikey sent link to. That suggests not the tps sensor, so Yr theory sounds good to me. It dosnt die straight away sort of splutters then dies 3-5 seconds at most. Again that's only when in the water . Muffs it's fine. But I don't rev to much on muffs. A d I don't have a tank big enuf at home to try submerged. Which is a pain down to harbour off load boat just to be disappointed. Next question is does anyone on here that anyone know of sell the lead and software to diagnose myself? I'd buy it. Looks like I may need it in future.im quite computer literate. So maybe a well worth purchase. I blame myself it was a spur of moment buy. Without the necessary homework done. But it was running fine for the first few outings. Every days a school day I suppose. Lol
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Old 06 May 2022, 08:18   #11
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Hi Tm,

Yeah the prop is fine no contamination of any sort. And yeah it turns fine on muffs. Forgot to mention it is a brand new prop. Evinrude 1.
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Old 06 May 2022, 09:12   #12
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The lead is a doddle to make if you can use a soldering iron, I made my own up from an old 9 pin serial cable. I can give you the pin outs. The plug at the engine end is a standard automotive 3 pin plug available on eBay for a couple of quid. I can send you a link to download the software. You will need a serial-usb converter if your laptop doesnít have a serial port, which it probably wonít.
This is the engine end plug

https://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/310138990...mis&media=COPY
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Old 06 May 2022, 09:39   #13
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Hi pikey,

I'm sure I seen a 4 pin plug . Probs looking at wrong plug it was just sitting they're with yellow bungs in it , to stop water I'm guessing. Let me check again I'll post a pic. ASAP. But yeah I can solder. Yr help is really appreciated. I've not got a laptop atm. But was planning buying one anyway so that's no issue. And I'm sure I'll have old serial cable somewhere tinkered with computers for years.
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Old 06 May 2022, 09:40   #14
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Hi TM,

Had a quick look thru the manual pikey sent link to. That suggests not the tps sensor, so Yr theory sounds good to me. It dosnt die straight away sort of splutters then dies 3-5 seconds at most. Again that's only when in the water . Muffs it's fine. But I don't rev to much on muffs. A d I don't have a tank big enuf at home to try submerged. Which is a pain down to harbour off load boat just to be disappointed. Next question is does anyone on here that anyone know of sell the lead and software to diagnose myself? I'd buy it. Looks like I may need it in future.im quite computer literate. So maybe a well worth purchase. I blame myself it was a spur of moment buy. Without the necessary homework done. But it was running fine for the first few outings. Every days a school day I suppose. Lol
It's a real bugger not being able to test at home. I had an issue last season on an outboard that couldn't be replicated on land but manifested itself every time on water.

That actually transpired to be a loose top plate on the carb so the mix was being really messed up during WOT and fouling the plugs causing it to just not run well off high throttle.

At the same time, I had the exact same issues as you're suffering on my 4hp and that was a tiny bit of sand in the fuel needle. I could at least fudge that fix on the water by pulling the manual choke to cut the air back to match the reduced fuel flow.

I'd whip the injectors out if only to see if they're mucky but get some carb cleaner through them to prove they are jetting well. And there are sometimes fuel filters just before them and if you've sucked up a bit of water or dirt they may be the cause. It is of course possible that it's a bit of fuel gunge. You have no idea how the previous owner stores or used the engine so your early use may have just moved some gunge to where it is now causing starvation.

You're really going to need to bodge a way to test on land. Can you not use a garden waste container or cut down a cheap bin and elevate on bricks to the right height?
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Old 06 May 2022, 09:49   #15
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Hi TM

Yeah total pain not being able to test at home. I have couple of spare wheelie bins but the evinrude is full size bottom end bullet shaped bit. So to big to fit. Think I'll go buy a big container see if I can duplicate problems on land rather than at harbour. I think I'm gonna check vst I think they call it and also attempt the injector inspection as you've advised. I thank you both for suggestions already. Gives me a bit hope. As I'm a spur of moment guy been looking at 60hp 4 strokes already. Lol. Do t help when yr down at harbour as the guys walking past asking is that a 2 stroke , I say yeah and they turn head and go pfft. Feel like throwing spanner at them. But I wouldn't. Lol
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Old 06 May 2022, 10:03   #16
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2 strokes are awesome. I wouldn't worry yourself about plonkers going pfft.

If you've got a spare wheelie bin why not cut down one side so that you can wheel it under the tilted outboard then drop the outboard letting it pull the bin into line? Then drill a hole at the bottom of the bin that'll take a wine bottle cork bung so you can fill and empty in situe and wheel away etc?

There'll always be a need for being able to fettle at home so it'll be a handy addition.
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Old 06 May 2022, 10:06   #17
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TM I will look into that great idea bottom.end of these evinrudes just seem huge compared to others. But yeah I'll check that out. Cheers.
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Old 06 May 2022, 11:29   #18
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I've just googled your engine. You're right, the lower leg does seem abnormally large!!
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Old 06 May 2022, 18:14   #19
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Wee update.

This is where I am , tested fuel pump 30 psi. That's roughly but OK I think tested with cheap tyre inflator but didnt turn on obviously just to get the psi. So pump seems OK. Removed vst water cover thing opened that. Spotless. No rust no debris. Opened where the fuel line Comes in dunno what it's called but that has a filter after you remove centre screw. It was spotless , but gave it a quick clean anyway, had went that far so I removed the injectors. The evi rude injectors are quite big and I can't see that ypu.can dismantle them. But I had them removed. Wee bit gunk on end of them where enters piston, but as I understand these open with pressure and spray in a mushroom type spray. They also have a return fuel li e back to vst. Or whatever its called for the fuel to be cooled. Spark plugs were so so. Top one looked OK bottom one not so great bit black sooted up. I'll get new ones. But atm I've put it all back together and it runs on muffs. Yipee. I didn't break anything even more by the looks of it. Have just purchased a big bin hopefully big enuf to test at home.
Been a good day for it and I've learned something. So not a complete loss. But I still have those 2 top lights lit on emm when engine running. I believe all lights are meant to go out. The saga continues. Will try my bin when home see what happens
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Old 06 May 2022, 18:32   #20
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Scomich View Post
Wee update.

This is where I am , tested fuel pump 30 psi. That's roughly but OK I think tested with cheap tyre inflator but didnt turn on obviously just to get the psi. So pump seems OK. Removed vst water cover thing opened that. Spotless. No rust no debris. Opened where the fuel line Comes in dunno what it's called but that has a filter after you remove centre screw. It was spotless , but gave it a quick clean anyway, had went that far so I removed the injectors. The evi rude injectors are quite big and I can't see that ypu.can dismantle them. But I had them removed. Wee bit gunk on end of them where enters piston, but as I understand these open with pressure and spray in a mushroom type spray. They also have a return fuel li e back to vst. Or whatever its called for the fuel to be cooled. Spark plugs were so so. Top one looked OK bottom one not so great bit black sooted up. I'll get new ones. But atm I've put it all back together and it runs on muffs. Yipee. I didn't break anything even more by the looks of it. Have just purchased a big bin hopefully big enuf to test at home.
Been a good day for it and I've learned something. So not a complete loss. But I still have those 2 top lights lit on emm when engine running. I believe all lights are meant to go out. The saga continues. Will try my bin when home see what happens

You might have 2 separate faults. LED1:- Check the charging cct. Stick a meter across the battery without the engine running, then start the engine & see if the voltage goes up, should be around 12.5V stopped & 14V running.
DO NOT DISCONNECT THE BATTERY FROM THE ENGINE WITH THE ENGINE RUNNING!!!! You will irreparably damage the EMM. Hopefully this isnít whatís happened in itís previous life. The EMM also acts as the regulator for charging the battery, if itís not charging, the EMM is scrap.🥴
LED2 points to a faulty injector, you can test the injectors with aforementioned meter set to Ohms. Canít remember off hand what the coils should be, but you can compare the 2 injectors.



https://www.manualslib.com/manual/13...age=110#manual

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