Landrover Defender - which one?

Steve_B · 27 July 2011, 17:31

I know everyone has an opinion, but I am going to buy one (even if it's just to get it out of my system). Yes I do like playing with cars and getting hands dirty.

I have got about £14,000 give or take to spend and probably prefer the 90 Stationwagon.
Which engine/spec and where would you go to buy?

Steve

Simon B · 27 July 2011, 17:41

If you need to carry anything other than a handbag and a pair of shoes the 90 will drive you nuts. Think long and hard about gettig a 110. £14k will buy you a lot of Land Rover for that money.

Even though I have a non-OEM motor in mine I'd reccomend you stay stock say a 200TDi or TD5 and do an uplift performance wise with a bigger intercooler etc etc.

If you really want to play Jeremy Fearn is now doing a conversion with the straight 6 BMW 3.0 litre - a thing of beauty and vast torque.

The CSW spec has loads of expensive ish inetrior panelling which cuts the noise down if you are going to be towing or driving longs distances (you can always put grills over the window or inside for security.

Max... · 27 July 2011, 17:41

I'm a Landy nut - ran quite a few over the years from Series III to a Disco but currently running a 1986 ex-military Ninety and a slightly more comfortable 1998 110 CSW.

You have a very fair budget, a 110 is far more practical for general family/utility/boat use. 90's are tiny inside and if you stick the kids/family/friends in the back then you have zero luggage space. I also find the 110 rides much better. There is no real advantage to a 90 other than a turning circle less than the 110 - comparable to an oil tanker...

[edit] - for real off road use a 90 is more managable of course - talking trials/pay and play days etc - nothing beats a soft top ex-mod 90 in that situation for fun.

For many enthusiasts (me included) the last great engine was the 300tdi which is why I run a '98 110 - last year they made them. They go for a premium over a slightly later Td5 for this reason. You have plenty of money for a mint Td5 or a Ford engined 110. Problem with the latest ones is the seats - the old CSW with the benches (the '12 seater') has loads of people/gear space - the newer models with forward facings seats are far less practical.

Head over to some of the Landy forums for lots more opinions (Difflock is my favourite).

willk · 27 July 2011, 20:04

I've been running a 110 Tdi300 Hard Top (van) since 1998 (from new). As a tow wagon and kit carrier, it has been superb. In this time it had done 90k miles and had a few exhausts, a pair of CV joints, an alternator and back shocks. The 110 load bay is 6' long, the 90s are 4'. The 90 fuel tank is a silly amount smaller too, but the car weights are quite similar(ish). There is feck all space in a 90 station wagon and the ride is even choppier than a 110, due to the length.

Offroad. You will hear a lot of bull about how bad 110s are offroad (Relax Max, not referencing you). The army might not agree. I've had my girl around the Iceland Central Highlands a few times and believe me when I say, they do the do offroad too!

willk · 27 July 2011, 20:05

Quote:

Originally Posted by Max...

For many enthusiasts (me included) the last great engine was the 300tdi which is why I run a '98 110 - last year they made them.

Snap!

LWman · 27 July 2011, 20:07

Also

up for a TD5 engine, my dads had one in his disco 2 which he has owned for 9 years from new. In that time the only thing he has changed is the starter motor (& a few sets of tyres of course) a couple of months ago & other than that going, its never failed him. Defenders are great motors although maybe not too comfortable. They look really good in stornoway grey fully kitted out. There will be some crackers around for the money your looking at

Turbodiesel · 27 July 2011, 20:08

TD5 110, i have had a few 90's but always found them just a bit to short, plus the long wheel base i always found better for towing.

LWman · 27 July 2011, 20:08

Sorry, delayed reply made me look to be agreeing with the 300tdi! haha oh well

boristhebold · 27 July 2011, 21:23

Well done Steve, good choice. I find my 90 to have plenty of room for carrying loads of stuff. The new 90 have the rear seats facing forward so go for one that's older than new models. Td5 engine is fine, vie had no problems. Look in landy mags and auto trader adds. Perhaps have a chat with the guys down horton road there is a landy service centre there. As to upgrading engine on td5 yes pretty easy, new chip, new bigger intercooler, bypass valve thing and air filter, I'm thinking of doing it sometime myself.

You should get a decent one with 14k and they are great at pulling boats.

Kernow Buoy · 28 July 2011, 07:18

My 110 V8 is being rebuilt this October, galv chassis & bulkhead, am seriously considering doing her as a soft top, should be fun

Channel Ribs · 28 July 2011, 08:10

Quote:

Originally Posted by Max...

There is no real advantage to a 90 other than a turning circle less than the 110 - comparable to an oil tanker.

Our 109 doesn't have a turning circle, it has an orbit.

Max... · 28 July 2011, 08:15

Quote:

Originally Posted by Kernow

My 110 V8 is being rebuilt this October, galv chassis & bulkhead, am seriously considering doing her as a soft top, should be fun

Go for it - nothing better in the summer.

Kernow Buoy · 28 July 2011, 12:35

Quote:

Originally Posted by Max...

Go for it - nothing better in the summer.

Hmmm Nice

110 county soft tops are rare, a couple of companies do the full kit but I'm trying to incorporate a roll cage as well, could do without 3 roll bars and 4 hoops for the canvas, the sun won't shine through!

SDDiver5 · 28 July 2011, 13:17

I drove my Uncles 110 when I lived in Costa Rica for a couple months. I also drove a 90 and I gotta say that I enjoyed the 110 much more. It was just more fun to drive IMO. I believe his 110 is the TDI300 but I am not totally sure. Defenders are so sweet. I wish there were more of them in the U.S. Its pretty difficult to get them in here and make them street legal. Good luck

D

BogMonster · 02 August 2011, 20:19

Quote:

Originally Posted by Max...

For many enthusiasts (me included) the last great engine was the 300tdi which is why I run a '98 110 - last year they made them.

Not quite. I have a factory 2006 model year Defender 110 though in worldwide terms they are a rare beast

Until two weeks ago I was the dealer principal in the Falklands and had been doing that for 15 years so have a fair bit of practical experience in all of them. I bought a last of line export model 2006MY 300Tdi in April 2007 because I wasn't sure about the Puma. Having seen them for four years I'd not be worried about buying a Puma now, but I still don't like the Td5 much and never have. There's nothing terribly wrong with it, it just (to me) drives like an engine that was designed by an engineer and never tried in a vehicle until they started building them.

All the engines (and gearboxes) have strengths and weaknesses but the later 300s (post 97) are probably the most bombproof. Td5s had flywheels and head gasket problems, Pumas have some bother with injectors, fuel pumps and pressure sensors/valves on the fuel rails but no real show stoppers - if a planet fell on my 300 tomorrow I'd buy a Puma. 300 and Puma clutches are both crap and the Puma especially is not up to the torque IMO and WILL break the centre with heavy towing or a lot of heavy off road use.

The only real drawbacks to a 110 are the weight (in soft ground) and in some circumstances the approach/departure/breakover angles. In the real world they are simply far more practical - speaking as somebody who has owned 3 90's over the years and chopped the last one in for a 110 because it wasn't big enough.

A 90 is great for 2 people and a bit of stuff, but no more. Having said that I would love to have another 90, but I already have 3 vehicles and a boat and I think getting another one would lead to divorce...

Max... · 02 August 2011, 20:29

That is true, I was referring to UK civilian models but the MoD of course (and certain export markets) did not trust the Td5 and for them the 300Tdi continued to be available many years later than '98. The 300Tdi was the last great engine but for me the best ever was the 2.5NA in the Ninety above, again so beloved of the MoD - my Tohatsu 9.8 is only marginally simpler as engines go...

Here's a couple of pics I posted in another topic this week - I love my Ninety but the 110 is damn handy when it comes to carrying 'stuff':

robbo1 · 03 August 2011, 11:10

I run a 98 300 TDI 90 defender. If you cant get your stuff inside, it should fit on top on a nice ally roof rack with lights on the front and a ladder on the back. You can get loads and loads of bolt on goodies for them for which ever one you get. Around town and general driving including off road I get high 20's mpg average. Towing my 16ft ally sport boat it returns 25 mpg. The 300 TDI is the last of the non electronic engines (easy to fix) It's also more refined ( might not be the right word for a landrover diesel engine) than the 200 TDI. TD5 engines common probs wiring loom inside cylinder head allows oil to leak into ECU. Great till it goes wrong in the middle of know where.
CHECK THE LONDON LEZ WEBSITE BEFORE BUYING IF YOU DRIVE INSIDE THE M25 !!!!!!!!
The london gestapo dont want 4x4's anywhere near London from 2012. It might sway what you buy.
Get a selection of good security products for it. They are VERY nickable !!!!!!!

Markyboyo · 03 August 2011, 13:14

I've been winding up a mate who lives in Sutton with a 300TDI for weeks over the new LEZ charges. I can't see his problem, £100 a day seems totally reasonable to me!

He is in the process of sending pictures off in an appeal to prove that it is just his car and not a commercial vehicle or something along those lines. Other option is to retro fit a particulate filter.

ben tye · 03 August 2011, 14:05

I have a friend who has a 110 and I believe due to the number of seats you used to be exempt from the London congestion charges. We have a 90 that is used for short trips and is great for towing, it's very agricultural and the heater is rubbish. I still think a Disco is a better buy, and cheaper as land rovers have a premium as they are fashionable. The Disco V8's were fantastic, I had one in Dubai but they drink fuel.

lukecord · 03 August 2011, 14:18

I had a 110 high cap station wagon with the BMW straight 6. It was epic, very fast, great tower and useful on a slip. Had it LPG converted to keep fuel costs down. wld recommend although insurance wasn't cheap until I did it through farmers union.
Now I have a Td5 130 pick up which is slow but amazing on gravelly slips and an excellent tower and work horse. Turning circle is tragic though.
For boats and towing I cant see the point in getting a 90 to be honest. they are for other things.
Where to buy? anywhere but Nene Overland.