Reply
 
Thread Tools Search this Thread
 
Old 22 June 2015, 03:49   #1
Member
 
boristhebold's Avatar
 
Country: UK - England
Length: 7m +
Join Date: Aug 2009
Posts: 1,538
Warning about Plastic 'Sit-On' Kayaks

I came across a Kayaker having problems just off the coast between Poole and Bournemouth on Saturday, he was trying unsecesfully to get back onto his plastic kayak like the one in the image. These things are awful if conditions are anything but flat calm.

I went to his aid and put my boat next to his kayak protecting him from a very small swell so he could get back on, problem was he kept falling out as he could not balance 'on' the thing. After a couple of goes I switched my engine off and had him board my rib from ladder at stern and brought his kayak onboard. when I was man handling the kayak I could tell that the air compartment was half full of water and hence less stable than normal.

Took him back to his entry point on the beach. He was absolutely knackered so was very thankfull, his buddies were watching from the beach and did nothing.

So point is, these 'sit-on kayaks' are rubbish, if your going to sea in a kayak you should use the longer types that you 'sit-in' rather than on.

I thhink the bloke learned his lesson.
Attached Thumbnails
Click image for larger version

Name:	plastic-sit-on-top-kayak.jpg
Views:	230
Size:	7.4 KB
ID:	106299  
__________________

__________________
boristhebold is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 22 June 2015, 04:21   #2
Member
 
Country: UK - England
Town: I.O.W.
Make: Avon Searider
Length: 5m +
Engine: Yamaha F60
Join Date: May 2013
Posts: 40
Can't say I agree from my own personal experience.

The sit on top kayaks that I own are far easier to get back on and infinitely more stable than the sit inside kayaks that I have.

Sounds like the kayaker you came across was quite literally out of his depth.
__________________

__________________
6950rpm is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 22 June 2015, 04:37   #3
RIBnet Supporter
 
willk's Avatar
 
Country: Ireland
Make: Redbay Boats
Length: 9m +
Engine: 370hp
Join Date: Feb 2008
Posts: 13,772
RIBase
Quote:
Originally Posted by boristhebold View Post
So point is, these 'sit-on kayaks' are rubbish, if your going to sea in a kayak you should use the longer types that you 'sit-in' rather than on.

I thhink the bloke learned his lesson.
I guess that rules out surf boards too!

I have heard that some cheaper models have poor fittings that can crack and allow water to enter the hull void - maybe that was a factor. Overconfident and undertrained might be possible too!
__________________
.
willk is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 22 June 2015, 05:30   #4
Member
 
Country: UK - England
Town: Southampton
Make: Ballistic
Length: 7m +
Engine: Yam 225
Join Date: Jun 2010
Posts: 1,003
TBH sit ins are way worse, unless you have a pump fitted, your stuffed, even if you can re-entry roll or climb in.
__________________
Starovich is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 22 June 2015, 05:40   #5
Member
 
telcowilliam's Avatar
 
Country: UK - England
Town: Caernarfon
Boat name: Bay Bar Dos
Make: Tornado
Length: 6m +
Engine: Honda 130
MMSI: 235092178
Join Date: Sep 2010
Posts: 554
I think what has happened has water ingress has made it very unstable, I had a similar episode fishing last year in mine, the water was coming in through the rod holders which had drain holes in the bottom, Straight into the air chamber on the kayak!!!
__________________
There is no bigger hole than the sea within which to throw your money.....anon
telcowilliam is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 22 June 2015, 05:51   #6
Member
 
Country: UK - England
Boat name: Son of a Beach
Make: Avon SR4
Length: 4m +
Engine: Mercury 50hp
Join Date: Sep 2012
Posts: 130
I use sit on kayaks in a variety of conditions.

I get off the kayak to relieve myself if in a wetsuit, easy to get back on. The girlfriend came off hers when sunbathing in a sizeable swell whilst I was fishing, she got back on fine. I suggest it's the skill/experience level of the user rather than the equipment that is at fault here, a lot of the kayak fishing forums discuss practicing self rescues before heading out, may be something this individual should have tried/perfected.

Given the entry cost of a kayak I think there's a wide variety of users, from the over prepared with every gadget under the sun to the underprepared in shorts and a tshirt.
__________________
Tim in Yorkshire is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 22 June 2015, 06:04   #7
Member
 
boristhebold's Avatar
 
Country: UK - England
Length: 7m +
Join Date: Aug 2009
Posts: 1,538
Your probably correct, the chap in question was probably in his early fities and overweight and had been trying for some time I think to get back on so was very tired. He struggled to get up my boarding ladder and slipped a couple of times, good job I turned the outboard off before I got him to swim to boarding ladder.

So overweight, underfit and lots of water in air space of kayak not ideal. LOL... im sure he learned a good lesson, he was well embarressed.
__________________
boristhebold is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 22 June 2015, 07:19   #8
Member
 
gtflash's Avatar
 
Country: UK - England
Town: southampton
Boat name: TOP CAT 2
Make: Scorpion 8.1
Length: 8m +
Engine: 250hp HO
Join Date: Aug 2003
Posts: 1,496
Done the same once with two BIG lads on a jet ski. One could get back on, the other couldn't without turning it over. They could barely tread water when I picked them up.
__________________
gtflash is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 22 June 2015, 07:50   #9
Member
 
Bern Hanreck's Avatar
 
Country: UK - England
Town: Norfolk/Suffolk Borders
Make: no boat
Length: no boat
Join Date: Oct 2002
Posts: 819
As an unfit , overweight sixty year old I can confirm that these contraptions can be tricky to get back on ! I tried this two seater with my grand daughter last year . The escorts were great . Very professional & safety oriented and our group had a great time . After two hours and back in the harbour the youngsters all jumped off for a swim . Whilst trying to get my crew back on board , I turned turtle and found it quite tricky to get back astride . With the help of small rope loop , and some 3rd party assistance from the escorts , I did manage but it wasn't easy . Like most things practice and experience make a lot of difference .
Attached Thumbnails
Click image for larger version

Name:	IMGP0017.jpg
Views:	215
Size:	146.6 KB
ID:	106302  
__________________
Bern Hanreck is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 22 June 2015, 09:21   #10
Member
 
Country: USA
Town: Oakland CA
Length: 3m +
Join Date: Feb 2005
Posts: 6,653
Some of the divers on this side have taken to climbing back onto a sit-on-top from the rear of the craft. Drive up onto the stern, and wiggle forward while straddling the thing. Probably easier for them than a straight kayaker, as they have fins on (more push to get clear of the water.)

That said, I've seen the same as Boris' guy as well, a guy trying (unsuccessfully) to get aboard his kayak for something over a half an hour. Luckily, he was close enough to shore to be able to swim it back to the beach (and probably damn happy that he tried kayak diving close to shore first.)

jky
__________________
jyasaki is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 22 June 2015, 09:54   #11
Administrator
 
John Kennett's Avatar
 
Country: UK - England
Town: Brighton
Length: 3m +
Join Date: May 2000
Posts: 6,957
Quote:
Originally Posted by boristhebold View Post
So point is, these 'sit-on kayaks' are rubbish, if your going to sea in a kayak you should use the longer types that you 'sit-in' rather than on.
As others have said, it sounds like the biggest problem was water inside the hull. Lack of experience and fitness may have made the situation worse, but sit on tops are generally the easiest and most reliable type of kayaks for novices.
__________________
John Kennett is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 22 June 2015, 10:13   #12
RIBnet admin team
 
Poly's Avatar
 
Country: UK - Scotland
Boat name: imposter
Make: FunYak
Length: 3m +
Engine: Tohatsu 30HP
MMSI: 235089819
Join Date: Sep 2005
Posts: 11,009
Quote:
Originally Posted by jyasaki View Post
Some of the divers on this side have taken to climbing back onto a sit-on-top from the rear of the craft. Drive up onto the stern, and wiggle forward while straddling the thing. Probably easier for them than a straight kayaker, as they have fins on (more push to get clear of the water.)
I've done it without fins, its easier than getting over the side without rolling providing there is nothing behind the seat.

Free surface effect of water in a kayak is quite bad - but is no worse for a sit ON than a sit IN - but you may be less likely to notice the leak. I think the issue with sit ONs is that they seem so simple that anyone can jump on one and use it with no training and no specialist kit. An experienced sea kayaker going solo in the same water would probably have seemed massively over equipped with a VHF, small pump, spare paddle, paddle float etc.

I don't think the issue is sit ON v's sit IN, or even one shape v another - the issue is poor build quality (or ropey modifications) just as with any vessel. When I take the bung out my sit ON it is bone dry inside.
__________________
Poly is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 22 June 2015, 12:20   #13
Member
 
mick's Avatar
 
Country: UK - England
Town: Wakefield
Boat name: Bouncer
Make: Redbay Stormforce
Length: 6m +
Engine: 2x Honda 90Hp
MMSI: 235025718
Join Date: Jun 2009
Posts: 4,022
Never had any trouble with mine can get on from front back or side
__________________
mick is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 22 June 2015, 12:49   #14
Member
 
tony t's Avatar
 
Country: UK - Wales
Town: west mids /tywyn
Boat name: HAWK
Make: RIBCRAFT/ Suzuki 250
Length: 7m +
Engine: Tohatsu 3.8/15hpsuzi
MMSI: 235086594
Join Date: Apr 2008
Posts: 4,266
Quote:
Originally Posted by mick View Post
Never had any trouble with mine can get on from front back or side

I think they mean when your in the water Mick Click image for larger version

Name:	ImageUploadedByRIB Net1434995372.982415.jpg
Views:	161
Size:	76.8 KB
ID:	106311


Sent from my iPhone using RIB Net
__________________
When you get to the end of your rope..tie a knot and hang on..!!
Aberdovey Ribs
B.I.O.C.Member
B.S. LEADER
tony t is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 22 June 2015, 12:57   #15
Member
 
The Gurnard's Avatar
 
Country: UK - Scotland
Town: Stirling
Boat name: The Gurnard
Make: Quicksilver
Length: 4m +
Engine: mariner 25hp 2s
Join Date: Jul 2013
Posts: 1,260
I think most sit on tops are exceptionally stable kayaks.. proved when you can hook..play..and haul onboard..200lb skates. (see photos below linked off the internet)





But with a hull half full of water .. understandably.. they will become unstable..just as with most boats.

The Greenland type of kayaks (sea going sit ins) are not near as stable.. they are more akin to riding a bike..the stability comes from moving ..balance ..and bracing with the paddle.

I guess all boat types have inexperienced and poorly equiped drivers who get into difficulty or drown ..not just kayaks
__________________
The Gurnard is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 22 June 2015, 13:00   #16
Member
 
tony t's Avatar
 
Country: UK - Wales
Town: west mids /tywyn
Boat name: HAWK
Make: RIBCRAFT/ Suzuki 250
Length: 7m +
Engine: Tohatsu 3.8/15hpsuzi
MMSI: 235086594
Join Date: Apr 2008
Posts: 4,266
Quote:
Originally Posted by mick View Post
Never had any trouble with mine can get on from front back or side

Or who needs a Kayak
Click image for larger version

Name:	ImageUploadedByRIB Net1434995999.794887.jpg
Views:	167
Size:	81.1 KB
ID:	106313


Sent from my iPhone using RIB Net
__________________
When you get to the end of your rope..tie a knot and hang on..!!
Aberdovey Ribs
B.I.O.C.Member
B.S. LEADER
tony t is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 22 June 2015, 13:00   #17
Member
 
mick's Avatar
 
Country: UK - England
Town: Wakefield
Boat name: Bouncer
Make: Redbay Stormforce
Length: 6m +
Engine: 2x Honda 90Hp
MMSI: 235025718
Join Date: Jun 2009
Posts: 4,022
Click image for larger version

Name:	ImageUploadedByRIB Net1434995979.134732.jpg
Views:	181
Size:	139.7 KB
ID:	106312
Well I just followed you 😎
__________________
mick is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 22 June 2015, 13:01   #18
Member
 
tony t's Avatar
 
Country: UK - Wales
Town: west mids /tywyn
Boat name: HAWK
Make: RIBCRAFT/ Suzuki 250
Length: 7m +
Engine: Tohatsu 3.8/15hpsuzi
MMSI: 235086594
Join Date: Apr 2008
Posts: 4,266
Quote:
Originally Posted by mick View Post
Attachment 106312
Well I just followed you 😎

Don't follow me I hit rocks


Sent from my iPhone using RIB Net
__________________
When you get to the end of your rope..tie a knot and hang on..!!
Aberdovey Ribs
B.I.O.C.Member
B.S. LEADER
tony t is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 22 June 2015, 13:33   #19
Member
 
neil.mccrirrick's Avatar
 
Country: UK - England
Town: Oldham
Boat name: Miss Isle
Make: Solent 6.9
Length: 6m +
Engine: 225 optimax
Join Date: Jan 2008
Posts: 1,039
Now there's a photo to treasure 😀 I reckon tony has just pipped you for who wins the whitest legs mick, but it could be the contrast with your shirt tony😀


Sent from my iPad using my finger
__________________
"Too often we enjoy the comfort of opinion without the discomfort of thought."
neil.mccrirrick is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 22 June 2015, 14:03   #20
Member
 
Country: UK - England
Town: Mighty Penryn
Boat name: Little Joe.
Make: Avon Searider
Length: 4m +
Engine: Honda BF50
Join Date: Aug 2005
Posts: 8,869
Quote:
Originally Posted by Poly View Post
.

Free surface effect of water in a kayak is quite bad - but is no worse for a sit ON than a sit IN - but you may be less likely to notice the leak. I think the issue with sit ONs is that they seem so simple that anyone can jump on one and use it with no training and no specialist kit. An experienced sea kayaker going solo in the same water would probably have seemed massively over equipped with a VHF, small pump, spare paddle, paddle float etc.
You'd need a pretty serious leak in a sit-on to experience free surface, close to 'abandon ship'.

Sit-ons are fair weather leisure items, kind of a step-up from a blow-up dinghy. Sea going kayaks and those that use them, are a way different ball game.
__________________

__________________
Mollers is offline   Reply With Quote
Reply

Thread Tools Search this Thread
Search this Thread:

Advanced Search

Posting Rules
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

BB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is Off
Trackbacks are Off
Pingbacks are Off
Refbacks are Off




Copyright 2002- Social Knowledge, LLC All Rights Reserved.

All times are GMT -5. The time now is 21:26.


Powered by vBulletin® Version 3.8.8 Beta 1
Copyright ©2000 - 2019, vBulletin Solutions, Inc.
×