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Old 12 October 2017, 13:13   #1
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Best nav light set up

Hi - own this 4.5m Avon and I want to be able to set up nav lights. I'm consider fitting an A frame as one option but what would be some other options ? I considered a short pole at the bow with a tricolor of red, green and white as these are easy to buy and I could use a stowaway light pole - ideas ?Click image for larger version

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Old 12 October 2017, 13:18   #2
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I would add I want to keep the budget low, the use at night is only occasional, removable is perfectly acceptable too
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Old 12 October 2017, 13:37   #3
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add a pole at the rear if you don't want to go A-frame as it needs to be behind you. I used a B&Q Ariel pole on my first boat.
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Old 12 October 2017, 14:40   #4
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I used This Led, simple 2 wire connection, low power draw easy fixing on a 5 m rib. Worked well.
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Old 12 October 2017, 15:03   #5
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Quote:
Originally Posted by cgf10 View Post
I would add I want to keep the budget low, the use at night is only occasional, removable is perfectly acceptable too
So a set of these and cable tie them onto the life lines if its only really emergency use??


Emergency Navigation Light Set (Set of 3) - Emergency Navigation Lights - Discount Marine Chandlery and Sailing Equipment. Bargain Boat Spares and Clothing
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Old 12 October 2017, 16:00   #6
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If you want a proper job, then A-frame would be the way to go. Light-poles are fine but it's about as expensive as a second-hand A-frame given you want something a little more robust than something from a homeware store. Battery lights are good suggestion if trips are going to be once in a blue moon.

Other things to factor in if you do opt for A-frame is storage. My boat fits in standard garage so height is limiting factor for up and over door. You can get folding A-frames (hinged), although no experience of them.

Wire in using tinned cable to a Carling marine switch.
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Old 12 October 2017, 16:32   #7
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Thanks guys. I appreciate all these ideas. I'm leaning towards an A frame as it would be a lot easier to mount in the right places etc. just have to decide if I'm really really going to use it enough at night - anyone got a suitable second hand single aframe ?
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Old 12 October 2017, 16:53   #8
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http://www.navisafe.com/project/2-na...-suction-base/
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Old 13 October 2017, 01:56   #9
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[Thread_Hijack] I've come back to boating after a career largely spent away from the coast, and only occaisional trips out... but I grew up in boats, used them day and night; and in almost all weathers.

We never used lights

Now, I wouldn't condone that sort of behaviour in 2017, but surely there must be situations where "turning a blind eye" to running without lights could be appropriate??? (e.g., very small craft, unpowered craft, away from trafficked channels???)

[/Thread_Hijack]
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Old 13 October 2017, 02:37   #10
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I would recommend portable LED Lights which run on batteries. I have used Navisafe on my J/24 sailboat and am very happy with them. Waterproof and can be stowed away when not needed, while the mounts remain in place.


Have a range of mounting options as well to choose from. For your application, I would recommend either a single tricolour or a white all round mounted on a pole aft, and a bicolour affixed to the bow.

Here's a link to their website for more info: NAVISAFE | PORTABLE NAVIGATION LIGHTS

Available on Amazon for ease of purchase.

Cheers
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Old 13 October 2017, 12:51   #11
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If you travel at 7 knots at night, all you need is an all around white. So a pole with a white camping lamp tie wrapped to the transom will do.

Above that you need the full lights, and your head testing as you cannot see that log/person/mooring buoy that you are about to run into.
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Old 14 October 2017, 16:36   #12
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If you travel at 7 knots at night, all you need is an all around white. So a pole with a white camping lamp tie wrapped to the transom will do.



Above that you need the full lights, and your head testing as you cannot see that log/person/mooring buoy that you are about to run into.


Technically it's the capability of the boat rather than its actual speed that matters. I agree in any kind of busy area you probably won't be doing planing speeds, but MY priority would be making sure anyone who is doesn't run in to me and a camping lantern flapping around on zip ties might not quite do that. My solution is a (removable) pole with a white above (seated) head height and red/greens on the console. A frames can be useful for aerial etc too - but on such a small boat can get in the way.
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Old 15 October 2017, 02:01   #13
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Technically rule 23 d (ii) of COLREGS states 'whose maximum speed does not exceed 7 knots' it does not refer to the maximum capability of the vessel. Thus the single light imposes a speed limit on the vessel

Rule 22 c) states the light has to have a visibility range of 2miles

Annex 1 3d states that the single light shall be located as far forward as practicable. This is open to some interpretation depending on the vessel.

There does not appear to be any rules about how the lights and fixings are constructed, they just have to comply.

It is always prudent to exceed the compliance requirements, but not to exceed the 7kn limit, or any lower limit imposed by a harbour bylaw. I have taught night navigation in a large harbour area and 7kn is a sensible safe limit for yourself and others. Thus an all around white is sufficient for occasional use
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Old 15 October 2017, 03:09   #14
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And the allround white has to be a minimum of a metre above port/stbd lights
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Old 15 October 2017, 06:17   #15
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On a practical note make sure the white is behind the helm and if the red and green are on the console they don't reflect off anything to damage your night vision I've been known to turn of instrument back lights and get crew to monitor plotter to avoid affecting my night vision
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Old 15 October 2017, 13:43   #16
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Also remember if fitting at the rear (a-frame) that the boat probably sits nose up relative to when at rest so the forward end of the toobs might obscure the r/g if your a frame goes vertically up inside the toobs.

I got someone to take a pic of my not on the plane and I ended up having to fit my r/g a good foot above the tubes to still be seen from dead ahead.
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Old 15 October 2017, 14:42   #17
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Quote:
Originally Posted by rkk01 View Post
[Thread_Hijack]
We never used lights

Now, I wouldn't condone that sort of behaviour in 2017, but surely there must be situations where "turning a blind eye" to running without lights could be appropriate??? (e.g., very small craft, unpowered craft, away from trafficked channels???)
[/Thread_Hijack]
The Col Regs define situations where "full" Nav Lights are not required.
  • Sailing Vessels < 7m (is that your small craft? it doesn't include power boats)
  • Vessels underway with oars (normally small craft, but again not using an outboard)

Both cases need a white light that can be shone in sufficient time to prevent a collision... (A torch will do)
  • A power driven vessel <7m, speed* <7knots can display an all round white if not possible to display full lights

*I've never established if that is travelling <7kts or capable of <7kts. e.g. can you use your rib at displacement speeds in the dark with just an all round white as long as you only displacement speed it?

Your risk assessment of no channel has some logic as less likelihood of other vessels. But does that mean the few that are there are not expecting a random unlit vessel to appear.

I'd be expecting to attract attention of Border Force etc if I'm manoeuvring at night with no lights...

A pole will serve the purpose. Don't put it on the bow (a) it will block your vision (b) someone will tie a mooring line to it.
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Old 15 October 2017, 16:23   #18
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Re.: "Never used lights"....

This was 35 years ago - night fishing, shooting, stuff where showing a light would make it a waste of time going out ;-)

Also, either rowing or outboard powered rowing boat.

But I'm very conscious that that upbringing doesn't necessarily fit well with what is legal / acceptable now - hence the question...!

And also prompted by frequent use of kayak, with occaisional risk of an extended day straying towards dusk.
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Old 15 October 2017, 16:41   #19
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Battery powered cycle lights as they are often water resistant and have the ability to be strapped/mounted to side or bow grab ropes and stern poles mounted on the transom rather than similar size handle bars their made for
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Old 16 October 2017, 04:51   #20
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Bobg, I think you are either accidentally or intentionally misreading the colregs. Wording in regulations is carefully constructed, considered, debated and revised before being finally agreed. Whilst I agree there is a degree of ambiguity there, why include the word maximum at all if it actually means the current operating speed? There are many other ways to word it, if your meaning was the intent. Whilst I am sure nobody has time to deal with, or argue in the courts about, someone lit with an all round white travelling at low speed normally, should you be in a collision then insurers may well find it a worthwhile fight, and if there are casualties prosecutors might well be willing to point the finger. Your interpretation could be proven sound, but it could also be suggested to be a lazy shortcut on a boat that could easily have been made to comply.

7 kts is a sensible speed in a busy area, but busy areas often have multiple lights around so actually making sure that you are spotted, and correctly identified is only sensible. Camping lanterns come in many shapes and sizes, some will be white and visible at two nautical miles, others will be more yellow and visible over less range, especially as the battery fades. Certainly not all are properly waterproof, and so may fail without warning. If you have power from the engine it's as well to use it.
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