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Old 25 January 2003, 10:35   #331
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Hey you guys, stop being so beastly to each other.

As this thread has gone off track so much, remember that it's really called BIG RIBS 4 CRAZYHORSE, I thought I would try and redirect it ever so slightly. So, once I've sorted my album, I shall post a few photo's.
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Old 25 January 2003, 10:40   #332
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Dirk its a refrence point for Cabin ribs or the odd members power boat that may have some simmilar qualities to a rib in certain conditions.

Thats what it is,and your right we have gone off track somewhat.

So Lets show you why your power boat has some qualities of a rib but also has limitations in comparison to a rib.

What stability criteria has your power boat?Point one?
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Old 25 January 2003, 10:47   #333
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Sounds like you gone a bit quiet on me there Dirk/Jon?
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Old 25 January 2003, 11:11   #334
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Sorry Crazyhorse, had to go to the loo, I think I might have had a dodgy kebab late last night.

As to the answer to your question, I don't really know. When you say my boat, do you mean my Rib. If you do then you would be better off asking Stavros as he seems up to speed on all things Falcon.

If you mean my Powerboat, then I still don't know the answer. I've owned this boat for a couple of years and I bought it new in Florida. Being American Built and pre 98 it doesn't conform , or have to conform to CE marking.

The Question " what stability criteria" it has is irrelivent, but in laymans terms it currently betters your rib, due to it being in existence whilst yours appears to be still on the drawing board.

Now I know that you can quote loads of figures and calculations to me, but only when you get the rib in the water will all that info become fact.

Out of interest, my boat conforms to the US Coast Guard requirements. which in my opinion outperform any requirements that the RCD may require.

I do know that later but identical models of my boat meet the neccessary RCD requirements as they are now imported into Europe, and they meet the stability requirements of ISO/DIS 12217 , what ever that is. The also meet, no surpass the Construction requirements of ISO/DIS 12215-5

I believe the manufacturer used the NKIP Classification Bureau in Holland for their testing.

As an aside, it seems that a lot of people mistake what the RCD was instigated for. Safety plays a very small part of it. The real reason was remove barriers to free trade via harmonization in the fields of health, safety, consumer and enviromental protection.

PS, are you still confusing me with Jon Fuller?

PPS, sorry, noticed a couple of spelling mistakes, thought I had better correct them.
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Old 25 January 2003, 11:25   #335
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Ok dirk we will talk about your Experiment with your falcon rib later.

Lets talk power Boat.
Dirk said
I do know that later but identical models of my boat meet the neccessary RCD requirements as they are now imported into Europe, and they meet the stability requirements of ISO/DIS 12217 , what ever that is. The also meet, no surpass the Construction requirements of ISO/DIS 12215-5


1 xWhats ? iso 12215-5 ?

2x Whats ? the identical new imported hull boat called thats imported into Europe as it will have a RCD CE mark?
3x how old is the hull?

4xWhat are the construction standardes for iso 12215-5 that your boat surpases?
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Old 25 January 2003, 11:35   #336
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What am I a boatbuilder?

1) ISO/DIS 12215-5 is I am told the designation for the standard on the construction for small pleasure craft. Apperently you use this standard to calculate the scantlings of the craft. At the time these boats were tested, this standard was still in draft form. Like so many other standards still are.

2) Cigarette

3) Built in 98 for model year 98.

Next question please.
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Old 25 January 2003, 11:47   #337
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Ok Dirk said in answer to.

1X 1 xWhats ? iso 12215-5 ? ) ISO/DIS 12215-5 is I am told the designation for the standard on the construction for small pleasure craft. Apperently you use this standard to calculate the scantlings of the craft. At the time these boats were tested, this standard was still in draft form. Like so many other standards still are.

2x Whats ? the identical new imported hull boat called thats imported into Europe as it will have a RCD CE mark?
Answer = Cigarette Which cigarette is imported by who and what is the CE mark?

3x age of boat hull 98,is this correct when was it imported date?

4x no answer?

5 if you dont now what iso 12215 is how do you no it surpasses it?

6 x Are the standards your boat surpasses implimented today in 2003?

7 xDo you know what happend to iso 12215-5 Cos i do
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Old 25 January 2003, 12:27   #338
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Crazyhorse, this is getting boring, as I said earlier I am not that knowledgable on the RCD requirements.

No doubt that from your previous posts you are surrounded by CE paperwork, reference books etc, and really are quite interested in the subject, but I am just a humble boat owner who enjoys pleasure boating, racing and cruising.

I will try to answer your questions, although I can't imagine why you are so interested in other peoples craft, yet remain so tight lipped about your own. Your not just fantasising are you?

1) What is this standard? I haven't got a clue, but at the time of certification it was relevant

2) It's a 35' Cafe Racer. Cat C I think.

3) It was built in 98, for model year 98 and it arrived in Europe as a personnel import in April 98.

4)There wasn't a question 4 in your original un-edited post. The answer would be rather long and drawn out, and when I get the time I will pm you with it, don't wan't to bore people any more than I am now. In brief it is a standard drawn up by the NIYS having tested and assessed a huge amount of designs.

5) As answered in 1) Haven't got a clue but I was told by the manufacturer.

6) Don't know as it doesn't matter to me. My boat does not have to conform, the current model does, but to what current standard who knows?

7) For all I know it got dropped, or became 12215-6 or something. It was only in draft form when it was used.

8) Oops, there isn't a question 8.

Oh, and before you ask, I don't know what the Downflooding angles or GZ curve is, or what the results of the Manoeuvring tests are.
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Old 25 January 2003, 12:53   #339
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Crazyhorse,
So you've gon and got yourself a new opponent have you?, not very loyal!
what is this thing you have with calling dirk, dirk/jon?

Anyway, I meant to ask you something about your boat the other day, but forgot, ...as your having an ally hull, what are your intentions regarding anti-corrosion, or coatings? inside and out, I know from the racing painting/coating the hull (outside) is a pain, and the norm is to leave the ally bare, if things get a bit scaley or rough (bad news if you want to travel at 100 Knt's) it just gets a bit of treatment with the DA.
When painted/coated, any corrosion that does start through a scratch or damage of some sort, creeps under the coating, lifting it off in nasty blistery things, anyway, i'm going on a bit now, so what are your intentions?
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Old 25 January 2003, 12:55   #340
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Dirk

Thanks for your answers. I believe you think your boat is great and I am not saying it isnt.What Im saying is, that it has certain limitatations like all boats and it is a compromise.

I can say that I was very close to purchasing a similar boat that to yours that Mike Belamey used to race with a big ford running through a surface drive.Finances moved forward so I was able to move on to what i believe is the ultimate cruising vessel for me and my familly.

Your boat is great for what its intended use,Ribs are completly different beasts and have far more offshore stability,ride,safty,features that any power boat can emulate.

Untill you can satify me with a logical argument for Power boat against Rib then we will have to agree to disagree.

I also havnt got the time for indepth analysis as if you want a drawn out boring debate then so be it,take my word on this matter I can demonstrate all I have said.

But as you quite rightly say it will not be a good read,especially as Im not here to take somebodys elses dreams away.


Now then were going to find out why you obviously set up your Falcon rib incorrectly for you to come to your personal conclusions that t was not any good.
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