Yet again, another vote for madness.

[codprawn]

Originally Posted by Jono

Mmm... just had a quick "nose" and discover that quite a few Police "units" have been isued with .223 AUGs...... shit! That's really gonna sting if it goes wrong I understand if you're facing a villain wearing a vest it's much better to give him a smack with a .223 rather than a tickle with a 9 mill.. but jeez..... through and throughs?..

Exactly - worrying or not???

I was talking to a really nice copper the other day on this very matter - he was about 30ish and had been a copper in the roughest part of Swansea for about 10 years - he said in all that time he had never even used his truncheon in anger and yet they are kitted out like stormtroopers now.

I just isn't wanted needed or justified!!!

[Jono]

The more I look at that picture of the Officer in Bristol the more convinced I am that that's a 9 mm...


<edit>...Yup.. That particular one is defo a 9 mill .. it has the magazine insert that the .223's dont... but here is a pic of an officer with a .223...

[Jono]

..and just 'cause I agree with you on type of Firearm.. doesn't mean I've forgotten your crass comment about SS camp guards....

[codprawn]

Still can't tell - the shot of the mag is just on the edge - anyway as you pointed out - they HAVE been issuing the bloody things!!!

Hope your house walls are nice and thick - oops forgot - windows!!!

[codprawn]

Originally Posted by Jono

..and just 'cause I agree with you on type of Firearm.. doesn't mean I've forgotten your crass comment about SS camp guards....

The reason why I said that was to illustrate how blindly following one's duty isn't ALWAYS right.

How would you feel if it was a member of YOUR family who was shot dead in such circumstances and the people responsible got off scott free because "we were just doing our job"???

It is a very worrying trend these days - if people screw up it is NEVER their fault - it is the procedures or the system or lack of training etc etc. At the end of the day they are still PEOPLE and if they drop a bollock they should pay for it!!!

[Jono]

Originally Posted by codprawn

Still can't tell - the shot of the mag is just on the edge - anyway as you pointed out - they HAVE been issuing the bloody things!!!

Hope your house walls are nice and thick - oops forgot - windows!!!

£20 says 9mm....

...and you're still a complete tosser for comparing the actions of two armed Police Officers with SS concentration camp guards......

[codprawn]

Originally Posted by Jono

£20 says 9mm....

...and you're still a complete tosser for comparing the actions of two armed Police Officers with SS concentration camp guards......

I didn't compare their actions!!! I compared their excuses!!!

Maybe it is the fault of the media for making people think that there are guns where ever we turn - a few years ago if the Police had a report about someone carrying a gun they would tend to treat it with scepticism - now they act the complete opposite.

Here is an example of the way things are going

http://uk.news.yahoo.com/17102005/14...-struggle.html

A 13 yr old boy was arrested for shooting a bb gun in a classroom.

"An Avon and Somerset Police spokeswoman said: "Police are reminding people they are not allowed to carry any firearm or imitation firearm in a public place without authority and they maybe arrested and charged if they do so."

We were always pulling stunts like this in class - we would usually end up with the bb gun being taken off us and a bollocking off the headmaster!!!

[Nate]

Agree with the Codmeister here - many WWII war crimes were committed by people following orders, and indeed several subsequent acts of officially sancioned barbarism follow the same pattern. Psychologically the individual (in uniform) is excused personal responsibility for their actions when those actions are sanctioned by authority. More problematic is the militarising of the police as referred to in this thread. Plod are rarely the sharpest tools in the box, and giving them bangsticks is just plain irresponsible.

When was the last time an armed felon was subdued by an armed policeman? Buggered if I know - however unauthorised shootings of unarmed civilians do rather seem to be all too common.

Bogeyman myths of "The War On Terror" are just tools of mass manipulation - I really think Little Texas is well on the way to becoming a police state...

[Jono]

Originally Posted by Nate

.... Plod are rarely the sharpest tools in the box....

Whereas you, with your intelligent, well thought out response backed up by evidence such as "buggered if I know”, but I'll comment anyway...have proven yourself to be an intellectual giant.

[Nate]

Originally Posted by Jono

Whereas you, with your intelligent, well thought out response backed up by evidence such as "buggered if I know”, but I'll comment anyway...have proven yourself to be an intellectual giant.

Jono - someone should have told you the old adage about keeping silent and being thought a fool being better than speaking out and removing all doubt.

I was being ironic. I'll explain that in a pm if you like...

[donutsina911]

Originally Posted by Nate

Plod are rarely the sharpest tools in the box, and giving them bangsticks is just plain irresponsible.

When was the last time an armed felon was subdued by an armed policeman? Buggered if I know - however unauthorised shootings of unarmed civilians do rather seem to be all too common.

plenty of "plod" would take offence at this comment IT layabout...having spent time in the military and working closely with police on many occassions I would suggest that your'e wide of the mark by some distance. Now working in IT, I am also well aware of how sharp the IT tools are compared to your average PC...stones in glass houses my friend..

Please tell us how many times an unarmed civilian has been shot by an armed policeman in the past 5 years - I think you'll be surprised at how few the number actually is. As per my last post, if someone thinks that it is prudent to have a table leg mascurading as a gun under their jacket then they probably deserve a 9mm...

In certain military circles there is a degree of sceptisism about the training firearms police have, but I for one am glad that when I go to heathrow or get on the tube there are police officers prepared to risk life and limb for my safety and able to walk the walk if neccessary with firearms to protect our liberties. When terrorists pose a threat, unfortunately a truncheon and handcuffs may not be enough....

[codprawn]

Originally Posted by donutsina911

In certain military circles there is a degree of sceptisism about the training firearms police have, but I for one am glad that when I go to heathrow or get on the tube there are police officers prepared to risk life and limb for my safety and able to walk the walk if neccessary with firearms to protect our liberties. When terrorists pose a threat, unfortunately a truncheon and handcuffs may not be enough....

Have you ever stopped to wonder WHY we now have a terrorist threat that didn't exsist a few years ago???

[Jono]

Originally Posted by Nate

Jono - someone should have told you the old adage about keeping silent and being thought a fool being better than speaking out and removing all doubt.

I was being ironic. I'll explain that in a pm if you like...

I rather suspect that you would be better employed spending your time learning how to interpret and express "Irony" yourself. You might also want to check out the definition of “sarcasm”. If your previous post was anything other than mindless drivel it appeared to be, then it can only have been sarcasm, not irony… or was I not paying attention to my English teacher all those years ago?… Old age.. it’s a wonderful thing
As for your reference to the, often misquoted, adage I feel you have proven it quite adequately all on your own.

Before you leap in, PD, I know it’s a split infinitive… so "go do one"..

[Nate]

Jono - calm down. At your age an embolism or stroke could easily result from such high blood pressure.

Knowing your preferences I suggest you:

(1) Get Donuts round and watch all your old Rambo films together
(2) Whack off looking at pictures of the latest Ruger P97DAO - .45ACP in Guns and Ammo
(3) Put on your gimp suit and ask your boyfriend if you can play with his trucheon

[Jono]

Originally Posted by Nate

Jono - calm down. At your age an embolism or stroke could easily result from such high blood pressure.

Knowing your preferences I suggest you:

(1) Get Donuts round and watch all your old Rambo films together
(2) Whack off looking at pictures of the latest Ruger P97DAO - .45ACP in Guns and Ammo
(3) Put on your gimp suit and ask your boyfriend if you can play with his trucheon

QED..

[donutsina911]

Originally Posted by codprawn

Have you ever stopped to wonder WHY we now have a terrorist threat that didn't exsist a few years ago???

yep, and it's got bugger all to do with the police having firearms.

[eupa]

Originally Posted by codprawn
Have you ever stopped to wonder WHY we now have a terrorist threat that didn't exsist a few years ago???


Codders - the met were armed a long time ago- but not all of them ( 1930-1949)- as pertoday
It has nothing to do with my friends Bush and Blair- they only reacted to idiots smashing planes into buildings- they did not start it.
You must undrstand that when you go out to kill 3000+innocent people - the reaction is pretty predicable.So stop ranting on about Blair creating terroism - it realy shows a lack of intelligence or are we beginning to see the "real" codders. There is a war on friend and not many people realize it...

Jonathan

[codprawn]

Originally Posted by eupa

Originally Posted by codprawn
Have you ever stopped to wonder WHY we now have a terrorist threat that didn't exsist a few years ago???


Codders - the met were armed a long time ago- but not all of them ( 1930-1949)- as pertoday
It has nothing to do with my friends Bush and Blair- they only reacted to idiots smashing planes into buildings- they did not start it.
You must undrstand that when you go out to kill 3000+innocent people - the reaction is pretty predicable.So stop ranting on about Blair creating terroism - it realy shows a lack of intelligence or are we beginning to see the "real" codders. There is a war on friend and not many people realize it...

Jonathan

Britain always USED to have good relations with the Middle East - I should know having lived there. British people were treated with respect - the Yanks weren't.

One of these reasons is the blind support the USA gives Israel. Another is the sheer arrogance with which they treat other people.

Before Sept 11th you could walk into any Irish bar in New York and find an IRA collection box. The USA did not seem to mind the word terrorism and did not seem to care that British people were being blown to bits by the IRA.

The USA suffered a terrible blow with Sept 11th - a blow struck by Osama Bin Laden - Al Queda.

The USA was mortally wounded - what is more so was it's pride - a superpower rendered impotent. They had to lash out - get revenge.

Where does Iraq come into all this? You tell me! They had NOTHING to do with Al Queda and nothing to do with the Sept 11th attacks. The USA persued Osama and failed - they still needed to lash out so all of a sudden WMD become the main focus.

Becuase of Tony Blair's BLIND support of George Bush we have alienated the majority of Arabs and put ourselves in the same position as the USA - a position we did NOT need to be in!!!

The attacks in London seen recently have been as a direct result of this policy - the attacks were carried out in the NAME of Al Queda rather than BY Al Queda. Compared to what Britain had to face with the IRA these attacks have been very poorly organised - if they had PROPER backing they would NOT have been mucking about with home made explosives!!!

There is more fuss and hysteria being generated now than when the IRA were detonating 4 TON bombs!!!

[eupa]

One of these reasons is the blind support the USA gives Israel. Another is the sheer arrogance with which they treat other people.

Well "perfideous Albion" let them down quite a bit........Thank god for the US
The UK were too intent of pleasing the Arabs and they came up with solutions that were - to say the least un-acceptable for all parties- look at what they did to Larwence- the only guy around then who could have come up with an acceptable Middle East solution.

Anyway whats the betting that the Israelies 'settle" the irananians before you can say "shalom"--- that's when it starts to get interesting and a bible prophecy will be fulfilled...... Kindly explain with your Arab leanings ,why the president of Iran did'nt seem to mince his words

jonathan

[Jono]

Originally Posted by codprawn

Britain always USED to have good relations with the Middle East - I should know having lived there. British people were treated with respect - the Yanks weren't.

Don't make the error of mistaking subservience for respect...


..and did we always have "good relations" with "The Middle East" ? Examples off the top of my head are Aden.. then what about Iran? I don’t think you can say we always had “good relations”. What we had was/is relations with people who needed us and whom we needed….