So my safety chains work!

Poly · 10 July 2011, 20:29

Well something went wrong with my "hitching boat to car" procedure today

. I'm not sure what as I'm certain I checked it was properly coupled but shortly after driving off the trailer came off the car. Fortunately the beefy safety chains did their job and allowed me to bring the car and trailer both to a relatively controlled stop with no damage to the trailer or boat

. Unfortunately, but not unexpectedly the bumper on the car isn't looking too pretty - it has a gash about an inch and half wide in it and is deformed around this. Anyone know what the practical/cost limits are which mean "repair" is no longer as economical as replacement? I'm guessing this will be one of those times when the excess and potential insurance premium cost outweigh a claim.

I'm not certain what caused the issue and will need to do some more investigating. Almost certainly part of the problem was rainwater collected in the boat overnight which shifted to the back in transit unweighting the nose (learning point there about draining it properly before driving off

)

Nos4r2 · 10 July 2011, 20:44

Quote:

Originally Posted by Polwart

I'm not certain what caused the issue and will need to do some more investigating. Almost certainly part of the problem was rainwater collected in the boat overnight which shifted to the back in transit unweighting the nose (learning point there about draining it properly before driving off

)

Lucky escape!

I can tell you for <edit-ALMOST-unless your towball is REALLY badly worn!>certain that the issue was that it wasn't locked to the towball properly. I'd be looking closely at your hitch for wear-depending on the hitch type it should have withstood being lifted almost enough to lift the car by.

Rainwater wouldn't have been a factor-a good bump would have done it if the rainwater could do it.

Poly · 10 July 2011, 21:22

Quote:

Originally Posted by Nos4r2

I can tell you for certain that the issue was that it wasn't locked to the towball properly. I'd be looking closely at your hitch for wear-depending on the hitch type it should have withstood being lifted almost enough to lift the car by.

Indeed - that is why I posted - I thought I was pretty thorough at checking the connection was good. I always try to lift the trailer off the car again after connecting and ensure the back of the car rises upwards and they stay connected. I definitely did this today... ...is there a better way to test the hitch?

The latch was still in the closed position after it had come off (so the problem seems to be how tight the "clamp" under the ball is rather than the latch lifting).

I'll be giving it a good clean/inspect/test next time I am down at the yard to see if I can see any obvious issues. It may get replaced anyway as I've now lost confidence in it.

Quote:

Rainwater wouldn't have been a factor-a good bump would have done it if the rainwater could do it.

Ah I know it wasn't the cause, meerly the straw which broke the camel's back (or tipped the balance in this case!). But it was laziness that I didn't drain it and 50-100 kg of unsecured load sloshing about probably isn't good for the trailer handling anyway!

Bigmuz7 · 10 July 2011, 21:40

Hmm .. you're not the sort to leave a major part like that undone Polwart, although we all make mistakes for sure.

I have wondered about how much wear on a ball is allowable though. We hire out trailers a fair amount, and I had one issue where a taxi driver ran into the back of one of my customers with one of our fairly new plant trailers on when it was empty .. as they have a flat arse, the impact was good, and the tow vehicle got its tow bar/frame bent, and the hitch became disconnected, so.. the question was how worn was his ball ? .. I binned the hitch head in question after the event and inspected all other parts ofcourse but was unable to get a working theory on why the hitch seperated,.. other than the fact that it over articulated ?

Needless to say the said customer was suddenly swarmed with 'witnesses' from other taxis supporting the offender, even though the victim was stattic at a junction

Id sort the bumper and be glad your safety gear worked .. end of

BogMonster · 10 July 2011, 22:26

I suppose the law has something to say about it over there, but I can probably ignore it here ... I have always wondered whether it is better to have a trailer with breakaway brakes, or one with a whopping great chain as a backup.

Obviously an unbraked trailer has to have a chain, but I've been giving serious thought as to what to do with the trailer I have, as I'd rather have to buy a new back window for the 110 than fish the boat out of a ditch. If mine jumped off the hitch, the breakaway cable would apply the trailer brakes but what are the chances of it stopping in a straight line behind the vehicle - especially a boat trailer where the brakes have been in salt water. Probably not a lot - has anybody had it happen?

willk · 10 July 2011, 22:33

Quote:

Originally Posted by BogMonster

Sent from my Computer, using a keyboard and mouse

Good man!

Poly · 10 July 2011, 23:15

Quote:

Originally Posted by Bigmuz7

Hmm .. you're not the sort to leave a major part like that undone Polwart, although we all make mistakes for sure.

Oh I most certainly could make a really stupid mistake like not hitching it up correctly... ...but on this occasional I know I checked it (although obviously not well enough!) as the kids asked what I was doing.

Quote:

Originally Posted by BogMonster

I suppose the law has something to say about it over there, but I can probably ignore it here ... I have always wondered whether it is better to have a trailer with breakaway brakes, or one with a whopping great chain as a backup.

Indeed - this is a total weight of less than 500kg so unbraked and with 2 big (3/8"? diam) chains. My car weighs something like 1500 kg (IIRC) so the ratio of the weights is probably similar to your LR and boat? Stopping it at serious speed would be very "interesting". Although again that may be less of a concern for you than the average UK boater.

DM · 10 July 2011, 23:22

Quote:

Originally Posted by Polwart

I'm not certain what caused the issue and will need to do some more investigating.

Simple. Hook the boat up to your jalopy, put a jack under the drawbar and crank it up. If the hitch flies off, somethings shagged. If the back of the jalopy rises and holds the hitch tight, consider yerself a nobend.

Nos4r2 · 10 July 2011, 23:42

Quote:

Originally Posted by Polwart

Indeed - that is why I posted - I thought I was pretty thorough at checking the connection was good. I always try to lift the trailer off the car again after connecting and ensure the back of the car rises upwards and they stay connected. I definitely did this today... ...is there a better way to test the hitch?

I wind up the jockey wheel so the hitch locks on, then give it a few winds to lift the back of the car very slightly above the normal unloaded driving position. With a light trailer your jockey wheel might not allow this though.

Quote:

Originally Posted by Polwart

The latch was still in the closed position after it had come off (so the problem seems to be how tight the "clamp" under the ball is rather than the latch lifting).

I'll be giving it a good clean/inspect/test next time I am down at the yard to see if I can see any obvious issues. It may get replaced anyway as I've now lost confidence in it.

Ah I know it wasn't the cause, meerly the straw which broke the camel's back (or tipped the balance in this case!). But it was laziness that I didn't drain it and 50-100 kg of unsecured load sloshing about probably isn't good for the trailer handling anyway!

Pressed steel hitch? I wonder if it was excessive flex in the hitch or hitch mechanism itself.

I hate them-when I had one on the SR4's trailer I used to put a cheap long hasped padlock (or when that refused to work, as cheap padlocks do, a pin) through the slot in the hitch mechanism to stop any possibility of the mechanism flexing and allowing the latch to move backwards far enough to undo.

You might find in testing you'll have to duplicate the effects of the water sloshing-but I'd just change the hitch anyway. It's failed once so it'll do it again.

Poly · 11 July 2011, 00:13

Quote:

Originally Posted by DM

Simple. Hook the boat up to your jalopy, put a jack under the drawbar and crank it up. If the hitch flies off, somethings shagged. If the back of the jalopy rises and holds the hitch tight, consider yerself a nobend.

Are these mutually exclusive... because I already know I'm a nobend which will save getting the jack out the cupboard.

Test method noted for trip to boatyard.

Quote:

Originally Posted by Nos4r2

I wind up the jockey wheel so the hitch locks on, then give it a few winds to lift the back of the car very slightly above the normal unloaded driving position. With a light trailer your jockey wheel might not allow this though.

it used to but its seized so its "jack" function no longer works - its on the to do list.

Quote:

Pressed steel hitch?....

...I hate them-when I had one on the SR4's trailer I used to put a cheap long hasped padlock (or when that refused to work, as cheap padlocks do, a pin) through the slot in the hitch mechanism to stop any possibility of the mechanism flexing and allowing the latch to move backwards far enough to undo.

It is indeed a pressed steel thing - normally I have a padlock on there as a token gesture at security for motorway services etc but I didn't bother as I was only taking it back from the house to the boatyard (3 miles). Although of course that is clutching at straws!

BogMonster · 11 July 2011, 00:22

Quote:

Originally Posted by Polwart

Stopping it at serious speed would be very "interesting". Although again that may be less of a concern for you than the average UK boater.

Yes - I rarely tow at more than about 30mph and while I haven't been on any long trips with it, that wouldn't change with the rural road conditions here. Might be 'interesting' if it happened with the Ranger, with the back end of a pickup being pretty light!

jyasaki · 11 July 2011, 06:37

Many of the hitches are "adjustable" in that they have a nut or bolt that adjusts the amount of closure in the latch (i.e. how far the lock wedge goes in to trap the ball.) Usually they rust up pretty solid after a few uses, but could it be that it was loosely adjusted to begin with?

I have heard of dual and triple axle trailers having the hitch fail when backing over a change in incline, as when transitioning from a lot to ramp. It apparently doesn't take all that much to pop the ball loose.

jky

BogMonster · 11 July 2011, 10:35

Personally I think the heavy duty cast hitches (Ifor Williams fit them to the bigger trailers they make) are a lot more confidence inspiring than the pressed steel hitches fitted to most smaller trailers. The cast hitch on my Ifor has a positive locking mechanism and I simply don't see any way it could come off unless something snapped. I don't really like the "locking" mechanism on any of the pressed hitches. My Ifor one is an Avonride like the CPLS235 half way down this page Hitch Heads

Greasing the ball is something that a lot of people here don't seem to do and over time I guess it leads to wear either on the ball or in the hitch.

I use the "lift it up with the jockey wheel" method to check as well. Well I did until the plastic jockey wheel broke

new metal one arrived last week!

9D280 · 11 July 2011, 17:21

Curveball:

Would I be right in thinking your trailer is a US import? (this is a hazy memory from a long ago post, may not even be you) If not, ignore the next observation:

2" and 50mm are nominally similar........

Nos4r2 · 11 July 2011, 17:22

Quote:

Originally Posted by 9D280

Curveball:

Would I be right in thinking your trailer is a US import? (this is a hazy memory from a long ago post, may not even be you) If not, ignore the next observation:

2" and 50mm are nominally similar........

Yes, but a 50mm ball won't go into a 2" hitch. It's the other way round that's a problem.

Poly · 11 July 2011, 18:53

Quote:

Originally Posted by 9D280

Curveball:

Would I be right in thinking your trailer is a US import? (this is a hazy memory from a long ago post, may not even be you) If not, ignore the next observation:

2" and 50mm are nominally similar........

You are correct the trailer is US origin but relatively new, and I believe that all the hitches fitted to their EU exports are CE compliant and therefore 50.0 mm rather than 2". Of course it is possible that someone mixed them up even though it is supposed to be the EU version of the trailer...

Quote:

Originally Posted by Nos4r2

Yes, but a 50mm ball won't go into a 2" hitch. It's the other way round that's a problem.

Emmm.... I think it would? A 50 mm ball should fit into a 50.8mm hole but be a shade looser than intended?

Nos4r2 · 11 July 2011, 19:18

Quote:

Originally Posted by Polwart

Emmm.... I think it would? A 50 mm ball should fit into a 50.8mm hole but be a shade looser than intended?

I stand corrected-I had it in my head that 1" was 24.5mm,rather than the correct 25.4mm

Neil Harvey · 11 July 2011, 21:00

Quote:

Originally Posted by Nos4r2

I wind up the jockey wheel so the hitch locks on, then give it a few winds to lift the back of the car very slightly above the normal unloaded driving position.

Me too... in fact, the only time I didn't (because I was going nowhere near a public road and only driving through the boatyard to the slip, a 21ft picton cruiser on tri axle trailer came off the back, and into the car which I stopped in front of it, so as to avoid it hitting any boats on hardstanding

so don't beat yourself up too much

BogMonster · 12 July 2011, 01:22

Quote:

Originally Posted by Polwart

Emmm.... I think it would? A 50 mm ball should fit into a 50.8mm hole but be a shade looser than intended?

Yes, and then it may well jump off ... using a 2 inch hitch on a 50mm ball is a bad idea!

I was once told years ago that a 50mm ball hitch should have a flat machined into the top of the ball whereas a 2 inch one didn't and was rounded. Not sure if there is any 100% way of telling about the trailer end though.