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Old 03 December 2005, 09:52   #21
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Quote:
Originally Posted by paul tilley
in my humble opinion the best build quality of hulls is normally from the smaller manufacturer as are all of the uk rib builders but you will always get rogue (no offence stu)manufacturers like the one who used to use chipboard for the transom !!! ps riva where did the statistics come from the number of ribs built in the uk seems very high
Probably most of them being Avon.
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Old 03 December 2005, 12:30   #22
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Cookee, Paul I agree with what you are saying.

I don't know what your workload is but consider if you had to build say five hulls/tubes for the same order, would it be more or less cost effevtive for you to do so and would the quality standards be easier or harder to maintain.

I am not counting the costs of developing the mould or tube patterns as they would have already been done, I am just thinking of the production costs/effort
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Old 03 December 2005, 13:18   #23
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Rogue Wave
I know what a chopper gun is and no i wouldn't want a boat produced by that method. As there is no real bonding between the layers of Mat.

I'd have to believe however that using proper laminating techniques on more of a production line basis might lead to some economy of scale leading to leading to a reduced COQ to the manufacturer and then hopefully the customer.
i agree to a point with what you say regarding the Chopper guns, but a lot of it depends on what specification of resin is used..... for any success in spray laminate, the use of low styrene emission resin is a no no!(surface wax preventing the toxic styrene escaping into the atmosphere) but i know from personal experience that certain high volume manufacturers use it due to styrene emissions and curing properties.....

However.... the same can be said for hand-layup techniques, but at least with hand layup there is a lot more control over the moulding being produced, but then is more time consuming...........

IMO Hand layup is far more reliable in the right hands!
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Old 03 December 2005, 13:22   #24
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well that's gud enuff for me! but how aboiut my other question
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Old 03 December 2005, 13:29   #25
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Rogue Wave
well that's gud enuff for me! but how aboiut my other question
what other Q?
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Old 03 December 2005, 13:48   #26
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Gav
i agree to a point with what you say regarding the Chopper guns, but a lot of it depends on what specification of resin is used..... for any success in spray laminate, the use of low styrene emission resin is a no no!(surface wax preventing the toxic styrene escaping into the atmosphere) but i know from personal experience that certain high volume manufacturers use it due to styrene emissions and curing properties.....

However.... the same can be said for hand-layup techniques, but at least with hand layup there is a lot more control over the moulding being produced, but then is more time consuming...........

IMO Hand layup is far more reliable in the right hands!
You didn't point out that woven cloth is a tad difficult to build with when using a chopper, or that the resin/fibre ratio is all bollix using chopper.....or that a chopper gun is far more 'unreliable' in the wrong hands.

Searay build quality is about as good as their speedo's accuracy!

gold plastic edging pushed on the edges of chipboard, anywhere thats not easily visible has the shabbyest workmanship known to man!

As for "state of the art hermatically controlled factories where perfect conditions are maintained for GRP production" Well it doesn't seem to reflect in the boats.

All IMHO
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Old 03 December 2005, 14:10   #27
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Gav
what other Q?
It's in the bit you highlighted!

I'd have to believe however that using proper laminating techniques on more of a production line basis might lead to some economy of scale leading to leading to a reduced COQ to the manufacturer and then hopefully the customer.

Id be interested in hearing the views of Gav, Steve the boat, TD, Leeway or Bryn? (trio) about it and indeed the toobers

Having read it agin it might seem i was asking your views on the Chopper Gun but I was asking about how things pan out when you are making a run of product
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Old 03 December 2005, 16:06   #28
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Originally Posted by Mollulnan
How many Searays have you two owned?!!
I have to admit that I've never owned one, but thats because I've had the pleasure of repairing a few of them and I haven't been very impressed with the build quality.

Chipboard and mdf doesn't have a place in a boat, but that doesn't seem to stop these superior american built craft from using it in their construction! Mind you, if you only expect the boat to be used in a puddle, you'd probably expect to get away with it!

And as for chopper guns, being used by a mexican on $5.00 an hour, stuff that!
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Old 03 December 2005, 17:03   #29
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Originally Posted by Dirk Diggler
And as for chopper guns, being used by a mexican on $5.00 an hour, stuff that!
Yeah but don't forget that mexican is working in a:... "state of the art hermatically controlled factory where perfect conditions are maintained for GRP production"
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Old 04 December 2005, 05:00   #30
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stu small production runs of the same tube would give a very small cost saving in materials on curved tubes but not sectional ones and possibly a small labour saving ,it should also help to increase the quality of that product as you become more familliar with it but could also cause workers to become to familliar and try to make shortcuts and lower the quality . the most important thing that i have tried to install into all of my employees past and present is to get it right first time if not you will be taking apart and redoing it not quite so easy with fibreglass though !!!
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