MAIB interim report on Seadogz fatality

[John Kennett]

Originally Posted by C2 RIBS

Have done both as one area needs urgent review

I have re-read the MAIB report and reviewed this thread. There have been a couple of minor amendments but I don’t intend to take any further action.

The subject is very much still open for discussion, but please be sensitive to the fact that the investigation is still ongoing and we don’t yet know all the facts.

[36valley]

If C2 RIBS has a problem with this thread he must be in complete and utter meltdown over the 'opinions' being voiced on the ybw forum.

[69cmw]

The MAIB have put a bit about it out on their YouTube channel.

[lakelandterrier]

No-one here has that I can see made any criticism of any individual or organisation, and at without all the evidence - still being evaluated by MAIB. it would be wrong and insensitive to do otherwise

Let's go back to the interim report:
"There are many aspects to this tragic accident, and the MAIB’s investigation is ongoing. However, there are some immediate lessons that can be learned now that will help avoid a repetition this summer, which is why the MAIB is releasing an interim report".
i.e.Let's learn what we can at early stage to avoid further injury / fatalities in future. I don't think any reasonable person would disagree and we can all read the report.

[Pikey Dave]

Emily Lewis: Speedboat skipper cleared of teenager's manslaughter https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-englan...shire-64625539

[Pikey Dave]

Originally Posted by Pikey Dave

Emily Lewis: Speedboat skipper cleared of teenager's manslaughter https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-englan...shire-64625539

Anyone know what the penalties for failing to keep a lookout are?

[GuyC]

Originally Posted by Pikey Dave

Anyone know what the penalties for failing to keep a lookout are?

Up to two years in prison and / or a maximum fine of £50k (possibly).

The jail sentence is pretty clear from Section 58 of the Merchant Shipping Act 1995 but it refers to a statutory maximum fine which I can't find although there is reference to a maximum fine of £50k in other areas of the Act.

For causing death by dangerous driving on the road, a typical sentence is five years.

[Pikey Dave]

Originally Posted by GuyC

Up to two years in prison and / or a maximum fine of £50k (possibly).



The jail sentence is pretty clear from Section 58 of the Merchant Shipping Act 1995 but it refers to a statutory maximum fine which I can't find although there is reference to a maximum fine of £50k in other areas of the Act.



For causing death by dangerous driving on the road, a typical sentence is five years.

So, considering the consequences of his actions, he’ll get a slap on the wrist. Hardly justice.

[Poly]

Originally Posted by Pikey Dave

Anyone know what the penalties for failing to keep a lookout are?

I think it’s prosecuted as failing to follow rule 5 of the Col Regs under the merchant shipping regulations - so at Crown Court is a maximum of 2 yrs custody or a fine. I don’t think there is actually a maximum fine anymore - but sailing a yacht into a tanker during cowes week got a skipper £2000 and about £100k of prosecution costs. I think as this was prosecuted by the CPS rather than the MCA the prosecution costs will be substantially lower.

The owner of the business was found guilty of operating unsafely and that carries the same penalties.

As with most road traffic deaths it is unlikely there will be a sentence which Emily’s family will feel is just.

We will never know why the jury concluded that manslaughter had not been proven, but they have had the benefit of hearing several weeks of evidence and were the people tasked with assessing the credibility and reliability of that evidence having seen the witnesses first hand.

[fastasfox]

Very sad all round...the passengers were looking for a thrill (we all understand that on here)and the skipper was trying to deliver said thrill and earn a crust....nobody sets out for a fun day out to end up in disaster....no pointing fingers.... the investigation will take it's course.

[Pikey Dave]

Originally Posted by fastasfox

Very sad all round...the passengers were looking for a thrill (we all understand that on here)and the skipper was trying to deliver said thrill and earn a crust....nobody sets out for a fun day out to end up in disaster....no pointing fingers.... the investigation will take it's course.

The investigation has taken its course, as has the court case. The skipper was negligent resulting in the tragic death of a young girl. You can’t sugarcoat it any differently.

[69cmw]

Originally Posted by Pikey Dave

The investigation has taken its course, as has the court case. The skipper was negligent resulting in the tragic death of a young girl. You can’t sugarcoat it any differently.

Suspended sentence was the result.

[paintman]

'Speedboat skipper Michael Lawrence and company owner Michael Howley have been given 18-week prison sentences suspended for two years at Winchester Crown Court.

They were both also ordered to complete 125 hours of community service and pay £1,000 of court costs.'
www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-england-hampshire-64987949

[Pikey Dave]

Originally Posted by paintman

'Speedboat skipper Michael Lawrence and company owner Michael Howley have been given 18-week prison sentences suspended for two years at Winchester Crown Court.

They were both also ordered to complete 125 hours of community service and pay £1,000 of court costs.'
www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-england-hampshire-64987949

Travesty!

[neil.mccrirrick]

Outrageous, no consequence there that I can see.

[beamishken]

Originally Posted by Pikey Dave

Travesty!

Absolutely!


Sent from my SM-G950F using RIB Net mobile app

[Iankristy]

A tragedy for all involved. The Father and daughters impact statements are just heartbreaking. I Cant comprehend how it ever happened. Sentence is a pathetic deterrent and will only result in the insurance industry shitt¥#g itself when insuring seafari style businesses.

[Pikey Dave]

Originally Posted by Iankristy

A tragedy for all involved. The Father and daughters impact statements are just heartbreaking. I Cant comprehend how it ever happened. Sentence is a pathetic deterrent and will only result in the insurance industry shitt¥#g itself when insuring seafari style businesses.

TBF, I think there’s a succinct difference between “Seafari” and “Thrill” rides. For me a Seafari ride is to see wildlife & coastline without causing any unnecessary disturbance to the environment. Whereas a thrill ride is exactly that, an adrenaline ride which by definition seeks out danger & situations that most responsible seafarers would literally go out of their way to avoid. For me, this sad case illustrates everything that’s wrong with the thrill ride industry, by definition it’s irresponsible. I’ll get my coat.

[spartacus]

Originally Posted by Pikey Dave

TBF, I think there’s a succinct difference between “Seafari” and “Thrill” rides.

I completely agree. Being on the water, even in perfect conditions, then there's ultimately a degree of unpredictability and risk in operating a thrill ride given the nature of what they are trying to achieve.

It's not like a roller-coaster ride at a theme park state-side which can be pushed to extremes and the results are consistent every time, partly because it's computer controlled.

There's the skipper and everything that relates from that, their experience, health at the time and concentration, the passengers first and foremost, the condition of the boat, the weather, the sea condition, the volume of marine traffic in the area, then variables, such as low-sun, wildlife, radio chatter, etc.

I agree - it's an utter travesty on the verdict.

[Pikey Dave]

Originally Posted by spartacus

I completely agree. Being on the water, even in perfect conditions, then there's ultimately a degree of unpredictability and risk in operating a thrill ride given the nature of what they are trying to achieve.

It's not like a roller-coaster ride at a theme park state-side which can be pushed to extremes and the results are consistent every time, partly because it's computer controlled.

There's the skipper and everything that relates from that, their experience, health at the time and concentration, the passengers first and foremost, the condition of the boat, the weather, the sea condition, the volume of marine traffic in the area, then variables, such as low-sun, wildlife, radio chatter, etc.

I agree - it's an utter travesty on the verdict.

Absolutely, even rollercoaster rides in controlled environments still go horribly wrong. Looking for “thrills” on the unpredictable sea is asking for trouble.

Alton Towers Smiler crash: Four seriously hurt http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-32980354