What best 20hp Short Shaft Recoil Tiller?

simmcgil · 04 February 2018, 16:52

Hi

I am starting to look for a new 20hp Four Stroke and not sure what to go for.

I am looking at the Suzuki 20hp Short Shaft Lean Burn, but would like to get other peoples ideas before i take the plunge

Thanks

Simon

Arctic · 04 February 2018, 17:37

How critcal is weight? I have heard good things about Tohatsu's latest 20hp outboard and have had good experiences with both Yamaha and Honda.

All else being equal, I'd probably go with the most customer friendly dealer nearby.

Fenlander · 04 February 2018, 17:52

This has been thrashed through quite recently...

http://www.rib.net/forum/f50/outboard-help-77744.html

Simple answer if you value weight and/or modern tech then it's the Suzuki or Tohatsu. If those aspects aren't important then you have all the major makers to choose from.

The aspect of nearest servicing dealer is important if you intent to keep the warranty 100%.

Look forward to hearing how you like the Highfield, they don't suit my current use but might one day.

jeffstevens763@g · 04 February 2018, 19:01

A close service agent a must it cost me a grand in lost time and fuel running back and forward to sort a problem last year. any of the big names, I like my Suzy and the two before it

simmcgil · 04 February 2018, 20:17

Fenlander, Ill get you an update shortly, saying that took her out with my Mariner 15 and got up to 19mph but was pretty calm and just me on board, hence the reason I'm looking for a 20. Will be me plus one other and gear so could do with the extra punch.

Think i basically want either the Tohatsu or the Suzuki 20, both around the same price and weight don't know what one is better. I had a look at the link re outboard help but seemed to turn into rants about contamination in tanks and didn't really answer / provide assistance about what engine to go for in the end.

I also guess going from a 2 stroke where its dead easy to service to a 4 stroke, I want to make sure i can service it myself and not have to pay fortunes for 4 stroke servicing.

I also want to be able tow the boat with the engine on the transom, so hopefully the engines have some sort of catch to keep up out of the way of the road surface otherwise i don't fancy lugging 44kg each time i goo away somewhere.

Anyway assistance would be appreciated on 2018 Tohatsu v Suzuki

69cmw · 04 February 2018, 20:39

Quote:

Originally Posted by Fenlander

This has been thrashed through quite recently...

http://www.rib.net/forum/f50/outboard-help-77744.html

Simple answer if you value weight and/or modern tech then it's the Suzuki or Tohatsu. If those aspects aren't important then you have all the major makers to choose from.

The aspect of nearest servicing dealer is important if you intent to keep the warranty 100%.

Look forward to hearing how you like the Highfield, they don't suit my current use but might one day.

Fenlander

Is there much difference performance wise between the 15hp 2 stroke and the 20hp 4 stroke on your Aerotec?

Fenlander · 04 February 2018, 21:23

>>>Is there much difference performance wise between the 15hp 2 stroke and the 20hp 4 stroke on your Aerotec?

In truth not as much ultimate speed but a worthwhile improvement in midrange grunt. When conditions are difficult I like to be able to "work" the waves on and off the plane as appropriate. We carry a fairly heavy load of people/fuel/kit/dog and the 15hp was a little marginal in this circumstance.

If my use were just solo or adult plus lighter passenger then the 15hp would have been fine and I probably wouldn't have swapped.

Fenlander · 04 February 2018, 21:38

>>>Anyway assistance would be appreciated on 2018 Tohatsu v Suzuki

I don't think you will find anyone who has used both on the same craft to compare. But the basics are they both have similar battery-less EFI 2cyl motors and weigh within 1kg of each other (Tohatsu the lightest).

I would expect their performance to be near identical and fuel consumption very similar so if it were me choosing now I'd look at dealer distance, price and then look at them for the very small details that might be important to you. Such as which way they can be put down to travel, convenience of carry handle, tilt operation, gearchange position etc.

Re servicing there is more work in the 4-stroke but it is all straight forward if you are methodical. See this thread where I detailed the first yearly service on my Suzuki...

http://www.rib.net/forum/f36/suzuki-...ice-75209.html

Fenlander · 04 February 2018, 21:51

Just had a look at this guy's video of the Tohatsu...

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=6X6Sr2nWhNU

Better carry handle than the Suzuki and it has a spin on oil filter which looks a little easier to swap than my element.

Had a look at the Tohatsu makers web page for the 20. I noticed they say the max pitch prop available is a 10"... I'd check that out as while a 10" is ideal for our combo you may find if you have a lighter load and with that efficient hard hull an 11" might suit better.

office888 · 05 February 2018, 21:11

Mercury just released a new 15/20hp.

99 lb, EFI (~45 kg).
Adjustable tiller (centered or offset with direction, vertical also adjustable)

Fenlander · 05 February 2018, 22:09

Thanks for mentioning that Office.... I'd not seen that was coming out. Seems it is the Tohatsu powerhead and leg with different clothes and a more advanced tiller.

https://www.mercurymarine.com/en/us/...roke/15-20-hp/

The idea of a centre tiller that swivels to give an offset to either side for operation from either side of the boat is interesting... particularly the ability to reverse the throttle rotation direction. Perhaps a little over complex for something in the 20hp class though??

So that will just leave Yamaha with a carb model.

A brilliant video on the Mercury here... looks like they have put some real thought into the detail... and they still give you a sensible 25l fuel tank.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=NxsHNBCQ9wE

SixtyNorth · 06 February 2018, 07:52

What about the Honda 20hp, isn't that still a carb. model or have they also switched to EFI?

Fenlander · 06 February 2018, 08:20

Oh yes... for no good reason I'd forgotten Honda.

chipko · 06 February 2018, 15:52

Great to see more choice at last in the lightweight 20hp EFI class.
Loved our Suzuki, which performed faultlessly over the three years we ran it. My only criticism being the slightly off beat vibration at tick over. I'm sure all 20hp motors develop similar power, but it's how the power is delivered, which is where one of the benefits of efi comes in.

The Tohatsu and Mercury are so new (rumors are the Merc lands in UK dealers Mar/Apr) that as yet there are no real life comparisons with the Suzuki. I would hazard performance/quality/reliability will be very similar.

Not seen one in the flesh yet but rather like the chiseled lines of the Mercury cowling. The central adjustable tiller also looks interesting although probably contributes to the 2kg weight penalty over the Tohatsu.

A nice feature on both these new kids is the built in drainable fuel/water separator under the hood. Personally never had any fuel issues, but a potential injector/money saver if the worst happens. In fact the other thread degenerated into a contaminated fuel rant and efi perceived stupid on any portable motors. I do hope this didn't put the op off as these new efi's have many benefits over previous generation motors including lighter weight, improved power delivery and fuel consumption.

I only have experience with the Suzuki, which I couldn't really fault, but any of these should be great on your Highfield CL380

Fenlander · 07 February 2018, 11:50

>>>our Suzuki, which performed faultlessly over the three years we ran it. My only criticism being the slightly off beat vibration at tick over.

Seems this is inherent in these 20hp 4-strokes as I see at 37sec and 3m.48sec of the Mercury video the engine vibrates a fair amount at tickover... but Mercury seem to have gone for a softer powerhead isolation as this vibration seems to reach the tiller less than with the Suzuki (a feature Mercury mention in their brochure).

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=NxsHNBCQ9wE

simmcgil · 07 February 2018, 18:14

Hey thanks all

Decisions decisions, i had a look at a Yam 20hp but it was carburettor version and 52kg but think the fact that Fenlander has so kindly provided the service information for the Suzuki, i may go down that route!

Im getting a really good price for the engine and because I will flush out the engine after salt water use, it should last well.

Thanks for everyones advise / input

Fenlander · 07 February 2018, 19:05

Whatever you get do report back how you get on with it.

SixtyNorth · 07 February 2018, 19:38

Yamaha's latest 25hp looks good... EFI and about 56kg. Hopefully they bring out a new and lighter 20hp soon with EFI too. I suspect Honda will do the same, sooner or later.

beamishken · 08 February 2018, 06:11

[QUOTE=chipko;765796]Great to see more choice at last in the lightweight 20hp EFI class.
Loved our Suzuki, which performed faultlessly over the three years we ran it. My only criticism being the slightly off beat vibration at tick over. I'm sure all 20hp motors develop similar power, but it's how the power is delivered, which is where one of the benefits of efi comes in.

A two cylinder 4 stroke will always be inherently imbalanced as it needs to run a 2 up cylinder configuration to get it firing every revolution so both pistons are heading in the Same direction at the Same time. Whereas a 2 stroke will run 1 up 1 down so the pistons are heading in opposite directions balancing each other out.
The need for a 2 up configuration usually necessitates a balance shaft which adds weight.
An hpdi 2 cyl 2 stroke will be far smoother than a 2 cyl 4 stroke

jezza101 · 08 February 2018, 07:00

Definitely keep in mind where abouts your nearest dealer is. Because warranty issues can occur and can be costly if you have to travel back to the dealer.

In terms of weight and modern tech I’ve heard awesome things about tohatsu and Suzuki. However for something nice and basic I currently have a little Honda that works like magic.
Jez