View Poll Results: Should there be a legally enforced alcohol limit for leisure boaters?
Yes. Legislation is the way forward. 33 32.04%
Don't mind. I don't drink and boat so it won't affect me. 11 10.68%
No. Things are fine as they are. 59 57.28%
Voters: 103. You may not vote on this poll

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Old 14 August 2007, 07:25   #71
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I read your thread quite clearly thanks. What came across was that you choose an example to back up your "drink boating" argument. You could use the same argument on dry land if you wished

.... next-door neighbour rushes around to your isolated farmhouse because her father has fallen onto a hay-bailing spike and is bleeding profusely. Unfortunately as all the local roads are flooded there is no chance of an ambulance getting through, but you're able to put him in your Tractor and drive him the 10 miles to hospital… at least you would ...but you’ve had a couple of glasses of cider as is your want at this time of year…..what would you do?

Same argument? Legislation happens because there are idiots out there with no self-control and scant regard for the welfare of others. It’s inevitable. I have always been against compulsory licensing and legislation for boating activities, but following the steady rise in popularity of boats over my 25 years of association with them it has become inevitable that it will attract more and more of these idiots and as sure as night follows day, legislation will follow…
As I explained in my thread, but perhaps I wasn't clear - I do not drink and drive a car or a rib - although saying that I had one drink at priory bay.

In your scenario, I wouldn't drive my tractor as I would probably do more harm than good to the patient by moving them, I am not a medically trained individual and would therefore request an air ambulance. Not the same at all.

We were looking for a possible survivor in the water - as it turned out he had died.

As you say, there are idiots out there which is why we need legislation, and in theory I agree. Unfortunately, these 'idiots' are not the ones to follow the legislation, only the law abidding people. It will not cut down on idiots behaving or trying to get away with sailing whilst drunk - although I grant that it would give the law inforcement officers a fighting chance to nick these people if they catch them first.

You are fighting me as though I am against legislation - I am not - but I think that it has to be workable and thought through.
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Old 14 August 2007, 07:33   #72
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It's a shame that this forum doesn't have any voting functionality, as this would be a great topic to get the forum's view on.

My guess is that 70% would be against any kind of formal legislation.

The fact is, that any death caused by a person in charge of a boat while in British waters can still lead to a prosecution for man slaughter etc. Which, in my view is legislation enough.

What we could probably do with is a number of high profile prosecutions to make people realise that there are possibly negative consequences, which may change some people's behaviours.

In the case highlighted in the start of this thread, the guy's lost his boat,which is probably justice enough. Now, if I was one of his passengers, I'd probably sue - another way to enforce behaviours without going down the legislative route.
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Old 14 August 2007, 07:44   #73
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It's a shame that this forum doesn't have any voting functionality, as this would be a great topic to get the forum's view on.
Could be fun to see the answers!

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In the case highlighted in the start of this thread, the guy's lost his boat,which is probably justice enough. Now, if I was one of his passengers, I'd probably sue - another way to enforce behaviours without going down the legislative route.
Perhaps taking this a step further - if they have insurance, their boat is not covered when the skipper is under the influence - but then there is another debate as insurance is not compulsory
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Old 14 August 2007, 07:46   #74
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As I explained in my thread, but perhaps I wasn't clear - I do not drink and drive a car or a rib -
That’s admirable, but I suspect you are generally a responsible law-abiding person. Unfortunately, because of the state of modern society as a whole, you are heading into a minority. Legislation is, generally, with some exceptions, aimed at protecting us even if we don’t agree with it (Codders step in here for your traditional Tony Blair rant..)

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In your scenario, I wouldn't drive my tractor as I would probably do more harm than good to the patient by moving them, I am not a medically trained individual and would therefore request an air ambulance. Not the same at all.
Why not? Requesting an Air Ambulance around here would have been futile especially with the weather conditions prevalent at the time. …but my point was simply that you can find a convincing argument to back up support or opposition fore anything…

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Originally Posted by Sarah G View Post
As you say, there are idiots out there which is why we need legislation, and in theory I agree. Unfortunately, these 'idiots' are not the ones to follow the legislation, only the law abiding people. It will not cut down on idiots behaving or trying to get away with sailing whilst drunk - although I grant that it would give the law inforcement officers a fighting chance to nick these people if they catch them first. .
Which is pretty much what I said in my previous post.. if the law had been in place that RIB crew would have been sobering up in the cells..not A&E…

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You are fighting me as though I am against legislation - I am not - but I think that it has to be workable and thought through. .
I’m not fighting you at all… I believe that the time has come for sensible legislation on drinking … enforced properly…


PS Please accept my apologies if I don’t respond further… I’m off for a while and not sure of Internet access..…cheers, Jono

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Old 14 August 2007, 07:51   #75
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Could be fun to see the answers!



[
Quote:
QUOTE]Perhaps taking this a step further - if they have insurance, their boat is not covered when the skipper is under the influence - but then there is another debate as insurance is not compulsory
[/QUOTE]

Why When driving a car your still insured when under the influence
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Old 14 August 2007, 07:52   #76
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Which is pretty much what I said in my previous post.. if the law had been in place that RIB crew would have been sobering up in the cells..not A&E…
I wasn't there at the time, but they say that the police warned these people not to go out. I would have thought that if the Police were that concerned that they could have retained them on other grounds. Perhaps the police had seen them, warned them not to go, they said 'oh no officer we won't go we were just getting our jackets' and then left anyway.

Isn't there legislation for boats having lights for nightime navigation? If my memory serves me correctly, the skipper of the ill-fated motor boat that collided in Scotland with another boat killing the other skipper get charged on grounds that neither boats were correctly lit, that both were over the limit, etc. Perhaps somebody who knows whether this is a legislation already could confirm/denigh this.

It could be that there is sufficient legislation to stop these idiots just it has to be enforced.
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Old 14 August 2007, 07:54   #77
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Why When driving a car your still insured when under the influence [/QUOTE]

Check your insurance documents. Many companies opted out (I think it was Pearl that started it after a big incident involving a drunk driver that killed a number of people). If you are involved in an accident when over the limit, your car is not covered even if it is not your fault. I am fairly sure that they will repair the other peoples cars in the event that it was your fault.
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Old 14 August 2007, 08:20   #78
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Correct - my car insurance doesn't cover me if driving while over the limit or under the influence of drugs. I'm almost certain that is industry wide now.
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Old 14 August 2007, 08:41   #79
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[

Check your insurance documents. Many companies opted out (I think it was Pearl that started it after a big incident involving a drunk driver that killed a number of people). If you are involved in an accident when over the limit, your car is not covered even if it is not your fault. I am fairly sure that they will repair the other peoples cars in the event that it was your fault. [/QUOTE]


They paid out for a new car at xmas to a mates son who was only 20

Might depend on the different companys
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Old 14 August 2007, 08:57   #80
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[QUOTE=Jono;214117] That’s admirable, but I suspect you are generally a responsible law-abiding person. Unfortunately, because of the state of modern society as a whole, you are heading into a minority. Legislation is, generally, with some exceptions, aimed at protecting us even if we don’t agree with it (Codders step in here for your traditional Tony Blair rant..)



You say about the state of modern society and legislation which is there to protect us?? but its legislation thats got society in this crisis! why would more legislation achieve a better society?? whats a system that keeps piling legislation upon legislation, its a system thats in a mess, and as soon as i have become a fully qualified electrician i'm of to oz to live
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