Future of RIB racing?

Adam Younger · 21 March 2005, 07:25

Where is RIB racing going? It seems a bit worrying when you look at how entries for racing have declined over recent years and I believe 2005 will see less boats again.

Recently F1 and F3 classes have all but disappeared and BIBOA is not hosting any races.

What needs to be done - or is there no longer the demand for RIB racing?

Rogue Wave · 21 March 2005, 08:41

we wnt through this to some degree over on boatmad a while ago.

For my money ( and there aint a lot of it) apart from the thrill of racing it hardly seems worth the expense because of the escalating costs and politics.

I understand theat Gareth in R22 isn't racing this year mostly cos of the politics, he has got to be a loss to the sport and the beer tent!

It would appear to me as an outside observer that you have to do something to bring capture the Hearts and Minds of possible contendersand to make an easy in for them to the sport.

it would appear that the 4 stroke series is well represented and also Zapcats have more competitors than they can shake a stick at. I believe it's because both those series come under the perception of affordable fun with a degree of cameraderie ( yeah I know it's an alien world to racing).

maybe the answer is for some enterprising designer/builder/racer to design an entry level racing rib similar in concept to the Old Tohatsu one deign. It could be called the K3 or the BananaTuna or something like entry level Racing rib,

Alan Priddy · 24 March 2005, 15:35

Having basicaly started the RIB Racing in 1990 I am saddened that it has been destroyed by the "Profesional " organisers. In the early days it was not uncommon to get up to 50 boats on the start line. This was due to cost effective entry fees, a good offshore challenging course and as little rules as possible.No one got injured or killed and everyone had a good time.Against my advice the sport was aligned to the RYA. Promises of better racing and treatment have never been delivered and in general all they did was piss the competitor off resulting in a massive down turn. This was the death nail for the sport.
BIBOA should re-take RIB racing under it's own rules and insurance cover and not have anything to do with the RYA. Alan P

thorper · 24 March 2005, 18:52

Alan

Is starting a new series outside of the RYA something BIBOA will/would contemplate? If they are not bothered, we could always start a cheap series open to a wider range of boats... thoughts anyone?

Not being in the rib scene in 1990, what kind of boats raced back then (hull types, length, engine etc) and what kind of courses did they run?

Ricky

Pete7 · 24 March 2005, 20:44

Ricky it all started with a couple of Round Scotland events, the first I think was 91 which Diver Magazine kindly called "Wacky Races" and then promptly had to apologise for.

The organisers where Richard Freer and the late Michael Alexander (who was inprisioned in Colditz) http://www.guardian.co.uk/obituaries...388081,00.html
along with Alan and according to my files Hugo Montgomery-Swan, Tony Lee-Elliott and Mike Southward. Have a lot of time for the last two.

Michael and Richard both in there 70s

at the time had circumnavigated the highland and Islands of Scotland via the Caledonian Canal the year before in a 4m rib without any back up stopping each night as the sun fell. they came up with the idea of an adventurous race with Ribs to bring tourists up to the highlands and raise a bit of publicity. BIBOA was also formed about this time but I don't know who came up with the idea.

Following the success of the 91 race the event was staged again in Jun 92. Two courses were set. One doing the highland and Islands circumnavigation via the canal and some of the larger boats doing Greenock to Edinburgh. Alan also timed his round Great Britian event to co-inside with the race and met us half way through the week, staying with the fleet (and a huge party in Port Edgar Nr Edinburgh) before carrying on South to Portsmouth.

The 91 race had bad weather and a horendous time getting round Ardmurchan but we breezed round at 26 knots. however our time was to come when we hit a F6 all the way from Cape Wrath to Scrabster. Most of us were divers as everyone had dump valves on there dry suits and a few ribs still sporting bottle racks. they ranged from 5 - 7m and engines from 60 hp to 2x200hp. A not so young Charles Dyas (of Delta fame) came along with a superb diesel rib and was the savour of the day when he jumped from his rib into an unmanned rib that had lost its crew but carried on at 35 knots and stopped a disaster happening. the rib was going due North from the top of Scotland at the time.

Following the sucesses in North Scotland and Alans Round GB trip other races including NI, IOM and the solent were run, BIBOA took on a strong committee and organised races and cruises. The club had a strong membership that would go anywhere for a party.

Team spirit was strong but competitors would bend over to help each other. Having left Paul Lemmer and his crew from Barrus alone on a beach on the West Coast of Scotland with no obvious way up the cliffs and no one within 50 miles he appeared in Scrabster later that evening, however the BWM had snapped her transom. Mike Armatage from Osprey and a direct competitor in the rib market asked his fibreglassers Ralph and Mike Williamson to work through the night in a local scouts hut to fix the boat and with the assistance of a local welder fabricated a strong transom brace which was glassed in and by 9am the following morning the boat was back inthe water ready to race. How many of todays racers would do that

Sadly as predicted by Tony Lee-Elliot the rules were changed and the majority of the prizes went to the big boats with big engines and costs. The smaller boats dropped out because we couldn't compete and BIBOA handed over control to the RYA.

I agree with Alan, stuff the RYA, BIBOA should organise it themselves. Start with a small affordable class (90 hp ?) with any sort and size of rib and lets see what designs people come up with without weight or size restrictions. Stuff the need for expensive licences that just lines the RYA pockets and keep the other rules simple. I still have the 92 rules if anyone needs a copy, they worked then for a race through some of the remotest parts of Europe, I am sure they will work for a round the IOW race

Pete

The Jackeens · 24 March 2005, 22:29

Very interesting post Pete

missus

bogib · 24 March 2005, 23:09

Would be best going back to the basics.

Bogi

Rogue Wave · 25 March 2005, 19:08

Nice one Pete and guys. the answers is definitely in here somewhere Adam.

but whatever the answer is it's gotta be cost efective and even handed! So the Central Scrootinizers are gonna be popular

ribraff · 25 March 2005, 19:34

I'd be very interested in playing a part in a race series in some way, i think a 90 hp series would be great, affordable and if the rules were simple even better, my brother and I would love to race although we have no previous experience.
Maybe we could club together with a hull manufacturer to supply a basic race rib package?

Rogue Wave · 25 March 2005, 19:38

well you know more Hull manufaturers than most people on te Forum....get on with it!

ribraff · 25 March 2005, 20:12

Well, i'll look into that part, who would be up for organising the racing though?

Rogue Wave · 25 March 2005, 21:00

theres plenty of organisers around, you might even think about gettin an event company to organise it if BIBOA wont

Alan Priddy · 27 March 2005, 12:13

From the responce on this thread I will put good money down that BIBOA will take take over RIB racing again but not untill next year. as Pete 7 rightly said, "It was all in the best possible taste" the problem is that when the Proffesionals and hangers on took over it all went to crap. I was the only one to oppose BIBOA joining the RYA and insisted we kept racing under our own control. It is my intention to turn the clock back, allow any boat to race and let everyone have fun. It is unlikely there will be a one class series as this is not in keeping with the freedom of the sport. In the history of BIBOA we have never had an safety incident and the only complaint we ever had was when someone wen down the Calidionian Canal too fast. I will need support.
To organise a series of, shall we say, "canonball races" will need one main ingrediant, Competitors. The biggest outlay is going to be for the insurance cover. THIS HAS TO BE FUNDED and can only be funded by the competitor/enterant. It is my view that once we get the fun back into the sport the price will be a secondary matter. BIBOA are holding a committe meeting in May where I will outline a plan for 2006. This will include a full cruising series as this is where RIB racing came from. Someone once said" A RIB Cruise can be like a race but without the rules.

slimtim · 27 March 2005, 18:02

A small affordable race series sounds fantastic. Something along the lines of zapcat racing...affordable, open to all, few restrictions, small tight races, friendly atmosphere etc. I would love to get involved in racing and I plan to start zapcat racing sometime after I have finished uni, but a small RIB series sounds great. If I had a 90hp on my shakey I reckon it would be a half decent boat for the job, small and fast. Small boats that could also be easily used for leisure boating would be good. Perhaps with an inline double jockey for driver and navigator...hhhmm, might have a go at designing that!

Adam, perhaps you could design a suitable one design hull (although I guess you already have one with the K4+ 6.5m). If as many people buy them as have done with zapcats, you could be on to a winner!

I'm keeping one eye on this thread

Cheers

Tim

Adam Younger · 27 March 2005, 19:51

Quote:

Originally Posted by slimtim

A small affordable race series sounds fantastic. Something along the lines of zapcat racing...affordable, open to all, few restrictions, small tight races, friendly atmosphere etc. I would love to get involved in racing and I plan to start zapcat racing sometime after I have finished uni, but a small RIB series sounds great. If I had a 90hp on my shakey I reckon it would be a half decent boat for the job, small and fast. Small boats that could also be easily used for leisure boating would be good. Perhaps with an inline double jockey for driver and navigator...hhhmm, might have a go at designing that!

Adam, perhaps you could design a suitable one design hull (although I guess you already have one with the K4+ 6.5m). If as many people buy them as have done with zapcats, you could be on to a winner!

I'm keeping one eye on this thread

Cheers

Tim

Hi Tim
We would love to be involved with a RIB class - although I don't think a one design class is really the way to go. Certainly an economical class and our 6.5 would fit the bill really well.

Maybe around 115hp - economical but still giving good performance. As a company we might even be interested in sponsoring a championship (to some extent) based on this type of class!

The one thing I think is essential for RIB racing is that boats are still useable outside racing. I would not allow tandem seat race specials. Perhaps RIB racing needs to combine races with cruises / long distance passages / predicted logs etc.

Just my thoughts.
Adam

tim griffin · 27 March 2005, 20:56

So something like a standard production leisure rib with say a 150 hp would be one class or would you do by boat length and engine size for the different classes.

bogib · 27 March 2005, 21:03

As I recall from the early days ideas was to have few classes based on length/hp range so basically they would have sort of similar speed and the race would be mainly up to the drivers and his navigator sort of the one design has become of our days.

This would be the way to go for I have somewhere proposals of rules from the early days of BIBOA but question where did I place it.

As I have not been member of BIBOA for quite some time now I am just wondering whether it had to go through them or perhaps we should look into forming a comitte to make agenda/stratig plans.

Bogi

bogib · 27 March 2005, 22:15

Seems to be my lucky day as I found copy of BIBOA´s racing rules from January 1994.

To give you an idea classes was as follows:

Class: Single petrol - Twin petrol
inboards & outboards - inboards & outboards

A: up to & incl 60 hp - up to & incl 2 x 40 hp
B: up to & incl 100 hp - up to & incl 2 x 65 hp
C: up to & incl 150 hp - up to & incl 2 x 100 hp
D: up to & incl 200 hp - up to & incl 2 x 130 hp
E: up to & incl 300 hp - up to & incl 2 x 200 hp
F: above 300 hp - above 2 x 200 hp
Diesel 1: up to 7,5 metres - unlimited hp
Diesel 2: over 7,5 metres - unlimited hp

Bogi

DepSol · 28 March 2005, 07:14

I would be quite happy to help to organise an event in Guernsey. We could either keep it in Guernsey or make it a round robin race which includes Alderney France and Jersey.

I would be happy to try to find sponsorship and subsidised travel to keep the costs down. I am not a member of Biboa but happy if thats the way it should go to join to help make this happen.

This is a good idea and needs to happen.

Dom

ribraff · 28 March 2005, 08:51

I would organise a south west race/cruise leg.