Reply
 
Thread Tools Search this Thread
 
Old 07 December 2012, 17:06   #91
Member
 
Portnahaven's Avatar
 
Country: UK - N Ireland
Town: belfast
Boat name: portnahaven
Make: Red Bay Boats
Length: 7m +
Engine: yamaha 245hp diesel
MMSI: 235089641
Join Date: Aug 2011
Posts: 343
__________________

__________________
Portnahaven is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 07 December 2012, 17:39   #92
Member
 
Bigmuz7's Avatar
 
Country: UK - Scotland
Town: Glasgow
Boat name: stramash
Make: Tornado
Length: 5m +
Engine: Etec 90
Join Date: Feb 2006
Posts: 5,068
Quote:
Originally Posted by spartacus View Post
Road tax...
Why not ? the rest of us are getting taxed to death ?

Last week I had a good friend who got 'done' for being on his mobile phone whilst driving his JCB

I hope you guys live by the same rules spandex trousers or not .. fiddle with your lycra mobile phone holder and its 3 points
__________________

__________________
Bigmuz7 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 07 December 2012, 19:13   #93
Member
 
spartacus's Avatar
 
Country: UK - Scotland
Town: Aberdeenshire
Boat name: Sula
Make: Ribcraft 4.8m
Length: 4m +
Engine: Tohatsu 60hp + aux
MMSI: 235087213
Join Date: Jun 2007
Posts: 3,268
RIBase
Quote:
Originally Posted by Bigmuz7 View Post
Why not ? the rest of us are getting taxed to death ?

Last week I had a good friend who got 'done' for being on his mobile phone whilst driving his JCB

I hope you guys live by the same rules spandex trousers or not .. fiddle with your lycra mobile phone holder and its 3 points
I'm a car driver, cyclist, and devil's advocate.

I currently pay over 400 a year road tax for a 2001 Audi A4 2.5 TDi quattro avant. My wife drives a 2003 A2 1.4 TDI and she pays 35 a year. Finally my mother drives a 2011 Volvo V50 eDrive 1.6 TDI estate which costs her 0. Yes, that right, zero road tax.

Where am I going with this... well I'm not sure? I know the current road tax system is based on emissions, and trying to reduce CO2 levels and move drivers towards more environmentally-friendly transport. However, with current fuel prices, you're taxed to the hilt anyway. The Government's policy is flawed, based on an inadequate transport infrastructure with cyclists effectively competing for space on our already overcrowded roads.

I try and do some cycling during the summer months, partly to keep fit, and to reduce my fuel bill (spent in slow moving stop-start traffic). I think anyone who migrates from the car to the bicycle should be encouraged. Remember - it's not just the domain of the lycra brigade. What kind of example do you think we're showing to our children - if you basically curse every cyclist that's taking up slightly more of the Queen's highway than they're entitled too.

There are some bleed'n idiots out there, cycling in the middle of the road, running red lights and generally giving good cyclists a bad name. But taxing them is a step too far. Why? Because the person that drives is more than likely the same person that cycles. You'd effectively be taxing yourself twice!

Quote:
Last week I had a good friend who got 'done' for being on his mobile phone whilst driving his JCB
And your point is? While he's been busy texting or checking his emails he could have flattened a bus shelter. Reckon he got off lightly with 3 points.
__________________
Is that with or without VAT?
spartacus is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 08 December 2012, 04:27   #94
Member
 
Bigmuz7's Avatar
 
Country: UK - Scotland
Town: Glasgow
Boat name: stramash
Make: Tornado
Length: 5m +
Engine: Etec 90
Join Date: Feb 2006
Posts: 5,068
Quote:
Originally Posted by spartacus View Post
And your point is? While he's been busy texting or checking his emails he could have flattened a bus shelter. Reckon he got off lightly with 3 points.
Thats not in dispute ... what is in dispute is the different set of rules many cyclists seem to live by .... thier 'own' rules

Any person in command of a vehicle on a public road has to sit a test and learn the highway code .... does a cyclist ? .... NO !

Like Ive mentioned already .. I dont hate cyclists and give them the same room and respect as any other road user .. but they need to stop thinking they are some kind of 'special case' that has to be treated differently . If your on a public road .. obey the rules like the rest of us !
__________________
Bigmuz7 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 08 December 2012, 05:11   #95
Member
 
paddlers's Avatar
 
Country: UK - England
Town: Sticks, N.Yorks
Boat name: Tamanco
Make: Honwave 3.5AE
Length: 3m +
Engine: Tohatsu Outboard
Join Date: May 2012
Posts: 1,063
Part of the trouble is the anonymity of cyclists on the road, the classic being the one in an earlier clip of one smashing somebodies wing mirror that could cost a lot to repair! If they all had to wear a dayglo top with a number on their back that clearly identifies them I suggest a lot of (but not all) the idiots will soon get sick of the fines!
__________________
paddlers is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 08 December 2012, 05:19   #96
RIBnet admin team
 
Poly's Avatar
 
Country: UK - Scotland
Boat name: imposter
Make: FunYak
Length: 3m +
Engine: 2 stroke YAM 20 HP
MMSI: 235089819
Join Date: Sep 2005
Posts: 10,114
Quote:
Originally Posted by spartacus View Post
I think anyone who migrates from the car to the bicycle should be encouraged. Remember - it's not just the domain of the lycra brigade. What kind of example do you think we're showing to our children - if you basically curse every cyclist that's taking up slightly more the part of the Queen's highway than they're legally entitled too.
fixed that for you!
Quote:
And your point is? While he's been busy texting or checking his emails he could have flattened a bus shelter. Reckon he got off lightly with 3 points.
or run over a small child on a bike!

Quote:
Originally Posted by Bigmuz7 View Post
Thats not in dispute ... what is in dispute is the different set of rules many cyclists seem to live by .... thier 'own' rules
nobody is disputing that some cyclists break some road traffic laws (like red light jumping, unlit bikes at night). Nobody has suggested they should not be prosecuted for that. You are getting angry along with people who all agree with you... ...do you read the Daily Mail by any chance?
Quote:
Any person in command of a vehicle on a public road has to sit a test and learn the highway code .... does a cyclist ? .... NO !
no any person in charge of a MOTOR vehicle has to hold a license and pass a test.

Quote:
but they need to stop thinking they are some kind of 'special case' that has to be treated differently . If your on a public road .. obey the rules like the rest of us !
But the specific point you made was about riding a bike when using mobile phone - which is not an offence s41(D)b of the RTA refers to a "Motor Vehicle". There are various provisions of the act which apply only to motor vehicles - if you don't like that you'd be better moaning to your MP/MSP than on here.
__________________
Poly is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 08 December 2012, 05:50   #97
RIBnet admin team
 
Poly's Avatar
 
Country: UK - Scotland
Boat name: imposter
Make: FunYak
Length: 3m +
Engine: 2 stroke YAM 20 HP
MMSI: 235089819
Join Date: Sep 2005
Posts: 10,114
Quote:
Originally Posted by paddlers View Post
Part of the trouble is the anonymity of cyclists on the road, the classic being the one in an earlier clip of one smashing somebodies wing mirror that could cost a lot to repair! If they all had to wear a dayglo top with a number on their back that clearly identifies them I suggest a lot of (but not all) the idiots will soon get sick of the fines!
Actually I think the problem is evidence. Where it not for the "camera" I'd guess that the situation in the video would be attributed to the driver for getting too close, rather than the cyclist for criminal damage. That said, even with the video a driver pursuing that complaint would need to be very careful or he'd find himself picking up 3 pts and a fine for inconsiderate driving.

I quite like your number visible on the top suggestion although I suspect there are some technical challenges e.g. to ensure its visible at night; it is visible when the top is loose / wrinkled / bulging over fat / etc; it doesn't fade in the wash; how you stop/prevent cloned/stolen numbers; each cyclist would need to be able to apply to different clothing (e.g. I wear quite different stuff riding to work, on a long road ride, on a mountain bike ride (which might still see me on road for sections), in the summer, in winter, in the middle of a ride when it starts to rain). Simply adding a bib over the top will not be popular (too hot in summer, too flappy for serious road cycling, thin waterproofs wear/leak when you put stuff on top). That all adds up to quite a cost... ...and since most drivers don't have "in cab cctv" you probably don't have time to get a complex number written down in many situations (>50 million potential numbers, which even using letters too means probably 6 characters long - that has to fit on a 6 year old's back!). ...all that is going to cost, so either the cyclists get "taxed" to fund it [see spartacus comments about encouraging people out of cars to reduce congestion, emissions, and improve health and why we don't tax it] or you, the motorist, will be subsidising it! Would it not be easier just to enforce the existing rules more regularly / effectively than just making new ones with no system of enforcement: but in these times of austerity there are perhaps things that the powers who be might prefer to spend out money on? e.g. if the decision is catching boat/outboard thieves OR fining someone for risking their own life going through red light where would you rather spend the ??
__________________
Poly is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 08 December 2012, 07:41   #98
Member
 
Portnahaven's Avatar
 
Country: UK - N Ireland
Town: belfast
Boat name: portnahaven
Make: Red Bay Boats
Length: 7m +
Engine: yamaha 245hp diesel
MMSI: 235089641
Join Date: Aug 2011
Posts: 343
...and while we are at it different coloured numbers for dog walkers attached to the dog of course
...and horse riders - Reg Plates on lighting board would be great. Not sure where you plug in the socke
... etc, etc
...and Ribs
__________________
Portnahaven is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 08 December 2012, 08:03   #99
RIBnet admin team
 
willk's Avatar
 
Country: Ireland
Make: Redbay Boats
Length: 9m +
Engine: 370hp
Join Date: Feb 2008
Posts: 12,925
RIBase
Quote:
Originally Posted by Poly View Post
I quite like your number visible on the top suggestion although I suspect there are some technical challenges e.g. to ensure its visible at night; it is visible when the top is loose / wrinkled / bulging over fat
Hmmmm. I see how that could be a problem. And yet, Identification would solve many issues. I have been conducting some real world tests in the willklab, using cats as subjects. I have found that microchipping is a very cost effective way of herding controlling cat movement and might be useful if applied to cyclists.

Before you start wailing about "Orwellian controls", pause for a moment to consider the advantages. Firstly, it's relatively painless. I injected them into five cats and they only struggled briefly and I didn't feel a thing (welder's gauntlets ). The chips are light, could be injected in the buttocks (the cyclist's highest point, good for TX/RX) and wouldn't affect streamlining - so may be quite popular.

After that, it's just a matter of each concerned driver fitting a transceiver kit to their vehicle. As a cyclist enters a set perimeter, the chip would activate a beep and an AIS type screen could show which quadrant they are in. If you get too close, the system could activate the seat belt alarm or something. Their IDs would show on the screen, useful if they need to be fined etc.

I can see some potential teething problems - like persuading all cyclists to get the tags in. I would expect them to kick up a bit, but it would benefit society as a whole - a bit like the tagging of sex offenders. There might be some who would try and "free cycle" but they would quickly stand out as the non-beeping riders. Selected motorists (like Bigmuz7) could be issued with Tag-Sticks (a small gas-operated chip injector) and encouraged to "tag" the offenders as they overtake at red lights.

Still, it's all how these things are marketed. After the stunning boom in Geo-caching, the most pointless pursuit know to man, I'd be surprised if they couldn't be persuaded to line up for the tags. Maybe fit roadside transceivers and link them back to a website called www.seehowfariwenttoday.com or suchlike?

It's all to play for and the benefits to the peolpe who actually PAY for the roads are enormous. Somesome should start one of those ePetitions.

Attached Thumbnails
Click image for larger version

Name:	cat.jpg
Views:	46
Size:	105.8 KB
ID:	74705  
__________________
willk is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 08 December 2012, 08:27   #100
RIBnet admin team
 
Poly's Avatar
 
Country: UK - Scotland
Boat name: imposter
Make: FunYak
Length: 3m +
Engine: 2 stroke YAM 20 HP
MMSI: 235089819
Join Date: Sep 2005
Posts: 10,114
I like your thinking Willk. You could probably do the same with pedestrians - who are similarly inconvenient and dangerous to motor vehicles. Oh and a similar approach could be used for car drivers, as identifying them from number plates is a rather inefficient and often ineffective process, combined with some automatic roadside detection equipment and the person's bank account details we could save the driver the inconvenience of filling in and returning the NIP and just collect the payment from their account.

Quote:
link them back to a website called www.seehowfariwenttoday.com or suchlike
ah, you got the URL wrong - I believe Strava | Running and Cycling GPS Tracker, Performance Analytics, Maps, Clubs and Competition is the market leader!
__________________
Poly is offline   Reply With Quote
Reply

Thread Tools Search this Thread
Search this Thread:

Advanced Search

Posting Rules
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

BB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is Off
Trackbacks are Off
Pingbacks are Off
Refbacks are Off





Copyright 2002- Social Knowledge, LLC All Rights Reserved.

All times are GMT -5. The time now is 21:53.


Powered by vBulletin® Version 3.8.8 Beta 1
Copyright ©2000 - 2017, vBulletin Solutions, Inc.