Oversized outboards

[Northern Tim]

I'm looking a several used boats, one or two of which have a bigger engine than the maximum suggested by the manufacturer.

Assuming the engines all weigh the same, what would be the effect of having an oversized engine on the transom?

I realise that an engine with too much power will affect the handling with a light bow.

Thoughts?

[Last Tango]

Insurance ??????????

[chriswood]

To me the biggest issue is not handling / weight etc it's your insurance. No insurance company will pay out if they find out the boats max engine size has been exceeded. Surely it's not worth the risk especially if someone gets injured.

That said I am sure a few extra horses will not effect the transom but too much will effect the handling and stability of the boat.

[John Kennett]

Originally Posted by chriswood

No insurance company will pay out if they find out the boats max engine size has been exceeded.

This is something that is often said, but do we know if it's actually true?

I know we've got some insurance companies represented here, maybe they'd like to comment?

[kerny]

[QUOTE=chriswood;67369No insurance company will pay out if they find out the boats max engine size has been exceeded. Surely it's not worth the risk especially if someone gets injured.


Its certainly a cast iron case if they don't want to pay out me thinks.

[Hightower]

I've got no CE plate on my RIB and all my insurance company seem to be interested in is that your vessel mustn't exceed 48 knots.

[Daniel]

Yes 50 knts seams a key cut off for production / leisure (cheap) vessel insurance.

Thankfully most ribs are not capable of speeds in excess of this.

[Last Tango]

Even prior to the days of "CE plates" (yes I'm old enough to remember that) most boat manufacturers would still provide a maximum HP rating for there boats and there is a standard calculation that used to be used to work out the size but that would produce figures about half what we see today. However an ignored CE plate is all the excuse an insurance company would need.

[bedajim]

I think Maximus has got around this on his last couple of ribs, he maybe the man to ask

[Maximus]

Originally Posted by bedajim

I think Maximus has got around this on his last couple of ribs, he maybe the man to ask

I use Craft insure and they regard 50 knots as the defining limit...and not engine size.
And yes you can have it in writing
There are a few threads posted up already were this has been gone into in more detail

[Hightower]

Out of interest under what circumstances would insurance companies look at engine size vers hull design? Water borne accident (underwater damage), traffic accident (on trailer), theft, fire, third party claim obviously excluding a MAIB report or all of the above?

[kerny]

Just me being skeptical but for example if you run over a swimmer and chop off their legs and the insurance company finds out that the boat engine rating is 70 but the engine on at the time of the accident had been changed to an 80, I would bet my bottom dollar that they would not pay out.

Those insurance company's that say its okay as long as it cannot exceed 50 mph and I don't doubt Maximus on this, I personally would like to see in writing that "regardless of the engine rating as long as it cannot reach speeds of over 50 mph they would pay out for any damage or injury to third party's" then I suppose that would be happy with that and wished that I would have got a bigger engine

Like John Kennett said.......This is something that is often said, but do we know if it's actually true?

I know we've got some insurance companies represented here, maybe they'd like to comment? Were still waiting

[HUMBER P4VWL]

They'll never give a cast iron opinion on here.theres no upside for them.

As for 50mph, I doubt they'd follow that through if I strapped a 30hp to my 2.5m rib and hit someone. Each case and firm will have their own T&Cs

[Trimix]

Insurance companies are businesses and employ staff who look to reduce their costs.

Any chance of reducing a pay-out will be looked at.

[Searider]

I've looked at lots of claims - but none yet involving a boat with an oversize engine - so I can't comment on the point of view of Insurers I work for.

However, most are "reasonable". If the boat / engine was stolen it's possible it won't be an issue.

If there was a collision or some other "loss of control" then it probably would be an issue.

If there was an injury - and this is where claim values start to escalate, then it almost certainly would be an issue.

I have had an experience of a claim on a boat that could clearly do over 50knots, but was stated on the policy to be slower, where a passenger was injured. There then followed a very detailed discussion and digging out of recorded telephone calls from the time that the policy was taken out over the phone to determine what the Assured said at the time.

[boristhebold]

There was a ribnet member on here who works for insurance companies, unfortunately he was banned from the site. I will see if I have any contact details and get his view.

My view is its not worth the potential hassle if the worse happens, insurance companies may say one thing but like many suggested if the worse happens they will be running to lawyers to get out of paying. And the worse could mean a million quid personal claim, you may be paying out for the rest of your life.

So surely it just isnt worth it, of you want a bigger engine then get a bigger boat simples.

[John Kennett]

Originally Posted by boristhebold

There was a ribnet member on here who works for insurance companies, unfortunately he was banned from the site. I will see if I have any contact details and get his view.

Yes, it's a pity he was so unhappy here but we've rather done that subject now.

He does't work in marine anyway, but luckily one of his colleagues who does is a trade member so I've dropped him a line.

[kerny]

Originally Posted by HUMBER P4VWL

They'll never give a cast iron opinion on here.

Why not Paul they should do if they are flogging boat insurance....?

[HUMBER P4VWL]

Well they'd state the obvious in that "you're insured if it's within the CE mark". But people are after an insurer to make a generic, sweeping statement, non policy/company specific on here with categorical confirmation of cover. Never going to happen and it'd be invaluable if they did.

Each person needs to speak with their own insurer re their own boat.

I don't get this thread really in what people are after......It's common sense as Searider said, the bigger the claim, the more they look in to it.

Claim for a stolen £500 2.5m rib with a 6hp engine that a 4hp max on the plate and it's irrelevant.

Claim for a paralysed skier, hit by an out of control 5.5m boat that had a 200hp on it rather than 125hp and you'll be paying yourself.

Run an oversized engine at your own risk/reward. It's just like chipping your car, do you tell the insurer. You'll be covered for bumping in to someone, but write a car off and paralyse someone and they'll go through it with a toothcomb, full diagnostics will reveal your omission!

[Bigmuz7]

An oversized outboard for me is asking for transom damage, and weakening at the deck joints, as it will be heavier and provide more thrust than the build spec of the boat. Couple this .... with a heavy interior layout, and you can guarantee a 'stressful' time.... add to that an enthusiastic driver and you can be sure the transom will have had a hard time.

Ive had experience of manufacturers not always being honest about what their transom can realistically handle .. that may be true moreso at the birth of heavy four strokes, but none the less pushing any design to a limit will expect trouble, exceeding it will usually guarantee it , and then the manufacturer of course wont look at you. TBH its not worth it for a few extra knots, not that I ever did it, all my boats have been within the stated max specs.