Fitting Celotex / Kingspan Insulation Board

Ribtecer · 14 December 2015, 01:11

Hi Guys

I have a new build 4 bed project just outside Winchester and I am looking for a couple of guys to fit the insulation board in between the roof rafters.

There is living space in the roof so this will ultimately need to tacked with plasterboard aswell.

Does anyone know anyone local who might be interested in this sort of work?

Many thanks

Toby Roberts
07814 574296

whisper · 14 December 2015, 08:29

Quote:

Originally Posted by Ribtecer

Hi Guys

I have a new build 4 bed project just outside Winchester and I am looking for a couple of guys to fit the insulation board in between the roof rafters.

There is living space in the roof so this will ultimately need to tacked with plasterboard aswell.

Does anyone know anyone local who might be interested in this sort of work?

Many thanks

Toby Roberts
07814 574296

Hey dude, there was a recent new commitment for climate change, in the past I don't think new build got any funding? Might be worth a couple of calls just to check to see if anything is on the horizon.

Try these guys Miller Pattison

Also you'll need to get the installation right with the correct air gap as this can cause problems later on with damp/condensation.

Hope that helps

Mollers · 14 December 2015, 09:08

Not keen on Celotex type insulation in roofs. Unless they're mm perfect fit, air just spills around them and the performance plummets. Good in floors.

We used 250/300mm of Rockwool batts in our's. They can be made to fit as snug as... Have a word with your architect or heat loss engineer. Celotex is also 'kin expensive.

Tim M · 14 December 2015, 11:57

Quite a timely thread. I had a roofer round the morning to quote for a cottage I'm currently renovating. He suggested a new type of roofing felt that incorporates the insulation. I can't get my head around this! Was planning to use Celotex and expanding foam to fill the gaps. Any thoughts?

beamishken · 14 December 2015, 13:02

Quote:

Originally Posted by Tim M

Quite a timely thread. I had a roofer round the morning to quote for a cottage I'm currently renovating. He suggested a new type of roofing felt that incorporates the insulation. I can't get my head around this! Was planning to use Celotex and expanding foam to fill the gaps. Any thoughts?

I'd imagine he's talking about a multi foil type insulation Triiso or YBS.
we did our current barn conversion 5 years ago and used 150mm kingspan in between the rafters with 25mm kingspan backed plasterboard over however the building inspector suggested we use Triiso in the walls as it's much thinner and you reduce the room size by much less than using kingspan
The house retains heat very well but can't say which is working best
There was a lot of negativity about the multifoil insulations back then but it seems more accepted as a viable alternative now
We just bought a 250 year old farmhouse and intend to line all the walls with multifoil this time but we will probably use a combination of foil and kingspan in the sloping ceilings and rock wool in the flat loft sections where we can afford to lose 250 - 300mm in height
I think with most insulation products with the exception of rock wool the installation instructions need to be followed to the letter to provide a complete envelope.If you get a contractor who starts to cut corners and leaves any gaps then you start to lose effectiveness
Lots of info on installations on kingspan Triiso and YBS websites

paul sparkes · 14 December 2015, 17:39

I'm a roofing contractor.

Attended a seminar with Actis last week.

Their new products look very good, clean and easy to install.

ACTIS insulation - The benchmark for hybrid reflective insulation

Paul

John Kennett · 14 December 2015, 18:12

Quote:

Originally Posted by Mollers

heat loss engineer.

Is there actually such a thing? I could do with talking to one because my attic was badly insulated by a general builder and is ludicrously draughty, but I don't know what needs to be done to sort it out properly.

beamishken · 14 December 2015, 18:35

Quote:

Originally Posted by John Kennett

Is there actually such a thing? I could do with talking to one because my attic was badly insulated by a general builder and is ludicrously draughty, but I don't know what needs to be done to sort it out properly.

If the attic has rock wool laid on the ceiling below then the loft space above should be vented (draughty) to avoid condensation problems
Or do you mean you have a loft room that is draughty?
If you look on the Triiso (actis) website it gives good information on how to insulate loft rooms and ensure airtightness as does the kingspan website however if either are fitted badly there effectiveness is greatly reduced
We used a heat loss engineer for our heat calcs for the barn conversion but his input was purely on paper to calculate the overall u values once the building was completed to his reccomended specifications

John Kennett · 14 December 2015, 19:14

We've got an attic storage room that is boarded out and the roof pitches are insulated with celotex. It's draughty though and there's no insulation in the floor.

beamishken · 14 December 2015, 19:40

Are the roof pitches plasterboarded over the celotex? The celotex has to be fitted tightly into the rafters and has to fully fill the void between roof covering and plasterboard to form a "warm roof" to avoid a condensation trap above the kingspan.
The problem is its a pain in the butt cutting all the compound angles that occur in a roof space so builders often rush the job because it's usually covered over.
You can improve the situation by filling any voids with expanding foam if it's not plastered over
If you want the house to be warm and your not bothered about the roof space being cold you could stuff rock wool under the floor to keep the heat in the house

Bren91 · 14 December 2015, 20:18

Hey mate,

I'm in Lymington and could do it, but not till after the new year.

It's not that hard of a job if your willing to tackle it yourself.
We had a cold room before we renovated in the loft. We used 100mm celotex cut between the rafters, then 30mm on the underside nailed to the rafters. (Process being roof covering, membrane, air gap, 100mm celotex, 30mm celotex then plasterboarded.

We don't have any draughts and it's bloody hot up there.

beamishken · 14 December 2015, 20:42

Two different methods depending on if roof has breather membrane or impervious felt
Need to be carefull to use correct method to avoid condensation trap above insulation
http://www.kingspaninsulation.co.uk/...itch-TP10.aspx
http://<br /> <br /> www.kingspanins...oof-Board.aspx

Bren91 · 14 December 2015, 21:03

Celotex always recommends using a gap of 50mm above. Between breathable felt and the celotex.

Kingspan must be different.

Mollers · 14 December 2015, 22:01

Quote:

Originally Posted by John Kennett

Is there actually such a thing? .

Yep, we wanted to not dry line (cover-up) our 100yo local granite walls inside. The HL engineer re-calc'd the place, we had to 'compensate' elsewhere to achieve an overall value for the whole place. Building control need to see this stuff before signing off these days.
I fitted MVHR (the best ECO gizmo bar none IMHO), therefore the place has to be as near to airtight as is possible. Having a draught free house is very satisfying.

Erin · 16 December 2015, 20:14

If the tiles/slates aren't on yet then I'd go Actis/Triso as the simplest approved method of insulating. However I guess your plans might already be approved and show rigid board. Bear in mind the rafters will be considered a 'cold bridge' so you will need a layer on the underside of them too such as thermal backed plasterboard.

Mollers: which make of MVHR have you gone for? It's early days in my research but there seem to be a lot of models out there and I'm contemplating one for our place as part of the refurb.

Mollers · 16 December 2015, 20:28

Quote:

Originally Posted by Erin

Mollers: which make of MVHR have you gone for? It's early days in my research but there seem to be a lot of models out there and I'm contemplating one for our place as part of the refurb.

This one. Mitsubishi Electric Lossnay - LGH-15RVX-E | eBay

The RRP is in the region of £1500. This is a steal!!

beamishken · 16 December 2015, 20:52

Are they suitable for use with open flue heating appliances ie rayburn/logburning stove's
Or is the need for them reduced by the draw from the appliance changing the air?
I'd be cautious of that ebay one 4 pictures of a cardboard box and -1 feedback definitely one to collect and pay on collection!
We've got actis in our present house and are looking at the YBS for the farm slightly thicker & more layers and cheaper but they seem to be the new kid on the block

Mollers · 16 December 2015, 22:49

Quote:

Originally Posted by beamishken

Are they suitable for use with open flue heating appliances ie rayburn/logburning stove's

Not ideal, as the appliances are effectively stealing warm air and 'holes' to outside.
We have an outside air supply to our log burner and an electric aga.

Achieving airtightness is a major undertaking, as is ducting it. No letterbox, cat flap, trickle vents in window frames....

Erin · 17 December 2015, 11:26

Quote:

Originally Posted by Mollers

This is a steal!!

I think you're right.

Thanks for info tho. Just read the spec and it quotes 'returns BOTH sensible heat and latent heat'. I'm wondering what sensible heat is? Is there a foolish kind as well that it ignores?

Mollers · 18 December 2015, 07:27

Downlighters, frightful things. Avoid if poss, if unavoidable, build airtight plasterboard boxes above them, it's a faff.

Otherwise, they're windtunnel outlets in a modern well vented roofspace.

IMPORTANT note to all, replace all halogen downlighter lamps (bulbs) with LEDs today! A sparky friend showed me the evidence of what a halogen downlighter can do in a confined space over time. Think of scorched timber after a bonfire.

Another top tip. Asda LED bulbs came out top in recent tests and they're as cheap as chips right now.