I should be in Norway ...

Chris Murray · 14 June 2005, 20:15

About now, my wife and I should be landing in Norway for the start of a 12 day holiday.

What's this got to do with RIBs you may ask?

Thanks to the driver of a RIB on the Sunday of RIBEX, my wife has damaged her back and is in quite a lot of pain, leaving her unable to travel.

I shall not name the RIB or its driver but the cause of the problem was the RIB continually landing on one side and not "flying" level. Unfortunately, the helmsman didn't once check to see if the passengers were OK, so the problem was compounded by repeated bad landings. In addition, the engine was so noisy that I couldn't hear what my wife was trying to tell me, so she gave up trying.

Not only has this screwed up our holiday but my wife can probably look forward to this problem for six weeks or more.

I hope that we can all learn a lesson from this.

Chris.

Petrov · 14 June 2005, 20:38

Sorry to hear Chris, i hope your wife will get better fast.
We drive around 800 hours charter every year and the security of the PAX is always nr: 1.
For me it sounds like the driver was a salesman and not a driver, drive a boat as you explained sounds really irresponsible, it doesnt sound like he had any experience at all.

Hope this doesnt destroy your thoughts of ribs.

codprawn · 14 June 2005, 20:41

In fairness if YOU couldn't see your wife was in distress what chance would the driver have???

Petrov · 14 June 2005, 20:49

Quote:

In fairness if YOU couldn't see your wife was in distress what chance would the driver have???

Absolutely but as i se it the problem is not to hear or se in this case its the handling of boat wich will make the PAX comfortable.

MarkWildey · 14 June 2005, 22:18

Chris

As someone who suffers, at the chiro 11am Wednesday,from a bad back I know how the bad the pain can be. I would suspect that the RIB ride showed up a weakness in her back that could have been caused by any normal movement.

Get the peas out of the freezer , get some anti-inflammatories from your doctor to tide you over until you can get an appointment from the chiropractor is my advice.

Good luck and best wishes to your wife.

Mark

Chris Murray · 15 June 2005, 07:11

Mark and Petrov - Thank you for your kind wishes.

Mark, this was not an existing problem, my wife has damaged her coccyx, the lowest part of her spine, which may actually be fractured. Apparently, there is no specific recovery time for this type of injury, whether badly bruised or fractured, but 6 weeks or longer is not unusual.

There is no question about the cause. When I mentioned that the boat was landing on its side, the salesman (who had stayed on land) said that this was because the boat wasn't loaded evenly (3 people on board). I should have thought that if this was expected to be the outcome, then either a fourth person should have joined us to balance the boat, or we could have moved to other seats so as to try to minimise the problem. Handling the boat differently might have resolved the problem.

We are not newcomers to boating - I owned my last boat - a 23ft sports cruiser, with a 5.7 litre V8, which used to cruise at 30kts - for 14 years. We travelled across the Chanel, down to Cornwall etc. in various types of seas and yes - we did occasionally land on the "flat", rather than on the Vee.

Importantly, I would always check that the passengers were OK, after such a landing and I am talking about an occassional landing, not something that was almost continuous.

My wife is not keen on boats generally and this episode has done little to help her enthusiasm. Fortunately (for me) my daughter also loves the sea and powerboating, so we shall still be getting a new RIB for the 2006 season. But it won't be from the unmentionable manufacturer whose boats seem to run along on their side!

Regards,

Chris.

MarkWildey · 15 June 2005, 07:45

Chris

Bad news all round.

In my view even if the boat was initially loaded badly the driver should have been able to change the angle on take off or landing to counter act this effect.

My previous boat which was diesel and had a single prop used to lean right over

when getting onto the plane. With a little practice I could stop this happening.

If a dealer doesn't know his boat what hope do we

Good luck

Mark

Cookee · 15 June 2005, 08:42

If it was landing on the left side repeatedly and it is a normal rotation gearbox, it is most likely to be the result of being trimmed in (down) to much. The other possibility is of course badly set trim tabs, but that would be really dumb!

Petrov · 15 June 2005, 09:46

Driver should also be able to compensate the rotation av the prop by turning the steering wheel fast and short to the right, that will make the boat go more straight thrue the waves.

swginn · 15 June 2005, 09:59

Chris, sorry to hear about your wife's injury.

Quote:

Originally Posted by Codprawn

In fairness if YOU couldn't see your wife was in distress what chance would the driver have???

That really is no excuse. Anytime I bring anybody new out on my RIB I check on the passengers constantly and, I don't mean just looking back. We stop the RIB and ask them if everything is ok and if they are comfortable, etc.

I really can't understand how this could happen. Obviously the so-called helmsman didin't have a clue about the RIB and hadn't the slightest clue about passenger safety. Please do name and shame, if only to ensure it doesn't happen to anybody else on here.

Something similar happened last yr at RIBEX with a RIB not flying level and being poorly driven: http://www.rib.net/forum/showthread....ding+port+side

codprawn · 15 June 2005, 12:46

Quote:

Originally Posted by swginn

Chris, sorry to hear about your wife's injury.

That really is no excuse. Anytime I bring anybody new out on my RIB I check on the passengers constantly and, I don't mean just looking back. We stop the RIB and ask them if everything is ok and if they are comfortable, etc.

I really can't understand how this could happen. Obviously the so-called helmsman didin't have a clue about the RIB and hadn't the slightest clue about passenger safety. Please do name and shame, if only to ensure it doesn't happen to anybody else on here.

Something similar happened last yr at RIBEX with a RIB not flying level and being poorly driven: http://www.rib.net/forum/showthread....ding+port+side

Agree there - he should have checked but I know for a fact if I was suffering that much I would have spoken up - or just pulled the kill cord out!!!!

I agree too many people don't have a clue about balancing a boat - they just don't seem to understand c of g or lateral balance - God help them if they were ever involved in light aviation!!!

quinquarimarine · 15 June 2005, 20:28

All the more reason for the policy of all PAX vls plus others where possible should have the helm aft and all pax in front. Thus anyone with discomfort or concern simply has to raise their arms in the air. Our policy is always to fit out aft consol.

For some vls this can cause a problem as the tanks are also fitted aft and with an aft consol etc this affects balance in the longitunal. Cod Prawn ... sorry to but in but this is balance ie. during construction, whilst trim ( not to be confused with outboard trim) is transverse and longit. trim using cargo (pax).

A shame about the incident but unforunately they do occur in all environs. If at sea then such needs to be reported to MAIB.

Cheers

John
www.quinquari.co.uk

codprawn · 16 June 2005, 02:11

Quote:

Originally Posted by quinquarimarine

All the more reason for the policy of all PAX vls plus others where possible should have the helm aft and all pax in front. Thus anyone with discomfort or concern simply has to raise their arms in the air. Our policy is always to fit out aft consol.

For some vls this can cause a problem as the tanks are also fitted aft and with an aft consol etc this affects balance in the longitunal. Cod Prawn ... sorry to but in but this is balance ie. during construction, whilst trim ( not to be confused with outboard trim) is transverse and longit. trim using cargo (pax).

A shame about the incident but unforunately they do occur in all environs. If at sea then such needs to be reported to MAIB.

Cheers

John
www.quinquari.co.uk

Couldn't agree more John - obviously a true commercial RIB is going to be very stern heavy until carrying it's full pax load which is the way it should be. Conversely most leisure RIBS have their consoles too far aft which combined with the engines and passengers also at the back make them very stern heavy ALL the time!!!

Alan · 16 June 2005, 11:14

Quote:

Originally Posted by codprawn

Couldn't agree more John - obviously a true commercial RIB is going to be very stern heavy until carrying it's full pax load which is the way it should be. Conversely most leisure RIBS have their consoles too far aft which combined with the engines and passengers also at the back make them very stern heavy ALL the time!!!

Oh dear Codders, you're talking bollox again. You really should try and think before putting finger to keyboard. most leisure ribs, come off it. some leisure ribs sure but most no i dont think so. In fact I cant recall personally being on a leisure rib where I would say the console is too far aft. And I've been on a few ribs. Mebbe we're talking about your virtual ribbing world again eh?

codprawn · 16 June 2005, 12:01

Quote:

Originally Posted by Alan

Oh dear Codders, you're talking bollox again. You really should try and think before putting finger to keyboard. most leisure ribs, come off it. some leisure ribs sure but most no i dont think so. In fact I cant recall personally being on a leisure rib where I would say the console is too far aft. And I've been on a few ribs. Mebbe we're talking about your virtual ribbing world again eh?

Am I really??? Apart from Humber just LOOK at most leisure RIBS!!! Console amidships - engine at the back - passengers at the back - why not move the console further forward???

Notice I said MOST - not ALL!!!!

Richard B · 16 June 2005, 12:47

Depends on a lot more factors - where is the fuel tank? Where is the hull's C of G? How is the RIB loaded?

Many small RIBs need weight up front for pitch stability, hence the console further forwards, but the further back you sit, the less you move, so it's desirable from a comfort point if view to sit as far back as possible, and put the fuel and luggage up front. Bigger (ie longer) RIBs are easier to balance, and I've found that as I get to know the handling of our RIB better I have been able to lighten the bow and gain the advantage of running the boat lighter, hence faster, and benefit from better engine trim control.

codprawn · 16 June 2005, 14:50

Quote:

Originally Posted by Richard B

Depends on a lot more factors - where is the fuel tank? Where is the hull's C of G? How is the RIB loaded?

Many small RIBs need weight up front for pitch stability, hence the console further forwards, but the further back you sit, the less you move, so it's desirable from a comfort point if view to sit as far back as possible, and put the fuel and luggage up front. Bigger (ie longer) RIBs are easier to balance, and I've found that as I get to know the handling of our RIB better I have been able to lighten the bow and gain the advantage of running the boat lighter, hence faster, and benefit from better engine trim control.

Very true Rich BUT if you start to take off from big waves you will find that the bow tends to flip up and the stern crashes down - a classic example of why bow ballast tanks were invented I suppose!!!

The Garfish · 16 June 2005, 15:17

Quote:

Originally Posted by codprawn

you will find that the bow tends to flip up and the stern crashes down

Nott onn yorr fkin raypyer ull wiv enjin jakk itt wownt. yewl fynd dat de bowe duz a gud impreshun ov bein a shuvvel. itul dropp fasster dan camiller porker bowlsis drors wen ders a bitt ov royul nobb abowt.

gArf

sp. ow didd yew doo wiv yorr fkin o levvels.

The Garfish · 16 June 2005, 15:22

Quote:

Originally Posted by The Garfish

sp. ow didd yew doo wiv yorr fkin o levvels.

downt bee a twatt yew twatt. yew meen de 11-

gArf

codprawn · 16 June 2005, 15:29

Quote:

Originally Posted by The Garfish

Nott onn yorr fkin raypyer ull wiv enjin jakk itt wownt. yewl fynd dat de bowe duz a gud impreshun ov bein a shuvvel. itul dropp fasster dan camiller porker bowlsis drors wen ders a bitt ov royul nobb abowt.

gArf

sp. ow didd yew doo wiv yorr fkin o levvels.

get STUFFED you mean???