Optimax low on power and running hot?

Tony Barber · 03 January 2005, 19:31

Hi,

I picked up my new rib just before Christmas and took it out for the first time today. Before I bought it, we took it out for approx 1/2 hour and the engine ran fine.

However, when I took it out today there were a few problems. It started fine but it wouldn't idle too well and kept cutting out. It would start OK again? Once under way it didn't cut out any more, but it was well down on power, only reving to around 4000 with a max speed of around 28 knots. Oh, I forgot to mention that although I know it was full fo fuel the smart gauages were showing a fuel fault and that it was empty? Then, I noticed a warning message saying to reduce speed as engine overheating! Luckily I was not far away from the slipway so limped back home V slowly. The tell tale was working, although I'm not sure how much presure it should come out at?

I am hoping to take it to the local Mariner dealers either tomorrow or Wed but would appreciate any ideas, just so that I know what to expect.

Thanks,

Tony.

ADS · 03 January 2005, 19:38

You don't seem to be having much luck with this new toy Tony! I think its more likely to be an electrical fault than the engine overheating, often engine management systems impose a rev limit 4k in this case when something goes wrong. It happened on my 12 year old Suzuki and all it turned out to be damp in the connections. Best thing to do is to take it to your local mariner/ merc dealer, I assume its still under warranty.
Good luck

Alex

Tony Barber · 03 January 2005, 20:04

Quote:

Originally Posted by ADS

You don't seem to be having much luck with this new toy Tony!

Tell me about it!

Quote:

Originally Posted by ADS

I assume its still under warranty.

Unfortunatley not. It's just over 3 years old so not warranty I'm afraid! Fingers crossed its not to costly.

TB

Turbodiesel · 03 January 2005, 20:05

I would have a look and make sure the fuel supply is ok, It may sound odd but if your not getting the right rpm????.
If its getting hot it could be Detonation if the fuel supply is poor the mixture will be weak making the cylinders very hot and eventually melting the Pistons.

Of coures it could just be a Electrial fault.!!

ADS · 03 January 2005, 20:09

Quote:

Originally Posted by Tony Barber

Tell me about it!

Unfortunatley not. It's just over 3 years old so not warranty I'm afraid! Fingers crossed its not to costly.

TB

Take it to your local dealer but make sure your sat down when they give you the quote

Assumming its been serviced recently I would find it hard to believe if anything major has gone wrong. 'Melting the pistons' I think turbodiesel had just read your occupation!

Alex

codprawn · 03 January 2005, 20:25

sounds like some sort of sensor problem - another case of "crying wolf"??? Hope so for your sake!!!!

Turbodiesel · 04 January 2005, 20:41

Quote:

Originally Posted by ADS

Take it to your local dealer but make sure your sat down when they give you the quote

Assumming its been serviced recently I would find it hard to believe if anything major has gone wrong. 'Melting the pistons' I think turbodiesel had just read your occupation!

Alex

Im not joking!, i see quite a few engines a year with fuel starvation problems.
I changed 2 powerheads on a 60hp. The first one was sent out under warranty. Then the engine went bang again so we got the boat back to Barrus, to find the Pistons had detonated. The Fault was traced to air being drawn in though a split fibre washer on one of the fuel filters. Im not saying the opti has that problem im just saying it as a worse case jobby.

ADS · 04 January 2005, 20:56

Quote:

Originally Posted by Turbodiesel

Im not joking!, i see quite a few engines a year with
I changed 2 powerheads on a 60hp. The first one was sent out under warranty. Then the engine went bang again so we got the boat back to Barrus, to find the Pistons had detonated. The Fault was traced to air being drawn in though a split fibre washer on one of the fuel filters. Im not saying the opti has that problem im just saying it as a worse case jobby.

Sorry to hi-jack your thread Tony!
So hang on a minute, if air is drawn into the engine through a leaky seal it could wreck the engine. I am only mentioning this because someone suggested that my engine had a air leak on the carb mounting gasket. I did the trick where u spray WD40 onto it and it was fine, and it runs fine but there is a sort of hissing, whirring (difficult to describe) noise if you take the cover off when its running, I think its always done it though. Engine is a '92 Suzuki DT40, please tell me if I should'nt be running it!

Alex

Rogue Wave · 04 January 2005, 23:29

It could well be a potential detonation problem and if so it needs sorting!

I don't think a spray of WD40 is gonna cure it but you mighta been born lucky!

The smartguages are really quite clever and the engine management system provides a good few safeguards but you can have faults that get past them.

The fuel fault. What was the mesage was it low fuel or water in fuel or something else?

Did the mesage appear on the test drive or were you too busy grinning to notice it!

was the boat still fullish of fuel when you recovered it?

I presume you are running with Optimax 2 stroke oil if you didn't put any in what colour is the 2 stroke oil in the tank blue or brown ?

I think it's fair to say that the water temperature and pressure from the engines tell tale should be about the same as from your own tell tale it certainly shouldn' be much hotter!

did you get any messages coming up with injector fault?

was your fuel filter seperator A ok or was it watery?

If the engine management system was unhappy then it would cut your revs down to a very small figure (it's called Guardian mode) which is about 800 revs
so I think the 4000 rev limit was dictated by something else other than the EMU like maybe you was only firing on all 5 instead of just the 6. It not a bad idea to change the plugs on a new to you engine they do come quite dear however?

I am presuming that you didn't snap the drive belt during the end of your little voyage?

Hope it all work out to be a silly one

jwalker · 04 January 2005, 23:45

Fuel tank breather open?

ADS · 05 January 2005, 08:04

Quote:

Originally Posted by Rogue Wave

It could well be a potential detonation problem and if so it needs sorting!

I don't think a spray of WD40 is gonna cure it but you mighta been born lucky!

I was told that if you spray WD40 onto the suspected leak area when the engine is running if the engine is sucking in air it will suck in the wd40 and therefore miss fire or splutter a bit. Apparently, you can do it with alcohol and the revs should pick up. I have tried this and it didn't make any difference.
I am planning to get it serviced soon anyway so I will get them to check it out.

Alex

Rogue Wave · 05 January 2005, 11:39

I wasn't talking to you my comments were made to Tony about his Optimax fault which is something that I know a bit about , but not as much as turbodiesel!

In general I try not to offer advice unless I have personal experience of the fault and or problem being discused, I have had a few Optimax's fail on me hence my further questions to see if I can offer any advice based on my experience.

He also has other messages coming out of the indicator guages which perversely can indicate the that the main 12v feed to the engine may be compromised.

I don't know very much about engines and I am not a good man with a spanner so I can't really help you with your question. If you ask one of the Forum Old farts like Pete7 or David Manning about your Suzuki as they will very probably know the right answer! But It seems plausible to me!

My apologies to anybody I have missed out in my list of Old Farts

Turbodiesel · 05 January 2005, 19:54

If the Engine is saying overspeed at 4000Rpm thats the first stage of the gaurdian cutting in.
I had a similar problem on a 115 opti a few weeks ago i fitted the boat out for a customer took it out for a trial and had a similar fault, overspeed at 4000rpm and it kept saying reduce throttle speed.
To cut a long story short... After plugging in the DDT (Diagnosic Tool) i noticed all the overspeed faults had happened when the engine was in neutral???? But i was moving a 30knts??.
It turned out to be the ingear protect switch had a wire loose so the engine thought it was in neutral and was trying to stop me from over reving. So it could be somthing as simple as a loose wire. You need to get the dealer to Plug his DDT into it to find out whats going on. Opti's are pretty good and well protected by there guardian system. Let us now how you get on

Tony Barber · 05 January 2005, 20:56

HI

Thanks for the replies everyone. I took it into the Mariner dealers today and waited around for a bit. At 1st they couldn't find any faults, apart from the fact that it sounded dog rough and didn't want to idle! The computer that they plugged in wasn't showing any current faults, just some in the history about the overheat and fuel problem. When I left them they were checking the plugs one by one. They all looked a bit coked up, black and wet.

I rang at about 4 this afternoon to see what the latest was and they have now got it running, quote "as sweet as a nut". They found the oil line wasn't connected properly!!?? I can only think that when I took the oil tank out from under the console to fill it up I disconnected something! Don't say it.

They are now checking the fuel tank sensor as this is not showing anything in the tank. They have said they want to get it out on the water to test it is OK at higher revs than they can manage on the mufs, but hopefully it is OK.

So basically, it was me.

I'll let you know the outcome of the sea trails, probably middle of next week as the boss of teh Mariner Dealers is going to the boat show.

Thanks again.

Tony.

craigdavis · 11 January 2005, 09:01

dats good were u luanch from

Tony Barber · 23 January 2005, 18:35

Quote:

Originally Posted by craigdavis

dats good were u luanch from

Either Cardigan or Aberporth depending on the tide/weather.

Tony.

CND · 23 January 2005, 18:43

Quick Question,

Are you supposed to have water seperarators/filters in line with the fuel supply on an optimax? I have heard people say that they are not supposed to be there as they increase the resistance in the fuel line, and then ive seen quite a few optimax boats fittied with them on their transoms....

is it dangerous to have one in line?

Paul F · 23 January 2005, 19:08

It is recommemded that a seperator is fitted to fuel line even though one is fitted on engine.
Any water getting through is going to wreck the injectors.
Paul

CJL · 24 January 2005, 10:01

Quote:

Originally Posted by Paul F

It is recommemded that a seperator is fitted to fuel line even though one is fitted on engine.
Any water getting through is going to wreck the injectors.
Paul

Sorry Paul but if you look in the manual for an OPTIMAX it clearly says you shouldn't fit one.

That said I`ve got one on a boat I bought recently and no problems. But I'd read your manual take on board the advice from Merc then decide before I did ANYTHING.

Chris

Bilge Rat · 24 January 2005, 11:34

Quote:

Originally Posted by CJL

Sorry Paul but if you look in the manual for an OPTIMAX it clearly says you shouldn't fit one.

That said I`ve got one on a boat I bought recently and no problems. But I'd read your manual take on board the advice from Merc then decide before I did ANYTHING.

Chris

Sorry if this sounds really nieve but can someone explain why fitting an additional fuel/water seperator filter in addition to the standard small one supplied in the engine would be a bad thing ?, Yamaha recommend they are fitted as an additional thing, therfore i have one on my transom filtering the petrol, one would assume that the cleaner the petrol the better the burn will be, and as Pauls pointed out water can damage the engine parts ?