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Old 29 October 2016, 04:48   #1
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Oh b***er - trailer roller trapped behind transom

Hi All,

Recovered our Searider last night after its first summer afloat on a swinging mooring. All went really well until it was pointed out to me, after we reached our destination, that I had winched the boat so far up the trailer that the rear rollers of the trailer have become caught behind the transom .

The trailer is an early model Hallmark / Indespension Rollercoaster 1, some pics of the offending rollers below.

Does anyone have any idea how I might be able to re-seat the boat onto the rollers without re-floating (this is a last ditch option but I am keen to avoid for various reasons). As a temporary measure I have used a ratchet strap to pull the bottom of the swinging crossbar towards the front of the trailer, but I dont think I can put enough tension on it to pull it horizontal.

Clearly the trailer isnt set-up properly, so I also need to think about what I need to change to avoid this happening again.

Any suggestions appreciated!

Pics:


How it looked previously:



Thanks for your time in reading this.

Rupert
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Old 29 October 2016, 04:50   #2
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Should be a simple fix, move the winch post back to prevent the boat coming too far forward. the boat won't be that heavy, grab some mate and lift it back If not jack the boat up onto blocks and pull trailer forward.
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Old 29 October 2016, 04:53   #3
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To reset, take your winch strap and run it back under the axle then upto your bow eye, winch it as per normal but it will go backwards. If you have a wire be very careful or you may damage the hull so towels or sheets may help. You may be able to push that it back by hand? hook the stern eyes upto a post and drive forwards a bit?
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Old 29 October 2016, 05:05   #4
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Hi guys;

Thanks for the swift responses!

1. Moving the winch post back - yes I agree, but as per this picture I don't think I can adjust any further back as it is hard up against the frame:



2. Looping the winch strap back around an axel is a genius idea, thank you! It's a seatbelt type material strap so hopefully no risk of damage, although I will use something to protect it from chafing. I'm still not 100% sure if it will work and I think I may need to put something inbetween the transom and the roller to act as a ramp / wedge to guide the boat up and onto the roller.

Best, Rupert
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Old 29 October 2016, 05:13   #5
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I'd be using a trolley jack, jack the back up and gently push - by adding a snubber block to the front post you should be able to add a couple of inches.
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Old 29 October 2016, 05:21   #6
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If you can't move the winch post back, jack the back end up and move the rear roller cradle forward.
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Old 29 October 2016, 08:10   #7
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Ok so I fixed this by running the winch strap back underneath the trailer and using it to pull the roller cradle forward (and level) then gently pulled the boat back and released the winch - job done! Thanks for the help!!
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Old 29 October 2016, 11:53   #8
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nice one, glad it worked

you should perhaps try to set the trailer up to stop that though and balance it accordingly.

i suspect you need to move the rear swing forward if you have no room left on the winch post to move, unless the trailer is too big for the boat ofcourse?

once the above is done you can move the axle to get it balanced accordingly
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Old 29 October 2016, 12:27   #9
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Hi Xk59D, thanks - it was your suggestion that inspired me to use the winch to pull the frame forward!

Re: moving things around I'm fairly sure the position of the swinging rollers is fixed. I think the first thing to try is swapping out the snubber at the front for a marginally bigger one. This issue notwithstanding, overall I think it is a good trailer for the boat and the balance seems good. In any case, at the moment it is being used principally for storage rather than for frequent towing and launching.

Best, R
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Old 29 October 2016, 13:15   #10
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Quote:
Originally Posted by JimRib View Post
If you can't move the winch post back, jack the back end up and move the rear roller cradle forward.
From the photo it looks as though lifting the snubber a couple of inches would push the boat back a bit.
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Old 29 October 2016, 13:17   #11
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hey bud,

it defo isn't fixed, you just slacken this bolt each side (see piccy) and move it forward. (the winch post trick again will do it, just wrap your line round the beam and winch it forward)

the trailer isn't setup by the looks of it so spend some time doing that. i think you can go forward a good 12" or so comfortably with the winch post and then move the rear swing beam and axle to suit. the downside with this is if you use a shallow slipway this makes launching a little harder so you will need to find the balance to suit you there.

move the roller beam forward so you can get the boat against the winch post where it is at the minimum, this is mega important as it stops the boat moving forward (along with a ratchet strap) if you need to suddenly brake.

once you do that you may need to move the axle to get the desired weight on your tow ball, your car will have that info and you should aim to be close to that weight with your normal load on the boat. this is also really important so don't skip doing it, it is worth it.
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Old 29 October 2016, 14:21   #12
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Originally Posted by Xk59D View Post
hey bud,

it defo isn't fixed, you just slacken this bolt each side (see piccy) and move it forward. (the winch post trick again will do it, just wrap your line round the beam and winch it forward)

the trailer isn't setup by the looks of it so spend some time doing that. i think you can go forward a good 12" or so comfortably with the winch post and then move the rear swing beam and axle to suit. the downside with this is if you use a shallow slipway this makes launching a little harder so you will need to find the balance to suit you there.

move the roller beam forward so you can get the boat against the winch post where it is at the minimum, this is mega important as it stops the boat moving forward (along with a ratchet strap) if you need to suddenly brake.

once you do that you may need to move the axle to get the desired weight on your tow ball, your car will have that info and you should aim to be close to that weight with your normal load on the boat. this is also really important so don't skip doing it, it is worth it.
Thank you for this - I take your point(s) and will make this a job for the winter. Looking back at the photos I completely agree that the boat could me much further forward on the trailer without impacting on usability too much. Now I know it's an issue I'll do some proper research and try to find some photos I can reference of other similar rigs. I'm also going to add some protective foam to the cross beams and roller supports, just in case!

Going to need to get some ACF50 on the various nuts and bolts to move anything - I just replaced the jockey wheel and clamp and that was a nightmare.

Really appreciate the advice, R
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Old 29 October 2016, 14:33   #13
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Rather than ACF50 I found an angle grinder was very effective. If they're that badly rusted they're as well replaced anyway. The trailer nose weight more or less dictates everything else. Beg, steal or borrow scales to do this.
Depending on your car it'll probably be somewhere between 75 & 130KG.
I'd aim to be as close to that (without going over) as you can.
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Old 29 October 2016, 15:54   #14
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Would of been simple to of blocked under the keel away from any rollers with the jockey wheel wound down, then wind the jockey wheel back up which would rase the boat. Then simply pull the boat forward enough to get back over.
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Old 30 October 2016, 01:23   #15
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You can work out the nose weight by using some bathroom scales and a piece of 4x2 the same length as the distance between the top of the scales and the tow ball on your car.

You can use the jockey wheel to 'lower' the trailer on to the scales.

As Last Tango says the nose weight wants to be between 75kg and 100kg depending on car.

For example, if you are trying to achieve a nose weight of 80kg and the measured nose weight is 60kg, move the boat back by 100mm (measured accurately) and re-weigh. The nose weight will have reduced to, let's say 50kg. This means you need to move the boat 100mm to change the nose weight by 10kg.

As you are trying to increase the nose weight by 20kg, you need to move the boat forward, from its original position, by 200mm.

If the boat is correctly set up on the rollers or you can't move the boat, the same effect will be achieved by moving the axle 200mm back. Obviously you can do a combination of moving boat and moving axles.

Not that anyone has suggested it but moving the rollers will only change the way the boat sits, it won't change the nose weight.

The reason for initially moving the boat back is to avoid moving the snubber and losing the 'basic' setting. Try not to accidentally launch the boat though.

And finally, re-weigh once you have done your changes.
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Old 30 October 2016, 05:09   #16
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And do that weighing with the boat packed how you tow it... Ie fuel tanks filled and in place etc.

And do check your nose weight - I'm sure some of my cars have been as low as 50kg
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Old 30 October 2016, 07:43   #17
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And do that weighing with the boat packed how you tow it... Ie fuel tanks filled and in place etc.

And do check your nose weight - I'm sure some of my cars have been as low as 50kg
Yup was shocked by mine max of 60kg on an Astra IIRC
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Old 31 October 2016, 04:36   #18
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Thanks for all the useful replies, some creative ideas in there!

My car is zero tow rated (!) so I currently rely on the generosity of friends and family to help with moving the boat around, but I will get the trailer set-up properly as it seems eminently sensible.

I would really like to get into towing in the future as it would give us a lot more scope to explore - particularly the West and North Cornish coasts which I know very well but have yet to visit by RIB!
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Old 31 October 2016, 07:19   #19
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Pity you can't tow with your current car but perhaps sign of the times with economy being the driver.

Just set up with what you normally tow with just now.
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Old 31 October 2016, 07:24   #20
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Pity you can't tow with your current car but perhaps sign of the times with economy being the driver.

Just set up with what you normally tow with just now.
I've got an EP3 Civic Type-R which definitely wasn't built with economy in mind - I think its more to do with the fact it would rip the back off the car
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