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Old 30 January 2014, 12:16   #41
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Originally Posted by Pikey Dave View Post

So reading a report of an actual incident where people died, including an 8yr old, would have little effect, whereas a load of bumf would Make your mind up Squire
I ment the fact the report exists will have little effect.
Who will read the report???
Only the already responsible pepole will look it up.
However if the report came though my door with my papers for my new boat. I would have more chance of reading it.

The education needs to be done in an inclusive way that gets to everyone.
I don't know how this would be best done, just suggesting possibles.
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Old 30 January 2014, 12:46   #42
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There are usually only two of us in the boat. Reading that report has made me think seriously about fitting another kill switch for the passenger.
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Old 30 January 2014, 13:30   #43
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Without wanting a huge debate on kill cords as I suspect that most on here are in agreement - isn't the technology a bit out of date now? We are relying on something being connected by the driver and the boat can run without it... even my lawnmower has a button to be depressed at all times - and it stops otherwise... from pressure pads on the driver's seat to a foot pedal held down, sensors on the steering wheel to detect no hand on it - etc. - plenty of options for actively detecting that someone is driving the boat which would remove this discussion / issue once and for all... boats are potentially dangerous and assumptions are made by owners... some safety just should be built in...

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Old 30 January 2014, 13:58   #44
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Brings back how tragic this was. The report can be read in several ways but my opinions are as follows

I don't believe Mr Milligan was aware no kill cord was being used, the report suggests he left the helm to go to stern (I assume to untie from the pontoon) whilst his wife went to the helm to prevent kids from hitting the throttle, not fitting kill cord as she wasn't expecting to drive, just protect. They then proceeded to return to mooring, from personal experience I can imagine a scenario where she offered it back and perhaps he said "no you take us in darling", him still unaware no kill cord was connected and her forgetting to fit. Obviously they then changed their mind and wanted one last blast.

During this fateful manoeuvre perhaps he might not have been "reckless" as other posts suggest in doing this extreme turn, maybe he was trying to take avoiding action to prevent hitting the beach, as his wife had became concerned by. This wasn't a family being wreck-less, or at least not intentionally, they had all the gear, undertaken training, previous boating experience etc etc. They were not the typical "boy racer" we usually lambast on here.

The manufacturer used a way (completely legal) to increase the HP rating using different legislation. What could have been rated to 303hp in one way, was rated to 453 using another. Something which has been advised as requiring action to clarify in the report summary.

The hull design had been highlighted as a concern previously.

My final observation is regarding the lack of kill cord use. It appears to be more common with RIB users than other watercraft. The report highlighted several fatal incidents, all RIB related. Perhaps this is more of an issue with the kind of people who use RIBS (with higher consequences due to the type of boat) more than other boats. Just like we all moan at Jet Ski's for driving crazy, speed boats for no life jackets, yachties for everything etc.

Just my thoughts.

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Old 30 January 2014, 13:59   #45
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Interesting read on a very tragic set of curcumstances..

I amazed how many people I see in sports boats with children / adults not wearing bouyancy aids lifejackets or kill cords.. especially when the sun is out!!


I have a feeling those people wont be the likes of people doing rya courses, reading these kind of websites or even accident reports!

As someone else said somewhere.. some of the boat manufacturers can also learn from this by making sure those glamorous marketing pictures show people wearing kill cords wearing life jacketd etc.

Marinas and slipways should have big signs reminding users...

Granted if someone is going to go out without a kill cord on it doesnt matter how many reminders there are they will do it anyway..
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Old 30 January 2014, 14:37   #46
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Interesting read on a very tragic set of curcumstances..

I amazed how many people I see in sports boats with children / adults not wearing bouyancy aids lifejackets or kill cords.. especially when the sun is out!!

I have a feeling those people wont be the likes of people doing rya courses, reading these kind of websites or even accident reports!

As someone else said somewhere.. some of the boat manufacturers can also learn from this by making sure those glamorous marketing pictures show people wearing kill cords wearing life jacketd etc.

Marinas and slipways should have big signs reminding users...

Granted if someone is going to go out without a kill cord on it doesnt matter how many reminders there are they will do it anyway..
I agree Paul. They won't be reading this or looking at all.
Slipway signs about kill cord is a good idea. They should say wear a life jacket too!
There is one on the slip at lymington!

But I bet many people don't even know how a kill cord works or what it's for. Especially if the cord is missing off there control box.
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Old 30 January 2014, 14:51   #47
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As someone else said somewhere.. some of the boat manufacturers can also learn from this by making sure those glamorous marketing pictures show people wearing kill cords wearing life jacketd etc.

..
There is a drive for manufacturers to show safe skippering with images of lifejackets being worn and kill cords too as standard in all their promotional literature.

This needs to go further , it wont take anyone long to find images of VIPs on RIBs being taken out to Yachts or runs out for media piccies in the UK, so their logos get seen with these individuals, and none will wear lifejackets and some are linked to RYA as their top sailors!!

RYA are now as we seen releasing safety briefs, it needs to go to everything they do and have links with up to all levels

Long road ahead and I really hope we dont see another tragedy such as this
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Old 30 January 2014, 15:11   #48
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Interesting though all of the discussion of handbooks, boat handling, grab handles, alcohol consumption etc is - at the core of this incident is the use of the kill cord.
But actually the kill cord should have been the FINAL line of defence. I think sometimes people forget that - a boat design which doesn't flip you out, a helming style/approach which makes it less likely to fall over, well positioned occupants with secure handles etc. are the first line of defence. S**t does happen, and kill cords save lives (as you know well) but simply blaming the kill cord is ignoring several other opportunities to avoid or reduce the risk.
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Old 30 January 2014, 15:23   #49
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But actually the kill cord should have been the FINAL line of defence. I think sometimes people forget that - a boat design which doesn't flip you out, a helming style/approach which makes it less likely to fall over, well positioned occupants with secure handles etc. are the first line of defence. S**t does happen, and kill cords save lives (as you know well) but simply blaming the kill cord is ignoring several other opportunities to avoid or reduce the risk.
+1 agreed.
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Old 30 January 2014, 15:27   #50
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Without wanting a huge debate on kill cords as I suspect that most on here are in agreement - isn't the technology a bit out of date now? We are relying on something being connected by the driver and the boat can run without it... even my lawnmower has a button to be depressed at all times - and it stops otherwise... from pressure pads on the driver's seat to a foot pedal held down, sensors on the steering wheel to detect no hand on it - etc. - plenty of options for actively detecting that someone is driving the boat which would remove this discussion / issue once and for all... boats are potentially dangerous and assumptions are made by owners... some safety just should be built in...

Alasdair
Very difficult to keep pressure on the seats or a foot plate when jumping waves. I can see problems occurring possibly.
Can't see how you would remove the issue, as said.

The kill cord does it job fine when used correctly or at all.
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