Do I have a leg to stand on.......

hatt11 · 10 July 2009, 16:50

Hi everyone,

Some of you may have followed my previous posts with regards my boat and the ongoing trouble I have had with the attatchment of the tubes and the eventual failures!

I have decided to bite the bullet and go for a retube. I contacted Chris at Henshaws who has just been so helpful in assisting me in finding a cost effective solution to my problem, so my biggest thanks to him and his staff.

Further to this it has now been bought to my attention that the boat doesnt carry a CE marking with regards it being fit for purpose and so im getting ready to light the bonfire!!

I have been thinking today surely although I didnt buy this boat directly from the manufacturer it was sold to me as a new boat that just wasnt fitted with an engine and had never seen the sea. I do have the original invoice and it was from Robinson Marine in Southampton. I have contacted Jack Bowran at Gemini Industries with regards this and he claims he doesnt sell boats and has been in Belgium for the last 20 years despite having a website that is selling boats to the UK market. He is claiming that he just supplied the tubes to Robinson Marine and that they constructed the hull, (despite it being exactly the same hull as shown on the Gemini Indutries web site)

Now I am really not clued up on how to deal with these situations and maybe you guys have had some past experience, but do I have a leg to stand on in approaching Robinson Marine with regards a boat being manufactured and sold not bearing a CE mark although I was not the original purchaser. It turns out the original purchase was made 3.5 years ago now surely a new boat should carry some sort of warranty?

Obviously I am going to go ahead and have a retube but have plenty of photos and documentation with regards the tube failure so if needed could be refered to. Obviously my concern is with regards the boat now not carrying a CE mark.

Sorry for the long winded intro, but would really like some sound advice with regards this as it has cost me a small fortune so far.

Luke

neilda · 10 July 2009, 16:56

You're not the original purchaser (this could be problematic, do warranties always transfer, was their paperwork transferring any warranty?), the original purchase was 3.5 years ago - what is the normal warranty period on this boat/hull?

It sounds like it would be an awkward case to get any legal traction on.

However the vendor has sold you something that is not as it should be, the first port of call will be him. Perhaps through Trading Standards?

Poly · 10 July 2009, 17:01

Luke - as I understand it legal responsibility for CE marking lies with the person introducing the boat onto the market, i.e. Robson Marine. You have no contract with Robson Marine; therefore no real option for come back against them. However Robson Marine may be willing to discuss it, especially if they thought the consequence of not dealing with your concerns was a visit from trading standards

.

However what do you want as the satisfactory outcome? You almost certainly won't get your money back. You might get a bit of paper for CE certification purposes - but it will probably be meaningless (some people argue even the most reputable company's one is pretty worthless).

Your issue will be if you try to sell it, and people realise the paperwork isn't right. But, not meaning to be rude, but if people realise its got gemini "pedigree" thats not going to help you sell it anyway!

hatt11 · 10 July 2009, 17:20

Quote:

Originally Posted by Polwart

However what do you want as the satisfactory outcome? You almost certainly won't get your money back. You might get a bit of paper for CE certification purposes - but it will probably be meaningless (some people argue even the most reputable company's one is pretty worthless).

Ultimately I just want a boat that I can be happy with and use confidentally and Im sure Henshaws are going to manage just that.

However when I purchased the boat it had never seen the sea and for it to basically fall apart within 2 years of seeing water is not good. Still as you say me not being the original purchaser I probably dont have a come back but am considering persuing either directly or via trading standards and see what they come up with!

Thanks for your comments,

Luke

Nos4r2 · 10 July 2009, 17:22

Quote:

Originally Posted by hatt11

Ultimately I just want a boat that I can be happy with and use confidentally and Im sure Henshaws are going to manage just that.

However when I purchased the boat it had never seen the sea and for it to basically fall apart within 2 years of seeing water is not good. Still as you say me not being the original purchaser I probably dont have a come back but am considering persuing either directly or via trading standards and see what they come up with!

Thanks for your comments,

Luke

It's not one of those appaling plywood ribs from the Gemini site is it?

hatt11 · 10 July 2009, 17:26

I havent come accross any wood yet! To be fair the hull is very sound.

Poly · 10 July 2009, 17:31

Quote:

Originally Posted by hatt11

Ultimately I just want a boat that I can be happy with and use confidentally and Im sure Henshaws are going to manage just that.

However when I purchased the boat it had never seen the sea and for it to basically fall apart within 2 years of seeing water is not good. Still as you say me not being the original purchaser I probably dont have a come back but am considering persuing either directly or via trading standards and see what they come up with!

Thanks for your comments,

Luke

So an individual bought it and never put it in the water?

hatt11 · 10 July 2009, 17:38

yes he was made redundant and didnt have the funds to fit an engine hence I thought I was getting a bargain of a new boat!! How Naieve!

Downhilldai · 10 July 2009, 17:45

Dare I ask how much you paid for it?

Pete7 · 11 July 2009, 22:10

Luke, more bad news I am afraid, from Boatmad:

http://boatmad.com/forum/showthread....obinson+marine

Pete

Jizm · 12 July 2009, 05:18

Quote:

Originally Posted by Pete7

Luke, more bad news I am afraid, from Boatmad:

http://boatmad.com/forum/showthread....obinson+marine

Pete

That makes interesting reading, are they still about? the www.robinsonmarineservices.com does not seem to work.

hatt11 · 12 July 2009, 07:35

Quote:

Originally Posted by Pete7

Luke, more bad news I am afraid, from Boatmad:

http://boatmad.com/forum/showthread....obinson+marine

Pete

Cheers Pete,

Unfortunately I found that yesterday in my search for information. Very interesting indeed, have managed to contact someone there through the email address who claim the person who ran the company has died and hence they have ceased trading! Ironically this happened before the boat was sold!!

I see there is a member on here called Dave9960 who has on his profile that his boat was manufactured by Robinson Marine. I have PM'd him to see what his experiences have been.

Thanks all for your comments!

Luke

paul tilley · 13 July 2009, 12:22

i find it a bit strange that you are complaining about being sold a boat that is not up to standard yet you are happy to advertise the tubes off said boat as in excellent condition for some poor mug to buy ,isnt this double standards .you are upset at being ripped off yet are prepaired to rip off someone else with these tubes that are only fit for the bin or to be given away at a push. this might not win your approval but it is the truth in my opinion

PeterM · 13 July 2009, 12:39

To sit on the fence ;

Is this a case of the tubes are OK - but not stuck to the hull very well, so rather than bugger about he is going for a full on re-tube from Henshaw ( I imagine to get confidence back in the boat) , but the tubes could well be of use to someone to adjust & re-fit if you have the experiance etc?

They are good condition in that they hold air - haven't been worn away ( or near the water much! ) so aren't faded, worn, repaired etc ?

Possibly just a case of some contradiction/ misunderstanding/ lack of clarity in what is actually 'wrong' with them. Wrong can mean a lot of things to different people .

codprawn · 13 July 2009, 12:43

But surely if the tubes were perfect it would be easy enough to just attach them properly???

agains sitting on the fence - ouch....................

PeterM · 13 July 2009, 13:13

Maybe - I know I'd be happier with a re-tube from Henshaw than trying to fix somehting that was never quite 'right' .

I'm sure the tubes will be of use to someone - if only for spare material / patches / inner tubes, dust cover , curtains , clothes , waterproof jacket etc ( dont Quba make clothes from 'used sail cloth' - business opportuniy - clothes from ' used rib tube' clothing ? .

ocrda · 13 July 2009, 13:58

I think you will find that this is basically a very good boat. The only real let down being the plastic tubes with seperate bladder, some 2 pack foam holding the fuel tank in that blocks the underfloor drain holes and the steering.
We have one as our club safety boat. We eventually bit the bullet and had Paul Tilley of TIDEL re tube it (at very reasonable cost and he made a cracking job of it).
We took the console and tank out removed the 2 pack foam, clearing the drain holes (got several litres of water out) and fitted Baystar steering.
It is now a really nice boat.

Good Luck

Bob

hatt11 · 13 July 2009, 14:55

Paul,

You have completely misunderstood me.

The tubes are as they would have been when they left Gemini other than one end cone needs abit of glue. The issue is the attachment which has failed, and I neither have the time or skills to do this myself and rather than pay £650 to have them proffesionally attached I have gone for a full retube with Henshaws, to one ensure I have no further problems with regards my tubes and two to give me some confidence back in the boat.

Appologies if you felt I was trying to rip someone off I have just thought they might help someone who cant afford a retube at the moment either the whole tubes or just the inner tubes. As I say the tubes themselves are in great condition its just been the attatchment and the fact they are the Gemini Industries tubes!

I am an honest guy and wouldnt sell/give anything if I felt it was cr*p.

Luke

Quote:

Originally Posted by paul tilley

i find it a bit strange that you are complaining about being sold a boat that is not up to standard yet you are happy to advertise the tubes off said boat as in excellent condition for some poor mug to buy ,isnt this double standards .you are upset at being ripped off yet are prepaired to rip off someone else with these tubes that are only fit for the bin or to be given away at a push. this might not win your approval but it is the truth in my opinion

paul tilley · 13 July 2009, 16:05

hat11 dont sell the tubes then give them away it will save you a lot of embarrassment in the future .i can assure you i have only seen 5 sets of these tubes and all were crap !!!!

ocrda · 13 July 2009, 17:09

Quote:

Originally Posted by paul tilley

hat11 dont sell the tubes then give them away it will save you a lot of embarrassment in the future .i can assure you i have only seen 5 sets of these tubes and all were crap !!!!

Dont you mean "they were'nt very good" ??