Petition Against Imminant Canadian Seal Cull

Bern Hanreck · 17 March 2009, 11:39

If you are against the cull , please visit

https://community.hsus.org/humane/no...er_id=31598930

and sign the petition .

prairie tuber · 18 March 2009, 04:58

Better still, sign here:

http://www.gopetition.com/petitions/...seal-hunt.html

Bern Hanreck · 18 March 2009, 13:38

Hey Prairie ! Start your own threads.........

" Vive la difference ! "....................

codprawn · 18 March 2009, 14:05

How can clubbing seals to death ever be considered humane? It is sickening.

Fair enough a small group of hunters shooting them with a 308 for food - that is pretty instant but a baseball bat? Come on!!!

They are mammals - it would be no different to clubbing labrador pups to death!!!

Pete7 · 18 March 2009, 18:30

Codders, would seal fur be good under my drysuit ?

Pete

prairie tuber · 18 March 2009, 20:28

The hakapik is a very humane tool for the harvesting of animals. As for as the objection that it is wrong to harvest seals because they are mammals, that simply doesn't hold water. If you purchase and/or eat red meat, you are a contractor to the killing of mammals. 'Seal hunting' is a poor term it is certainly not a 'hunt'. 'Sealing' or 'Seal Culling' or ' Seal Harvesting' is a much more accurate term. Some basic facts are here;

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Seal_hunting

codprawn · 18 March 2009, 21:01

If used properly maybe - but after a few hours of mass murder the wielder is bound to become tired and not use the tool as effectively.

How popular is seal meat in Canada? Do you buy it in the local supermarket? It seems to me it is mainly exported and used for pet food - not exactly killing animals for food is it? Even the koreans won't touch it!!!

TubrOnCrakberry · 18 March 2009, 23:02

Quote:

Originally Posted by codprawn

If used properly maybe

The sealers are well versed and trained in how to use a hakapik properly. However, the greenpeace activists who posed as sealers and made the video of themselves cruelly and clumsily bludgeoning baby seals to death (the fraudulent video that sparked the international protests) clearly did not know how to use a hakapik properly.

Quote:

Originally Posted by codprawn

- but after a few hours of mass murder...

Murder is the unlawful and intentional killing of one (or more) human being(s) by another (or other) human being(s).

Quote:

Originally Posted by codprawn

How popular is seal meat in Canada? Do you buy it in the local supermarket?

Have never tried it and have no intenion to, but that cera-nly does not impel me to try to prevent other people from eating seal meat. While I have not seen it in the supermarrket, their is obviously a market demand for seal meat, since it does all get sold.

Quote:

Originally Posted by codprawn

It seems to me it is mainly exported and used for pet food - not exactly killing animals for food is it?

You just contracted yourself within the same sentence - which is a remarkable accomplishment!

Quote:

Originally Posted by codprawn

Even the koreans won't touch it!!!

Supposing the majority of the seal meat is used for dog and cat food, so what? Those cats and dogs will be fed regardless, and they will be fed onew form of animal flesh or anoher, since that is what their diet requires. So when you think about it, those Koreans will ulimately be ingesting the seal meat afterall.

Poly · 18 March 2009, 23:45

Quote:

Originally Posted by prairie tuber

As for as the objection that it is wrong to harvest seals because they are mammals, that simply doesn't hold water. If you purchase and/or eat red meat, you are a contractor to the killing of mammals.

PT - you know you have been here with this sort of discussion before and got a quite alarming response:

Quote:

Originally Posted by codprawn

although if it was down to me I could never bring myself to kill an animal unless it was attacking me. I don't even like killing fish. To be honest though I wouldn't have the same reservations about killing certain people in the right situation!!!

In many ways I applaud his honesty - but I don't understand the hypocrisy of many in our country - we are horrified at animal welfare conditions on farms, but don't go "veggie"; a significant number have a problem with hunting wild animals - but the same people will argue for "free range" farming conditions that give better conditions that better mimic those in the wild.

I doubt the seal issue is as simple as either side would put it. But I accept that culling of wild animals is a fact of life both for the conservation of the animals themselves (and other species they prey on or compete with for prey) and for the maintainance of food stocks and natural resources, especially where natural predators are no longer able to maintain population equilibria - often due to man's influence. Deer, rabbit and fox are all culled in this country for those reasons - as have badger and hedgehog.

Given the objection of so many people in the UK to "Brussels" meddling in our lives I am surprised also that we feel we should meddle in the day-to-day law making of another nation.

prairie tuber · 19 March 2009, 00:34

Quote:

Originally Posted by Polwart

PT - you know you have been here with this sort of discussion before and got a quite alarming response:

I certainly did get an alarming (in fact a shrill) response when I've pointed this fact out previously. Yet no one was able to dispute that fact.

Quote:

Originally Posted by Polwart

I doubt the seal issue is as simple as either side would put it. But I accept that culling of wild animals is a fact of life both for the conservation of the animals themselves (and other species they prey on or compete with for prey) and for the maintainance of food stocks and natural resources, especially where natural predators are no longer able to maintain population equilibria - often due to man's influence. Deer, rabbit and fox are all culled in this country for those reasons - as have badger and hedgehog.

Given the objection of so many people in the UK to "Brussels" meddling in our lives I am surprised also that we feel we should meddle in the day-to-day law making of another nation.

BRAVO!

codprawn · 19 March 2009, 04:22

Quote:

Originally Posted by TubrOnCrakberry

Have never tried it and have no intenion to, but that cera-nly does not impel me to try to prevent other people from eating seal meat. While I have not seen it in the supermarrket, their is obviously a market demand for seal meat, since it does all get sold.

That's the whole point. It is not a case of - we need food desperately so lets kill some seals. It is the complete opposite. Help we have killed 300,000 seals now how do we get rid of all this mess and justify what we have done.

A World of difference that some people are too blinkered to see.

At least the Eskimos use them for food - clothing - heating - lighting etc etc - nothing is wasted. I have no problem with that!!!

prairie tuber · 19 March 2009, 13:04

Spelling & grammer corrected (damn tiny blackberry keypad)

Quote:

Originally Posted by TubrOnCrakberry

Supposing the majority of the seal meat is used for dog and cat food, so what? Those cats and dogs will be fed regardless, and they will be fed one form of animal flesh or anoher, since that is what their diet requires. Therefore animals will be killed just to feed those cats and dogs regardless. So when you think about it, in a round about way, those Koreans will ulimately ingest the seal meat afterall.

bedajim · 19 March 2009, 13:08

Quote:

Originally Posted by Polwart

Given the objection of so many people in the UK to "Brussels" meddling in our lives I am surprised also that we feel we should meddle in the day-to-day law making of another nation.

Mr Flibble · 19 March 2009, 13:16

Seals aren't clubbed to death to enable the survival of their species. They are clubbed to death to ensure that the failling Canadian fishing industry is bouyed up for a few more years. Greed pure and simple.

prairie tuber · 19 March 2009, 13:54

Quote:

Originally Posted by Mr Flibble

Seals aren't clubbed to death to enable the survival of their species. They are clubbed to death to ensure that the failling Canadian fishing industry is bouyed up for a few more years. Greed pure and simple.

Greed or ensuring that the collapsed cod stocks have a chance to survive and rebound? The fact that the cod have not been commercially fished for several years now refutes your claim that "the failling Canadian fishing industry is bouyed up for a few more years". It is not being bouyed up for a few more years because it has already been shut down for several years to due to the collapse of the cod stocks. Those cod stocks collapsed for 2 reasons;

1) There was an inadequate amount of Sealing being done in the '80s and '90s because a weak kneed Canadian Liberal government gave in to Greenpeace led international protests - primarily from Eurocontinentals.

2) That same weak kneed government did not properly protect the Grand Banks (Canadian waters) from pillaging nations such as Spain & Portugal who devasted the cod numbers with their poaching.

codprawn · 19 March 2009, 14:23

It is over fishing that has caused the collapse of cod stocks NOT the seals!!!

prairie tuber · 19 March 2009, 14:52

Quote:

Originally Posted by codprawn

It is over fishing that has caused the collapse of cod stocks NOT the seals!!!

You are 1/2 correct. Both the Iberians and the seals overfished the cod stocks.

chewy · 19 March 2009, 14:58

How come no one kicks up a fuss about fishermen over here taking pot shots at seals when they go near nets?
I've seen perfectly good cod with a slash down the side from where a seal has been "playing" with it.

Mr Flibble · 19 March 2009, 15:45

Quote:

Originally Posted by prairie tuber

Those cod stocks collapsed for 2 reasons;

1) There was an inadequate amount of Sealing being done in the '80s and '90s because a weak kneed Canadian Liberal government gave in to Greenpeace led international protests - primarily from Eurocontinentals.

2) That same weak kneed government did not properly protect the Grand Banks (Canadian waters) from pillaging nations such as Spain & Portugal who devasted the cod numbers with their poaching.

Really. So the seals are partly to blame. The fact that for millions of years the seals have happily fed on the north atlantic cod without the numbers collapsing is irrelevant then? The north atlantic cod numbers have nosed dived in the last 50 years thanks to intensive fishing NOT due to natural predation. Look at the Herring industry in Scotland as an example. What herring industry? Exactly my point. Nature has a way of naturally controlling species numbers. If the prey you feed on decline then your species numbers decline due to starvation or lack of breeding. It's when man comes along hoovers the sea then moans that the seals are taking all 'our' fish. Finally a ban is put on fishing certain species putting a strain on others. When the numbers finally start to slowly climb (and we are talking at the very least a few decades here not an overnight fix) fishermen demand the right to go back to the old ways. It's happening in Scotland at the moment. Sadly it's not only fishing where this happens.

BruceB · 19 March 2009, 17:04

Human nature is funny isn't it?
We accept as normal people killing rabbits, rats, mice, pigeons and foxes as vermin but as soon as it looks cute and cuddly (even though lots of folk may never get closer than hundreds of miles to one) its the biggest sin in creation to pound the head of a cute cuddly animal in with a big stick! I also find it a spurious argument that shooting is better, who cares what kills you you are still dead!
Anybody that eats meat arguing about this is being spectacularly hypocritical and I'll bet never seen the inside of a slaughterhouse.
I don't know whether I agree or disagree with any seal cull and, unlike most others it seems, am not sure how much on either side is propaganda or spin to justify the argument.
When it is not an normal everyday occurence to read about the latest kid beaten to death, pensioner murdered or soldier killed in action then I may start worrying about a few seals............