Second Land rover problem of the day: b*****d stater motor

Tim M · 04 December 2007, 11:23

I mentioned in the other thread that "I've just got to get it started now" this is because yesterday something went wrong with it. I diagnosed the problem as a knanckered starter motor, which an RAC man has just confirmed.

I've just ordered a used motor from a scrappy I know quite well back in Norfolk, which should be here tomorrow morning.

Does anyone know of an online recourse with info relating to the changing of a starter motor on a 96 300tdi (auto) discovery?

It looks like quite a straight forward sort of job. Is there anything specific (apart from disconnecting the battery) that I need to worry about?

ribraff · 04 December 2007, 11:36

Take a look at landrovernet, they're pretty helpful and you may even find a guide:

www.landrovernet.com

bedajim · 04 December 2007, 12:05

Quote:

Originally Posted by Tim M

I mentioned in the other thread that "I've just got to get it started now" this is because yesterday something went wrong with it. I diagnosed the problem as a knanckered starter motor, which an RAC man has just confirmed.

I've just ordered a used motor from a scrappy I know quite well back in Norfolk, which should be here tomorrow morning.

Does anyone know of an online recourse with info relating to the changing of a starter motor on a 96 300tdi (auto) discovery?

It looks like quite a straight forward sort of job. Is there anything specific (apart from disconnecting the battery) that I need to worry about?

Have it tested under load before you fit it(as you've not seen it run), local rewind/motor factors should be able to do that for a small fee, because fitting a knackered one will really p----s you off

bedajim · 04 December 2007, 13:59

Thinking about it just get a recon exchange unit

BogMonster · 04 December 2007, 14:52

join www.lr4x4.com I think the answer is probably in our tech archive but if it isn't then if you post a question somebody will answer it

edited to add yes it is - http://forums.lr4x4.com/index.php?sh...0&#entry174718

check out the tech archive index http://forums.lr4x4.com/index.php?showtopic=4731 for everything else you might ever need to know

codprawn · 04 December 2007, 15:00

Was the starter motor really knackered??? Often it's just the solenoid which can be cleaned or replaced.

jwalker · 04 December 2007, 15:22

Take off the pipes from the air filter to turbo as much as you need to gain access. Mine has a heat shield between the manifold and the starter which is fiddly to remove. Remove the main electrical cable - IT IS LIVE, DO NOT GROUND IT or the spanner you are using to slacken the nut. Tape it to protect it.
I suppose it's best to disconnect the battery first but I normally live dangerously. Undo the bolts holding the starter; remove the top one last and catch the motor as it comes away. It's a heavy hold for just one hand, take care.

I'm with codders. Don't discard the old one, it's likely repairable.

I've found connecting a second earth strap directly from the battery to the engine improves the starter performance noticeably. I put mine from the battery negative to a convenient bolt on the air con compressor. It's a nice short jump.

Simon B · 04 December 2007, 16:38

Likewise check your alternator circuit, if the connections are a bit shoddy it will look as though you'll need one of those too.

Did my starter on my LR110 CSW a while back; pattern part £80, main dealer £280 (exchange)

Tim M · 04 December 2007, 16:39

I got there in the end! Having spent an hour disconnecting hoses etc to get to the motor only to find I couldn't get it off because the bolts were seized, I decided to go and buy a new air filter. What a good idea that was. At the parts shop they had a load of cans of freeze spray on the counter. I bought one of these and tried a squirt on each of the three bolts holding the motor on. It worked a treat.

Having got the motor out, it is defiantly knackered. The bearings around the top end of it have disappeared along with what I imagine would have been a spring/several springs. Hopefully the replacement motor will arrive tomorrow morning and it'll be back on the road again!

PS. That website above was a great source of help.

Tim M · 07 December 2007, 12:09

Latest update:
The starter motor finally arrived today. I put it in and all was fine. Turned the key and it started. Wonderful. Let it idle for a few minutes while I put my tools away and it sounded fine. Got in and drove 1/2 mile to the petrol station. Put some fuel in. Left the petrol station, drive 300 yards up the road to my lockup. Got back in the car 5 minutes later and turned the key. The engine started, and then increased in revs. I didn't like the sound of that so quickly turned it off. Wait a moment then tried again. Same thing. I tried about 5 times, then it started almost normally; it started, then revved for a split second then went back to normal idle speed. I set off very slowly fearing that it might suddenly start revving again whilst in gear. Sure enough a minute later it did. I slammed on the brakes, and then it stalled. Tried to re start it (bearing in mind I'm sitting in the middle of the road) and it wouldn't. Tried again, lots of revs, tried again, started fine. This happened another couple of times on the way home. Got home and had another look under the bonnet around where I had been working to make sure I hadn't unplugged anything or damaged anything. All looks fine. I checked the throttle cable linkage and all seemed OK. I tried starting it again, this time it revved up to about 3500rpm which is where it stayed.

Any ideas as to what it could be?

I have done the following since it ran fine (which was Monday afternoon):
-Removed the old starter motor, which involved removing several hoses for access. Then fitted replacement motor and re-connected everything.
-Fitted a blanking plate to the EGR valve, and removed the pipe that connects the valve to the actuator.
-Changed the air filter.

PS: I also get the check engine light on now as well.

Nos4r2 · 07 December 2007, 12:26

Did you block the small pipe that controls the EGR valve?

(Don't know if it's connected to the ECU but for a few seconds winding a bolt into the end of the pipe it's something to try)

jwalker · 07 December 2007, 12:28

Dunno Tim, could be lots of things. Did you blank the end of the vacuum pipe. Some of the later cars were a bit more electronic. Perhaps the EGR is being watched and now it thinks it's faulty..just guessing.

A more serious thing is that oil from the turbo seals can feed the engine and it can rev out of control. Mine failed in a bigger way and fed the sump oil into the intercooler up to a level where it blocked off the air supply, thankfully because I've a pal who suffered this type of failure in a queue on a dual carriageway. The engine ran away with itself and couldn't be stopped. He got out of the Disco in case the flywheel came away and he left it to rev flat out until it consumed the sump oil. Apparently, the was a smoke screen for miles.

The Disco had only covered 30k, too.

The Garfish · 07 December 2007, 16:52

Quote:

Originally Posted by jwalker

The engine ran away with itself and couldn't be stopped.

itt woz inn de nooz yew nobbur. itt woz stil doin fawty myles an hower onn de parris too birlin rode wen de jirmans stopt itt att de seegfreed lyne wiv a panzirforst.

thay woz lukky itt wazunt a mirlin

garF

codprawn · 08 December 2007, 23:06

I only put the blanking plate on mine - don't think you are supposed to fiddle with any pipes!!!

Another possibility is to make sure the engine has a good earth - it can happen that the earth fails and then uses the throttle cable............

Nos4r2 · 09 December 2007, 03:20

Quote:

Originally Posted by codprawn

I only put the blanking plate on mine - don't think you are supposed to fiddle with any pipes!!!

Another possibility is to make sure the engine has a good earth - it can happen that the earth fails and then uses the throttle cable............

I don't think it's a good idea to leave open a vacuum pipe that was previously sealed by it's connection to the EGR valve. It's still connected to the vacuum pump and brake servo if nothing else.

Tim M · 09 December 2007, 09:18

Its very odd. Since my last post it's been behaving. It seemed to rev up for about an hour after I did the work. Now it just sounds a bit rough when starting - it's defiantly not right though. I'm going to return the EGR valve to how it was before later in the hope that will solve it.

jwalker · 09 December 2007, 11:52

A bit of advice for the future, Tim. Never ever change, adjust or replace more than one thing at a time.

codprawn · 09 December 2007, 13:48

Quote:

Originally Posted by Tim M

Its very odd. Since my last post it's been behaving. It seemed to rev up for about an hour after I did the work. Now it just sounds a bit rough when starting - it's defiantly not right though. I'm going to return the EGR valve to how it was before later in the hope that will solve it.

Leave the blanking plate in - just connect the bloody pipe back up!!!

codprawn · 09 December 2007, 13:48

Quote:

Originally Posted by jwalker

A bit of advice for the future, Tim. Never ever change, adjust or replace more than one thing at a time.

Hear hear!!!

bedajim · 10 December 2007, 03:31

Quote:

Originally Posted by codprawn

Leave the blanking plate in - just connect the bloody pipe back up!!!

Doesn't the pipe/valve connect to the hole the blanking plate is covering ??