Mayday instructions ? - Page 2

Poly · 12 May 2015, 15:57

Quote:

Originally Posted by Starovich

Would make it easier to just push the button, especially if the users have no clue where you currently at.

And the sib, wafi, sailing club rescue boat or other non dsc user a mile away will be oblivious to the issue. CG may well relay your location by voice but it's not necessarily easy for those boats to quickly compute a lat long into that boat over the otherside of the bay!

ShinyShoe · 12 May 2015, 19:01

Quote:

Originally Posted by Starovich

Having some untrained, inexperienced, person trying to describe where they are while having no clue, will not expedite a rescue.
You dont want a conversation, you need assistance.
The signal transmitted gives lat/long
In addition some other radio sets (not CG) will sound an alarm and display the location of the casualty vessel with bearing and distance (at least mine does), which could mean faster assistance.

As I said push button followed by voice, even if that's just 'I need help' ... It takes the doubt away that the DSC alert is a false alarm.

jyasaki · 13 May 2015, 04:15

Quote:

Originally Posted by ShinyShoe

As I said push button followed by voice, even if that's just 'I need help' ... It takes the doubt away that the DSC alert is a false alarm.

Are you implying that a button-initiated DSC mayday is given a lower priority than a voice call?

That doesn't sound right.

jky

Starovich · 13 May 2015, 07:19

Quote:

Originally Posted by Poly

And the sib, wafi, sailing club rescue boat or other non dsc user a mile away will be oblivious to the issue. CG may well relay your location by voice but it's not necessarily easy for those boats to quickly compute a lat long into that boat over the otherside of the bay!

and of course the CG are so stupid that they cant look at the lat long and describe the position to non dsc vessels......

I am not saying don't use voice, i am being a realist, in a real emergency, (fire on board) a non boaty will not be worried about protocol and the "right" way to do, so the simplest is the best.

If it's a MOB and the button is pushed the CG with have a start point to work from and they have fairly comprehensive drift calculations a to figure out a start area.

Any way i provided links to a script for Trimix as well, so I am not sure why the high horses are out?

willk · 13 May 2015, 08:00

Quote:

Originally Posted by Starovich

Would make it easier to just push the button, especially if the users have no clue where you currently at.

Quote:

Originally Posted by Starovich

Having some untrained, inexperienced, person trying to describe where they are while having no clue, will not expedite a rescue.
You dont want a conversation, you need assistance.
The signal transmitted gives lat/long
In addition some other radio sets (not CG) will sound an alarm and display the location of the casualty vessel with bearing and distance (at least mine does), which could mean faster assistance.

Quote:

Originally Posted by Starovich

......so I am not sure why the high horses are out?

In my case, I disagreed with you because you posted opinion that (to my reading) downplayed the importance of PAX being able to make VOX contact in the event on an emergency. I'm not on my high horse BTW, I just thought that your advice was at best limited in it's scope or at worst, dangerous. In fairness, you have clarified your position re voice comms and it seems to be the same as the other posters - eg, DSC alert followed by VOX if required. If you read over your posts above, you'll see where some readers could have misunderstood your comments? Anyway - all good now

Chunk · 13 May 2015, 08:06

No one else picking up the irony of the French ignoring an English "m'aidez"

Avocet · 13 May 2015, 09:51

The same irony would apply to a 'Pan-pan' call.

For what it's worth, here is the Mayday procedure sign stuck on Grimalkin's console next to the radio:

MAYDAY PROCEDURE

1. Open the cover of the RED distress button
2. Press the RED distress button momentarily
3. If time allows select the nature of the distress (ie fire, sinking, collision etc)
4. Press and hold the RED distress button for five seconds or until the unit tells you that the message has been sent
5. Release the RED distress button. The unit will set itself to Channel 16.
6. Wait 15 seconds or until an acknowledgement of the signal is received.
7. Press the button on the microphone and, speaking slowly and clearly, say:

"Mayday, Mayday, Mayday. This is RIB Grimalkin, Grimalkin, Grimalkin. My MMSI number is 235050647. My Call Sign is Mike Victor November Uniform Six. Mayday RIB Grimalkin. MMSI number 235050647, Call Sign Mike Victor November Uniform Six.

My position is [give position in latitude and longitude from GPS or true bearing and distance from known landmark]

I am [give nature of distress: eg on fire/sinking/swamped/man overboard]

I require immediate assistance.

There are [number] people on board. Over."

WDI · 13 May 2015, 10:37

Quote:

Originally Posted by Avocet

...This is RIB Grimalkin...

Here's a query for those of you with SIBs.
Would you say "This is SIB 'blah blah'..."?

SIB still seems to be a somewhat unknown term in some areas outside of our circle. I even know RIB owners who've never heard the term.

Thoughts?

blootac · 13 May 2015, 10:56

I was taught to say
"... This is <boat name>, I am a 3.8m inflatable boat with 2 people on board..."
If needs be give more information at the end of the call, such as colour etc.

If I was kayaking I'd say
"This is kayak <blah>, I am 3m purple kayak" or something to that effect, as in my mind the purple does add great benefit to a very small footprint.

Important thing is to get the crucial information out first such as where you are then add additional information.

You could say that you're a RIB and include the length. From a helicopter or even sea level from a distance you're going to look pretty similar and you'd hope that most people involved in the rescue would work out that a 2/3/4m RIB isn't going to be dissimilar to a SIB anyway. Exceptions being perhaps that a 4m RIB is more likely to have a fixed VHF not handheld and possibly more likely to have more lifesaving items like (more) flares, food/water etc than perhaps a 4m SIB... depends how well stocked you are...

Being a SIBber, I'd probably just call it a RIB anyway. Shorter and fewer words to say.

Being pedantic about your hull construction is likely to be the least of your worries in that situation!

WDI · 13 May 2015, 11:03

That pretty much echoes my thoughts.

In a Mayday situation I may well be keen to make it clear that I'm in an inflatable with shallow draft and not a solid hulled boat.
Hence my reluctance to use terms like SIB which it seems are often misunderstood.

willk · 13 May 2015, 11:10

Quote:

Originally Posted by WDI

Hence my reluctance to use terms like SIB which it seems are often misunderstood.

Yeah, SIB is very much a RIBnet term. I suspect it was introduced in a mad moment of Inclusiveness to keep the inflatable brigade happy

"Rubber dinghy" would probably work best

Pikey Dave · 13 May 2015, 12:21

Quote:

Originally Posted by Chunk

No one else picking up the irony of the French ignoring an English "m'aidez"

I fairness to the French, depending on atmospherics we quite often pick up English boats & CG traffic whilst we're in France, Solent CG heard an English voice & stepped in probably not knowing where the call originated from, if it had been a French voice, the CG in Cherbourg would have picked it up. TBH, who responds is irrelevant, as long as someone does

John Kennett · 13 May 2015, 12:24

Quote:

Originally Posted by willk

Yeah, SIB is very much a RIBnet term. I suspect it was introduced in a mad moment of Inclusiveness to keep the inflatable brigade happy

Looking back through the archives the term appears to be Scandinavian in origin, but was popularised here by Keith (where is he now?) Hart just after the turn of the century.
http://www.rib.net/forum/f50/inshore-248.html

Bern Hanreck · 13 May 2015, 12:45

Quote:

Originally Posted by John Kennett

Looking back through the archives the term appears to be Scandinavian in origin, but was popularised here by Keith (where is he now?) Hart just after the turn of the century.
http://www.rib.net/forum/f50/inshore-248.html

Yes , but he never did like to be " bracketed in " with the rest of us........

He far preferred his own brackets........

sorry thread drift......

gotchiguy · 13 May 2015, 14:50

Is it acceptable to say "RIB Into the Red" these days rather than "Motor Yacht Into the Red"?

Edit: perhaps acceptable isn't the right word since pretty much anything is "acceptable" in a mayday situation...but "proper"...is "RIB" proper.....

John Kennett · 13 May 2015, 15:01

Describing a RIB as a motor yacht would be unhelpful and frankly a bit silly!

blootac · 13 May 2015, 15:03

Quote:

Originally Posted by gotchiguy

Is it acceptable to say "RIB Into the Red" these days rather than "Motor Yacht Into the Red"?

I don't understand...

Someone explain?

Wibs · 13 May 2015, 15:32

Gotchiguy is just asking if implying your a rib in a mayday call is acceptable rather than implying that your a motor boat.?

My advice would be to be as clear and factual as you can in that first broadcast.(You may not get another chance.!!)

So, for me it would be to describe my vessel as a rib and also the size.

ShinyShoe · 13 May 2015, 19:16

Quote:

Originally Posted by jyasaki

Are you implying that a button-initiated DSC mayday is given a lower priority than a voice call?

That doesn't sound right.

jky

There is a process to be followed in the CG station.

In case 1 a boat in distress presses red button followed by a voice call on 16 (the 'correct' way)

In case 2 a boat in distress does a voice only call. Still correct. Fractionally quicker to make the voice first contact but inevitably slower / prone to error in positioning. The end of the initial 2 way call is likely to be longer than case 1.

In case 3 that appeared to be described of just red button and nothing more, the CG station would digitally acknowledge the distress. But as they know very little they don't know what assets to deploy, they will await a voice call on 16 per the DSC protocol. That means they leave 16 free and listen... Patiently.
At some point they will then call the vessel. But they then need to know what to call it. The MMSI is not exactly snappy and if someone hit red but doesn't know protocol they may not know the MMSI. So they need to look up the vessel details from CG66, the IMO database etc. Then call it. I'd say from DSC alerts I've heard where there was no voice call that can be 2-3 minutes before the voice call out is made saying something like... "Vessel ABC, Vessel ABC MMSI 123567890 this is xx Coastguard, over" on contact "We have received a DSC Distress Alert from your vessel, can you confirm all is OK on board, over?

If no response was achieved then they will deploy assets to investigate. But depending on location, etc that may be a request to any vessel in the area with information. They may be phoning shore contacts or mobile numbers. Some of these things can happen in parallel.

Give them enough to be live the brown stuff is really hitting the fan and I'm sure assets will be deployed faster. So an accompanying EPIRB / PLB activation, or even a selected type if distress type may mean they are less likely to think it an accidental activation.

Cheeki Rafiki activated a PLB and despite Boston CG knowing she was shipping water there was a pause if 17 minutes while they tried to contact the boat including by Email! I really hope if I ever press red or PLB that someone doesn't email me to say am I OK!

willk · 13 May 2015, 19:35

Quote:

Originally Posted by John Kennett

Looking back through the archives the term appears to be Scandinavian in origin, but was popularised here by Keith (where is he now?) Hart just after the turn of the century.
http://www.rib.net/forum/f50/inshore-248.html

The Archives are amazing Boss. There's so much information back there!

Quite a bit of Evidence too....