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Old 05 February 2013, 16:43   #41
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Or maybe a tax on your tell tale to see how much water you pump!! Joking. I'm up for better qualifications. Surprises me how often you see people with clearly no idea. That's why I cruise in the dark.
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Old 05 February 2013, 18:08   #42
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No, no, no... and for the record no!

This will be an administrative red tape exercise. The government can hardly fund our existing coastguard network, so any money raised from such an ill conceived scheme (however well intentioned) would simply be wasted.

Rant over!
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Old 05 February 2013, 18:22   #43
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ok - who dared you Whisper to do this, I hope the bet was worth it !

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Old 05 February 2013, 18:42   #44
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ok - who dared you Whisper to do this, I hope the bet was worth it !

S.
No one dared me to do anything, the original question was:

Do you think all water craft should have an annual safety check with a pass or fail like a car MOT?

It's safety question like any other, isn't it?
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Old 05 February 2013, 18:44   #45
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whisper started it... ...is this not the same guy who seems to buy and sell a new boat every week... would he not be permenantly living at the MOT center?
And I didn't expect a personal attack either sugesting the above
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Old 05 February 2013, 18:51   #46
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No one dared me to do anything, the original question was:

Do you think all water craft should have an annual safety check with a pass or fail like a car MOT?

It's safety question like any other, isn't it?
to answer your First Question is No!

Reasons as most have specified,

education not legislation

Even with MOT's you still will have break downs , Green Flag, AA & RAC would been out of business

And currently I think it costs 2500 to code boat with all the coding gear.

Plently of safe guards in place for commercial boats - leisure boats let them be!

S.
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Old 05 February 2013, 18:58   #47
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But a free RNLI safety check is seen as a good thing?
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Old 05 February 2013, 19:03   #48
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But a free RNLI safety check is seen as a good thing?
yes - you don't pass or fail a safety check, you have a talk with an experience person who does not judge you. and you don't need to do get it either

As I said education not legislation


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Old 06 February 2013, 02:09   #49
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Over here we need to be licensed to drive a powerboat capable of 10+ knots. But the test is a joke and there is no further education needed i.e. once you have one its for life basically unless you want to go commercial.

Trailers have to be registered, but there is no roadworthy. IMHO it's a tad silly as trailers tend to be neglected (not just boat trailers) and affect other road users when they break down / wheel comes off due to bad bearings/hubs etc.

Boats have to be registered, but again there is no check that they are seaworthy. You can be pulled over on the water for a spot safety gear check but it's pretty infrequent.

With the number of calls over the VHF in holiday periods with boats breaking down, running out of fuel, idiots just doing dumb things, not having life jackets etc it amazes me we don't have some form of annual inspection that forms part of the registration renewal process.

It happens for cars, no reason it should not happen for boats & their trailers.

FYI we do have an annual safety inspection for our yacht, but it's club based and purely so we are allowed to race in club events. Yes it's a PITA, and takes up a bit of time, but at least we & our crew know all the proper gear is there and operational should it be needed.
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Old 06 February 2013, 02:11   #50
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Even as someone who would do well out of this the answer is no

Darwins law i.e. stupid people have a right to be stupid and if the die being stupid they will live for ever on a few websites:

all the red tape: yee gods man, my life would be hell, cars dont sink when they break down so can you imagine how may forms we would need to fill in to keep the government happy about what we have done and why it was done and who checked it etc.

what about advisories? how would these work

how many people would it put off boating?

I also feel we have to many rules. what ever happened to common sense and taking responsibility for your actions?

If you want to get your boat checked to any level you can do that today so why force people to do it?

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Old 06 February 2013, 03:27   #51
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The US Coastguard can and do inspect boats for the correct items of safety gear on board - flares, life-jackets for everyone on board etc, but nothing for the actual boat as far as I know - this applies to inland waterways and lakes as well.
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Old 06 February 2013, 03:38   #52
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Personally I wouldn't object to paying for an annual MOT my boats. As I see it, it helps get the pieces of unseaworthy crap off the water. It offers an element of safety for the casual users of their RIB who have no mechanical or practical skills and would otherwise cruise round blissfully unaware that their pride and joy is a death trap. It is not a bad thing to keep people on their toes to rectify that stupid fault that you have been meaning to get round to. If the information went onto a central database, the harbour masters could then check boats in the same way that the police check cars. It would possibly help with finding stolen boats. The funds raised could bolster the Coastguards funding.
Whilst they are at it, they could also make it compulsory that you need a licence to operate your boat.

Shall I close the door as I leave?
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Old 06 February 2013, 03:56   #53
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The funds raised could bolster the Coastguards funding.
I think the funds raised will be needed to make the system keep ticking over. Lots of faults in boats can't really be found by a (manageable) Security check. I think you should register your boat, and get a "Safety Check" list with you, and for bigger/faster boat you should need a license, but test - no.
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Old 06 February 2013, 04:00   #54
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Read all these and still NO, if they are cruising around in crap boats full of faults you need to change the owners attitude, a person like this could buy a perfectly good boat and totally neglect it.
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Old 06 February 2013, 04:23   #55
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Yep, count me in, presume the tea will be included in the course fees
I said this as a joke at first but Fiona said it was probably a good idea as when you give up work all the knowledge would be lost.
From my point of view, I just need to earn as much as I can before I retire in 3 years and there are plenty of people with a lot more knowledge than me, someone elses point of view who's sitting here has said, where can you go and get all the knowledge in one place.
I have said this before a while back, I will help almost anyone out, I have an avon in from a ribnetter who wants to be here when I rip his boat to bits, most of us know about little Nathan and his boat that was here, so whisper, if you want to learn how to bend and weld stainless or Ian, not sure what you want, PM me and we can have a chat about what you want to learn and I'll sort something out
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Old 06 February 2013, 04:26   #56
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What would a reasonable cost be for the test & certificate ,

A one off price
A one off price . Certificate only
A one off price certificate then inspector charges per metre to do the actual inspection/ survey,?
Would boats over a certain age be exempt of certain things bit like road tax exempt on old landrovers ( ,eg ,,Old sea rider with osmosis & pop riveted jocky seat ;-)

Food for thought ! Looking at statistics from rescue organisations what is the biggest problem
Man or machine ,
Machinery breakdown
Running out of fuel
Lack or insufficient ground tackle(anchors )
weather /sea conditions
Collision
Intoxication
Running aground
Fouled prop
Navigation .
Fatigue
Person overboard .
Hull / construction / rigging failure !
Fire

As said before Education not legistation .
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Old 06 February 2013, 04:28   #57
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Whisper, you're a bad man for stirring the sandpit

IF, we did have some sort of test/inspection. It would be farmed out to some third party contractor to administer, Capita?. They would be able to sell on your records to 3rd parties as do DVLA.
The price would not reflect the the actual value of the certification. It's a very small market compared to cars, so the revenue to support the admin infrastructure has to be divided amongst the small number of participants i.e. it would cost a fortune, Capita have to make a profit don't you know old boy.
The price would rise year on year above inflation. It would be subject to VAT i.e. it's just another tax really & got phuq all to do with safety.
It would be impossible to enforce, who's going to do that, the police? Don't make me laugh.
In order to enforce the certification, your boat would have to be registered & carry a registration number as on the Continent = more paper work & cost. I'm sure Capita would be able to find another way to make money out of that one.
Only the law abiding types would comply, as per usual, so the numpties would just ignore it, which defeats the whole point of the exercise, as it's the numpties that created the (ill)perceived need in the first place.
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Old 06 February 2013, 05:06   #58
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The US Coastguard can and do inspect boats for the correct items of safety gear on board - flares, life-jackets for everyone on board etc, .
I can just imagaine the reaction in the Solent to that

I witnessed first hand the apoplectic rage of some boat owners off Weymouth when we come alongside them and only asked if they had a London 2012 permit
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Old 06 February 2013, 05:15   #59
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I agree that education would be the best option, but how do you make it compulsory? The British are by nature rebellious and will not bother unless forced.
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Old 06 February 2013, 05:33   #60
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licencing--NO,NO,NO

Have you guys forgotten our history?

We Brits for ever and ever have always had rights to freely go to sea in whatever we wish with the very minimum of rules and regulations. This is almost written in stone and must never be lost.

The thought of another bunch of Civil Servants policing us and our boats cannot be considered.

Peterthelight
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