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Old 14 September 2010, 19:02   #1
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Cardiff Bay Cowboys

There are 2 yellow Ribcraft ribs with pod seats that run from Cardiff the name of the company is Bay Island Voyages .. I was in the locks at the Cardiff Barrage on Saturday with both of their boats and could not but notice how un professional they were, there were 2 drivers and 1 crew all sat on the back of the boat smoking cigarettes with no lifejackets on all quite "chavy" looking which i thought was not the right impression you should be giving off as a commercial skipper... when i got home that evening i thought i would have a look at their website just to have a look at what they do so i searched for them in google and i came across this

http://www.maib.gov.uk/cms_resources...eer_Report.pdf

I am not surprised something like this has happened to them with the quality of driving I saw from them that day it was reckless !! I will be writing to the MCA and RYA to voice my concerns.

Last night i went to our local yacht club and was chatting with a few members and apparently it is not the first accident they have only 3 months ago they ran aground on rocks with a school group onboard people like this should not be able to operate.

There are 2 companies that offer trips from Cardiff Bay one being the above mentioned company and the other being a company called Cardiff Sea Safaris i have spoken to people about cardiff Sea Safaris and i am told they are a very professional outfit who have been running for a number of years and they run very high spec boats with professional skippers which i thought was fair

I just want to know what other commercial operators think of this and what can be done about it ?

Regards

Rich
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Old 14 September 2010, 19:48   #2
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Interesting first post Richie - welcome to ribnet, by the way.
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Old 14 September 2010, 20:21   #3
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verry sinical misster dai bak

arr yew insinyewating dat misster ricch iz connectid wiv cardif see sarfaris

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all quite "chavy" looking
dats nawmal forr welch nobburs

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Old 14 September 2010, 20:44   #4
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Hi guys I didn't really know how to start my first post so i thought i would just straight to the point ... it would be a bit silly of me to do it if i was anything to do with the other company .. my background is sailing i sometimes work on the safety boats at our club that where my connection to ribs are ... and im also in the RNLI so thats why i raise the issues on safety ... im not her to bitch but i do spend alot of time in different coastal town and all those towns have some kind of trip boat running from there and i just wanted to kow how you guys felt about the dodgy ones

Rich
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Old 14 September 2010, 20:53   #5
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A little harsh. Incident occurred in 2008. They'd operated for 7 years prior. Appropiately qualified crew. Life jackets issued before departure. Coded rib. Two crew. 50+ yr old woman out on an adventure ride. At what point is it someones own risk! They weren't wave jumping particularly, there was no suggestion of wreckless driving.

If she fell horse riding should there have been a moving crash mat alongside if shed paid to do it?

As for smoking. At rear of boat away from fuel in open air with engine off, or on for that matter, Is it that bad really? If it was an old sea dog with cap in an old fishing boat on a charter whilst fishing, would you be so judging?

Looked chavy? Would they have been fineif wearing musto then? Clothes make no difference.

There are worse non regulatory compliant operations out there!!!
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Old 14 September 2010, 21:09   #6
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looks like they were all having fun!!!
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Old 14 September 2010, 21:12   #7
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by 'eck, talk about "holier than thou" I hope he never sees me in my white shell suit & gold hoop earrings
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Old 14 September 2010, 21:14   #8
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Although it is important for MAIB reports to remain impartial and to present facts rather than opinions, I don't see anything in the report to suggest that they did anything seriously wrong. With such an in-depth report they will always find mistakes and incorrect decisions with everyone one involved, eg. the ambulance took an hour to arrive on scene, even Ribcraft get a bit of stick over their boat design.

As far as I know being a professional or having a professional attitude has got nothing to do with whether or not you're a smoker or look "a bit chavy". And as we know from the previous, infamous "cowboy" thread, there's no legal requirement for the wearing of lifejackets.

I thought we had moved on from the days when if you had short hair, it was assumed you were a skinhead football hooligan. I for one would be interested to know what real evidence you will be submitting in your letter to the MCA to substantiate your claim of there being safety issues.
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Old 14 September 2010, 21:16   #9
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looks like they were all having fun!!!
Good god! they're wearing waterproofs & lifejackets, whatever next How incompetent can you get.
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Old 14 September 2010, 21:33   #10
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Dai don't look like a Chav!

Did the drivers/crew have passengers on the boat at the time or were thay chilling after a days work

Whats wrong with smoking on the boat, it happens all the time, I don't do it cos I'm fab. But I know skippers like DM do ( nasty habit)

High Spec Boats I always thought that Ribcraft were quite good boats

Professional Skippers if you do it for money and you've got the tickets your'e a profesional, I do accept that some skippers are better than others, but appearance can't judge how good a mariner you are or does a Henri Lloyd suit give you the edge, if so where do I get one from

Lifejackets yeah that's not acceptable

I suspect you are wasting your time writing to the MCA /RYA as I don't think they give a monkeys as neither issue a boat charterers ticket, that may come from the local authority.

I'm afraid I did see stuff in the MAIB report that concerned me, but I think that got done to death at the time
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Old 14 September 2010, 21:35   #11
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?
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Old 14 September 2010, 21:41   #12
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?
??
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Old 14 September 2010, 21:41   #13
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Welcome to ribnet btw! you've sparked some good posts, good for people to voice their views, yours included. Perhaps you saw inappropriate driving too that we're not privy too. Don't take the posts to heart or a personal attack. Have fun on here, most do and also learn a lot while doing so
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Old 15 September 2010, 07:11   #14
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I've seen RNLI crew, which is presumably your "gold standard for 'professional' seamanship" smoking on deck whilst not wearing a lifejacket. Admittedly on an AWB not a RIB.

I'll need to brush up on my Chav definition - because I thought Henry Lloyd made you a chav... ...maybe only if you're wearing it with trackies and trainers!
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Old 15 September 2010, 07:25   #15
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A little harsh. Incident occurred in 2008. They'd operated for 7 years prior. Appropiately qualified crew.
Actually (its been a while since I read it and my mind might be playing tricks) I thought there was a "question mark" over the coding/qualifications ?

Quote:
Two crew. 50+ yr old woman out on an adventure ride. At what point is it someones own risk! They weren't wave jumping particularly, there was no suggestion of wreckless driving.

If she fell horse riding should there have been a moving crash mat alongside if shed paid to do it?
I don't think that is necessarily a good comparison. Firstly, ask almost anyone getting on an "adventure rib ride" with a professional company to rank the activity in terms of perceived risk, and I think whilst you will probably find most people will not consider it as dangerous as horse riding / mountain biking / skiing or other such "adventure" sports. They would probably rank it on the same scale as going on a fairground ride (alton towers etc) - something which whilst "scary" at the time is believed to be a relatively low risk, or may even rank it alongside the sea safari type trips opperated by the same company.

Now even if your analogy were reasonable - would it be a good idea to take me (who's never ridden a horse) and put them on the livliest animal in the pack (analagous to sitting at the front of the rib) and then go somewhere where the animal is likely to be a bit excitable? Does that change if I am a reluctant participant because my boss expects me to do this as "teambuilding"?
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Old 15 September 2010, 11:26   #16
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Now even if your analogy ....
Don't worry too much about him Polwart, he's been seeing an Analogist about it since the Holeistic Therapy failed.
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Old 15 September 2010, 17:42   #17
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I've seen RNLI crew, which is presumably your "gold standard for 'professional' seamanship" ..
.
IT ain't mine!
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Old 15 September 2010, 21:47   #18
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Don't worry too much about him Polwart, he's been seeing an Analogist about it since the Holeistic Therapy failed.
If Polwart fell off the horse and was wearing his lifejacket. Could he activate it in time before hitting the floor? Would the epirb then work on land? Would the horse come round and stamp on him, or is there a kill cord that could be rigged up? (sponsored by UHU) I'm very confused.

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Old 15 September 2010, 22:08   #19
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I thought richierich was a member recently with some legal interests ?
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Old 16 September 2010, 12:05   #20
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I am not surprised something like this has happened to them with the quality of driving I saw from them that day it was reckless !! I will be writing to the MCA and RYA to voice my concerns.

How about being fair and writing to the company involved first and making any concerns known? Then decide what to do when you get a response.

Let's face it watching something from the shore isn't exactly the same as partaking in the activity. For example sometimes high speed turns can look very dramatic from the shore especially when you see the underside of the hull exposed on one side as the boat turns, but are perfectly under control for the passengers.

High speed turns and fast driving are what some operators do, passengers that come on board would know in advance that that is what will happen. High speeds on RIBS can be done safely and so can high speed turns. We all know the dangers of "jerking" or "throwing" the wheel round, but a gentle hand and smooth progressive turn of the wheel can make a boat turn fairly quickly which can look pretty dramatic for people watching from the shore but make it fairly easy for passengers to hold on and stay in the boat.


However I totally agree that crew sitting around smoking or hanging about like a "gang" doesn't look professional I hate that kind of thing.
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