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Old 25 November 2013, 15:49   #61
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Ok ok ok you got me!!!! I'll pay the 100 thats fair (didn't know that was possible so just tell me where)! It's not all a lie thou! I do own a rib with the other guy and I did learn a lot from chatting to you guys in this forum. Everyone was really helpful so that thanks was genuine. We do use Indulgeon to manage it as well. Indulgeon was designed for aviation which is my background. Lots of similarities to the marine world in that the asset is expensive, the season is short and shared ownership is common. We are now trying to apply it to the marine world. Once I've paid I'll explain some more. Apologies for not being up front about it.
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Old 25 November 2013, 15:52   #62
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You'll find what you are looking for here: RIBnet supporters and Trade members
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Old 25 November 2013, 15:57   #63
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Old 25 November 2013, 16:20   #64
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Old 25 November 2013, 18:01   #65
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All paid and once again apologies! I didn't mean to insult anyone, rather add to the conversation.

So to explain properly and legitimately(!) about what Indulgeon does...

It's a site dedicated to shared ownership, originally aimed at the general aviation where sharing is common due to the expense of the assets and running costs. It's not too dissimilar to the marine world. By sharing with just one other person, everything is half price, less with more members. Purchase price, running costs, maintenance, depreciation everything. The catch.... You have to share!

I've read this thread carefully and I think we answer and solve all the problems that have been discussed which is why I felt it relevant.

We help set up clear legal agreements specific to your group with a specialist solicitor who shares an aircraft himself. The experience then becomes more like a business agreement between members rather than a gentleman's agreement.

As part of this, the solicitor will help form a company for you, ownership is then passed into the company and each co-owner becomes a shareholder in the company. This protects everyone legally and financially.

We then provide you with a calendar with customisable rules within which each member makes bookings. It replicates whole ownership. More on that here . No arguments and no double bookings.

It tracks people's use so people pay for what they use and automatically bills them accordingly. All the finances can be run through Indulgeon which keeps everything open and honest.

Maintenance reminders can be set and placed into the calendar as necessary.

Communication can be done through Indulgeon's messaging system which works just like Facebook.

To find out more about the whole thing, have a read through the pages here and watch the videos. http://www.indulgeon/Discover

Indulgeon does not own any assets and we aren't a management company. We try to offer specialist advice on best practice and all the tools you need to run a successful shared group. Whats more, the basic tools are free. As I said, this is all based on extensive experience in the aviation world where this kind of ownership is embraced and common.

I would sincerely welcome anyones thoughts on what we have created in terms of the site and the concept. Of course if anyone would like more details please don't hesitate to get in touch! We just want to make this fantastic pleasure available to more people by making it more affordable.
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Old 25 November 2013, 18:10   #66
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To be fair, Many sites don't require trade subscription, and who reads the small print anyway, but you've acknowledged it once flagged and paid. Fair cop. Crack on and I hope can add value to the site.
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Old 25 November 2013, 18:17   #67
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If the boat is owned by the company- is any boat usage then classed as a 'leisure' activity, or is it a 'commercial enterprise'.
May not sound an important difference but it is. On the upside,could you buy fuel at trade prices..... On the down side, do you insure as a commercial craft and does the vessel need to be coded and certified as it's not a private craft, but a commercial craft. Subtle, but very important?
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Old 25 November 2013, 18:17   #68
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How does indulgeon make its money then? Do you take a cut of something if not the asset?
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Old 25 November 2013, 18:33   #69
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The solicitor will run through all the implications but our understanding is, as the asset is not being used for reward or any commercial operation, it is not a commercial enterprise so does not need to be coded. You can set up a Limited Liability Partnership which is the same type of company not for profit organisations use (such as charities). As you have rightly spotted, there are however advantages to being "commercial" so the choice is yours based on what benefits you most.

In answer to where Indulgeon makes it's money... The basic booking and calendar functionality is free. All we charge for is the "Pro" features such as the finance stuff. For that we charge the princely sum of 2 per member per month. If you need it it's available. We just want to be THE community for shared ownership. There are obviously other areas we can make money to keep us ticking over but from a user point of view it is either free or very low cost.
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Old 25 November 2013, 18:53   #70
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Quote:
Originally Posted by HUMBER P4VWL View Post
To be fair, Many sites don't require trade subscription, and who reads the small print anyway, but you've acknowledged it once flagged and paid. Fair cop. Crack on and I hope can add value to the site.
He's not the first person to post a trade post, either in error or the hope of going unnoticed. I expect anyone posting with commercial motives to be switched on enough to social media etiquette that they would be aware that some sites don't accept trade posts and look for the rules (hint see bottom of page). Its not unusual thought and "he's done the the right thing" now.

However, trying a blatant advert is naughty - but posting "astroturf" is not not just commercially naive it is also potentially illegal (The Consumer Protection from Unfair Trading Regulations 2008, Regulation 3(4)(d) - Schedule 1, Para 22)

Quote:
Originally Posted by jumpinjack
If the boat is owned by the company- is any boat usage then classed as a 'leisure' activity, or is it a 'commercial enterprise'.
May not sound an important difference but it is. On the upside,could you buy fuel at trade prices..... On the down side, do you insure as a commercial craft and does the vessel need to be coded and certified as it's not a private craft, but a commercial craft. Subtle, but very important?
Coding does not apply to vessels owned by companies IF they are only used by the officers or employees of the company on a 'free voyage'.
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