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Old 15 November 2014, 09:43   #421
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I was interested in why the manufacturer rejected the reco to review the hull design, after the specific mention in the report about the sudden increase in heel?
Not sure I was that surprised. Changing design could be seen as admission of a fault which makes them potentially liable... Better to blame the user and say ours is no worse than any others...

In my experience of product liabilities manufacturers tend to only voluntarily recall goods when there is no ambiguity of there being an issue and they are mitigating the size of the problem or they have a regulator who could force them to recall in which case they prefer to voluntarily do it because it implies its not bad enough to be regulatory forced to do so. I'm sure there are occasional backroom chats along the lines of "if you were to voluntarily recall it will save us having to force you to which cuts down some paperwork for both parties But if you choose not to we will be looking to use our regulatory powers."

I know there is a difference as MAIB didn't say recall, they said modify the design so presumably only for new boats going forward. But design change can be seen as saying the previous design is flawed... Along come the no win no fee guys...
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Old 16 November 2014, 05:08   #422
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I seem to remember that in the book Heavy weather power boating, one of the authors argues for not using kill cords in rough conditions, so that if the helm goes overboard, the person who takes control doesn't have to loose time restarting the engine (amongst other reasons). Does anyone agree with that advice? (I realise it's off topic from the Padstow tragedy)
No. And certainly on the E-TEC you can restart without the kill cord anyway, so that excuse doesn't apply even if it did make sense, which it doesn't for most users. The same system was fitted to my last boat - old Johnson 2 stroke - you could pull the cord off and the engine would stop, popping the key out slightly, but then push the key back in and restart if you needed to in a hurry.

If the helm goes overboard, in my view the best chance the other pax have of getting the situation under control is if it's all gone quiet at the stern, rather than that it's all still possibly roaring round in circles trying to chuck them out as well and run over the people who are now in the water. In really heavy seas if it takes the other pax ten or fifteen seconds to get the situation under control and the boat isn't circling, by the time they get things under control and turned around they might already have lost sight of the person now in the water.

Just my 2p...
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Old 16 November 2014, 07:37   #423
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"Isn't always"? My run through ends with never.
My missus does wear a spare kill cord but to be brutally honest I have no expectation that in the heat of the moment it would be very useful. However, I've made absolutely sure, (and then made absolutely sure again!) that Mrs B knows precisely how to operate the DSC radio and in the event that I go over the side when underway she should concentrate all her efforts on getting the Mayday out there (and acknowledged). She also knows how to set the flares off. She's never going to be out with me in a seaway but even in the flat calm I really would't want her trying to manoeuvre the boat back close enough alongside to pick me up and to be honest, she wouldn't be comfortable doing it so in my opinion it really wouldn't be a very sensible or even viable option....

I always wear a DSC handheld when out on the rib (clipped to my belt BUT ALSO ATTACHED WITH A LANYARD) so in the event I go overboard there's a chance I could communicate with relevant parties although I'm very well aware that Mustrib lost his on impact with the water when he was ejected earlier this year.

Only once the Mayday has been acknowledged should she attempt to restart the boat and then head back SLOWLY to the general area where she believes I am. Of course, if we're able to communicate between ourselves via VHF then happy days, I can possibly assist her with heading back to my location but when (if) she manages to get back to within 20 metres of me, cut the engine and chuck me a line!
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Old 16 November 2014, 08:17   #424
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My missus does wear a spare kill cord but to be brutally honest I have no expectation that in the heat of the moment it would be very useful. However, I've made absolutely sure, (and then made absolutely sure again!) that Mrs B knows precisely how to operate the DSC radio and in the event that I go over the side when underway she should concentrate all her efforts on getting the Mayday out there (and acknowledged). She also knows how to set the flares off. She's never going to be out with me in a seaway but even in the flat calm I really would't want her trying to manoeuvre the boat back close enough alongside to pick me up and to be honest, she wouldn't be comfortable doing it so in my opinion it really wouldn't be a very sensible or even viable option....

I always wear a DSC handheld when out on the rib (clipped to my belt BUT ALSO ATTACHED WITH A LANYARD) so in the event I go overboard there's a chance I could communicate with relevant parties although I'm very well aware that Mustrib lost his on impact with the water when he was ejected earlier this year.

Only once the Mayday has been acknowledged should she attempt to restart the boat and then head back SLOWLY to the general area where she believes I am. Of course, if we're able to communicate between ourselves via VHF then happy days, I can possibly assist her with heading back to my location but when (if) she manages to get back to within 20 metres of me, cut the engine and chuck me a line!
If it's lumpy and it's only the two of us, I slip a PLB in the sky rocket. I put more trust in the CG and RN getting me out.
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Old 16 November 2014, 13:03   #425
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Iirc the RNLI boats have sprung loaded throttles. If the helm goes overboard the engines return to idle. Hence mitigating the risk associated with not having a kill cord.
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Old 16 November 2014, 13:21   #426
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Iirc the RNLI boats have sprung loaded throttles. If the helm goes overboard the engines return to idle. Hence mitigating the risk associated with not having a kill cord.
I said this previously based on information I read here - but some current helms assured me it is not the case.
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Old 16 November 2014, 14:04   #427
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Iirc the RNLI boats have sprung loaded throttles. If the helm goes overboard the engines return to idle. Hence mitigating the risk associated with not having a kill cord.
Incorrect

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I said this previously based on information I read here - but some current helms assured me it is not the case.
Correct - the throttle control boxes on an Atlantic 85 are standard.

Always remember that a RNLI helmsperson is a very highly trained individual and that their SOP is never to leave their position and always to have their hands on the throttles at all times
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Old 16 November 2014, 14:19   #428
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SOP is never to leave their position and always to have their hands on the throttles at all times
I'd imagine that most who've been spat out had a similar intended SOP.

Regardless of training or experience, shit happens.

ILB helms are human not gods, I know a couple.
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Old 16 November 2014, 14:31   #429
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I'd imagine that most who've been spat out had a similar intended SOP.

Regardless of training or experience, shit happens.

ILB helms are human not gods, I know a couple.
What ever you say
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Old 16 November 2014, 14:33   #430
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What ever you say
Weak.
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