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Old 23 October 2003, 09:19   #1
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Opti vs 4strokes

Can anyone tell me how economical the Optimax engines are compared to four strokes, in the 130hp region.

Any comments on Optimax vs Four strokes gatefully recieved. I presume servicing on an Optimax is considerably cheaper?

Thanks

Rodger Webb
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Old 23 October 2003, 09:45   #2
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I've seen my mate's opti service bill, and it wasn't cheap (he did take it to Dave Crawford tho') Look at Andy Clark's web site www.bosunsmate.co.uk I think he charges extra for Optis because of the DDT (look on his site for explanation of the acronym).

Also with a 2-stroke you've got the 2-stroke oil to pay for. £4 per litre. I'm using about 4 litres every weekend at the mo.

What size boat are you getting? Don't decide on the engine until that's sorted, or at least decided, so you can match the two. For example, many people are posting good reports of the Suzuki DF140 four stroke on 5.85m to 6.3m RIBs. (thinking here of mstacey and alex brown).
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Old 23 October 2003, 11:16   #3
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Thanks for the reply, I am buying a Ribcraft 5.85 in the New Year and had more or less decided on a Suziki helped by earlier posts, but was starting to reconsider having read posts on the Optimax. I think I will stick with my original choice.
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Old 23 October 2003, 11:38   #4
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Sounds sensible. I don't know if there's an opti between 115 and 150, and the 150 although it's a great engine by all accounts, it's a very heavy lump - it's a 2.5 V6 and almost as heavy as the 225 if I remember correctly.
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Old 23 October 2003, 11:45   #5
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Wait for the Evinrude E-Tec being immanently launched in that HP range.
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Old 23 October 2003, 11:47   #6
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There is a 135 Opti but it is dearer than the Suziki 140.

Got to go now - off for two day rib training course at Salcombe - do you think I'll need waterproofs!!!!
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Old 23 October 2003, 12:05   #7
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The weatherman thinks the weather's going to be good here this weekend, so where will I be? - in Ikea at Bristol

Whizzpopper: I haven't heard many reviews of it yet, but don't forget about the 150 4-stroke from Yamaha as one of your thoughts.

I'm just about on the 100hr mark on my Suzuki 140 now, and it's still starting first time every time (all clever electronics start it up with auto-choke etc... and auto revs) - the thing is pretty much faultless. I will admit to having a few 'niggles' at first with the unit (stalling sometimes, under-revving at wot), but now I have the stainless prop on I feel that the boat is getting the best from the engine with some pretty good economy too. I really never thought that this 140 would be cheaper to run than my old 70 2-stroke, it's a great bonus

My first service @ 20hrs was approx £100, for lower section oil, main engine oil, and then labour - not too bad I didn't think. As yet, I haven't had to put any oil in the engine at all.... I just give it petrol, and that's it

-Alex
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Old 23 October 2003, 12:14   #8
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They are both going to burn loads of fuel - worry about performance and get a new two stroke engine, modern engines burn hardly any oil. Do'nt compare a modern 2 stroke to the likes of old Seagulls running on a 20% sump oil/80% petrol mix.
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Old 23 October 2003, 13:15   #9
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Quote:
Originally posted by Alex Brown
where will I be? - in Ikea at Bristol
Don't to it! You'll feel afterwards. Went there once, never again! Don't even like their stuff! The store's crowded, you've GOT to walk round every display to get to the bit you want. The checkout queues are MILES long, carpark full, generally my idea of a bad day out
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Old 23 October 2003, 13:28   #10
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Don't listen to Richard B, he's telling you not to buy an Opti and he doesn't even know the model Range.......Just wait till I get him over on Boatmad.

I've got an Opti 150 (they do make a 135 by the way and are just introducing a 115 which is pollution compliant till 2008 and has a three year warranty) this Opti has been on the back of my boat and has put over 500 hundred hours so far. It get serviced when it's supposed to and never misses a beat.

The fuel economy on Opti's is exceptional we burn about thirty five litres an hour at 45 MPH with 5 up. Regarding the cost of 2 stroke oil the difference in price between an Opti and a 4 stroke bus a lot of Opti Oil which is more like about £5 a liter.

I wouldn't really consider putting another engine on a boat unless it was a diesel
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Old 23 October 2003, 13:32   #11
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As we are on the subject of Optimax engines the Optimax 75 and 90 have just been launched by Mercury Marine

Andre
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Old 23 October 2003, 13:32   #12
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Quote:
Originally posted by whizzpopper

Got to go now - off for two day rib training course at Salcombe - do you think I'll need waterproofs!!!!
Dunno about the waterproofs but bring your thermals it's 'kin freezing down here!
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Old 23 October 2003, 13:32   #13
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Don't listen to Richard B...I've got an Opti 150...
Your 150's still nearly as heavy as my 200
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Old 23 October 2003, 14:22   #14
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The Opti 135, 150, 175 are all the same engine (therefore same weight).

I'd of had a 175 if it wern't literaly thousands more (Richard knows what i mean ).

I did my homework on this, and apparently the Opti has the potnetial to be more efficient that a 4-S, but i've, as yet, no evidence to back that up. You need to ignore the cost of oil in this argument i beleive.

I'd get an Opti, performance and economy if you're sensiable with the throttle.
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Old 23 October 2003, 14:34   #15
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And? There are very few 7.5 ribs out there with 200's that can outrun me with my heavy 150 engine!

My point is that on the basis of seeing one service bill for an Opti you tell the guy not to buy one of the best engines out there and not even knowing the model range you still advise him not to do it.

The cost of a service is usually 135 pounds plus parts, the dealers tend to whack the parts in at full retail price and that bumps up the bill. If you want to keep down provide your own impellors and filters etc.

The Opti 200 and 225 are identical engines I think the 150 has a smaller bore.

I guess if he does buy an Opti he can always save money by running it on Ordinary 2 stroke oil

cheers
Stuart
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Old 23 October 2003, 14:35   #16
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Daniel.

you can always buy a 150 and drop a 175 chip in, when it's out of warranty of course
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Old 23 October 2003, 16:30   #17
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Wave is right, go for an opti, they ae excellent. The 200 and 225 are 3ltr blocks and the 135 and 150 is 2.5ltr. They are all bloody solid.

The new 115 Opti is a 3 cylinder rather than the v6 which all the others are so the weight is much less, I don't know much about it but bet it is bloody good.
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Old 23 October 2003, 16:46   #18
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Just consider this guys, the car industry has been developing petrol engines for 100 years now and has not bothered at all with 2 strokes. If they are so good then why does the car industy continue to spend billions of £'s on 4-strokes?
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Old 23 October 2003, 16:50   #19
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simple - 'cos 2-stroke cars are banned.

There were a few very successful 2-stroke cars. Most noteable was the Saab (errr, can't remember the model - think it was the 93? aka the bullnose saab) and most lamentable (in UK) was the Wartburg Knight, or (in Eastern Europe) the Trabant.
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Old 23 October 2003, 17:16   #20
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Uh Oh! I've upset the Optimax evangelist...

Stu - I never "advised the guy not to buy one of the best engines out there", but gave some objective input on the overall cost of running different outboard types. You've put 500hrs onto an engine which has performed faultlessly for you, which is an excellent recommendation whichever way you look at it, but is that considered exceptional or normal from modern machinery? And remember that the original question was about running costs - so it wouldn't be realistic to ignore the cost of two-stroke oil.

Filling the 2-stroke oil is one of my hated jobs at the moment and I would recommend that anyone rigging a 2-stroke makes sure that the reservoir is very easily accessible.

Now dont' get me wrong, I also think that the Opti is a great engine - I spent lots of hours driving a very similar Scorpion to yours last season, Stuart. The acceleration was exciting, and they certainly sound the business. I just reckon that overall setup and rigging of the boat is as important as pure grunt.

I could be a Yamaha evangelist, and lots of people are, but I have only put about 70hours on mine in which time I EXPECT it to perform faultlessly. So I'll save that for later! And the Yam. 150hpdi is even heavier than any engine we've talked about in this thread, so not a good recommendation in my opinion.
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