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Old 05 July 2010, 07:31   #1
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Should I or Shouldnt I??

I have the option to take on an old Rhib.

The trouble is I dont know how much it would cost to get it sea worthy again.

I cant find any holes or even patches but she does deflate through the pressure release valves (is this an easy fix?), also I noticed the tube is coming away from the fibreglass hull on one side (is this an easy fix or costly)? Appart from that the Rhib does scrub up too badly.

Then we come to the Mercury 20hp engine (blue writing on the side, mid 80's possibly?)

At some stage it had steering and throttle to a centre console, the console is still there but the cables have snapped or siezed. The engine itself looks to have a gear issue as you cant seem to select reverse (without it running as I havent got that far yet).
I notice the fuel line attachment is damaged which is an easy enough fix and the pull start does move and turn the egine over.

Basically, should I run or take this bad boy on? Anyone who could recomend me a person to speak to about it or give me some idea of the costs involved would be greatly apprecaited as I am a total beginner.

All I want the boat for is to trundle up esturies with my two boys (4 and 6) and get a little fishing in.

I know it is always difficult to put a cost to someting you havent seen but rought ideas would be great.

Thanks

Gungemyster
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Old 05 July 2010, 09:49   #2
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hi there,

as a relative newbie myself to ribs you done the right thing coming here. i got some great reponses on my questions only a few weeks ago.

if it's a mercury blueband engine, i had one of these many years ago and it was a good little engine but not worth a whole lot these days.

i'll let the experts answer your rib questions but from the little you know/have said i'd give this a wide berth (no pun) and seek an alternative.

cheers
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Old 05 July 2010, 09:59   #3
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p.s it maybe beneficial to know a rough budget for people to recommend something to you?

cheers
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Old 05 July 2010, 12:44   #4
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It'd help to know what boat it is, or if you don't know that, a few pics would help.
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Old 05 July 2010, 13:59   #5
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Gungemyster View Post
I have the option to take on an old Rhib.

The trouble is I dont know how much it would cost to get it sea worthy again.

I cant find any holes or even patches but she does deflate through the pressure release valves (is this an easy fix?),
are you sure its the valves not the thing becoming porous? If its the inflation valves this is a relatively easy fix (search here and you'll find threads on valve replacement - depending on the design you may need to get the knife and glue out which I imagine will be intimidating for a beginner at tube repair). Indeed its possible that its just crap in the valve seals and a careful clean will fix it. I've never heard anyone complain of leaking over-pressure release valves. Doesn't mean it doesn't happen though. If it is fitted with them and its over a period of a few days it goes soft, or certainly overnight, then it may just be them working as the tube heats up and the contents expand.

How long does it hold air for?
Can you pump it up and wash it down with soapy water (washing up liquid) to look for leaks at the seams, tiny pinholes or the whole thing going porous.
If you can pump it up does each chamber inflate separately or have any of the internal baffles gone?

Do you know if it is Hypalon / Polyurethane (PU) / PVC ? The lifetime of the tubes varies with material, as does the specifics of the repair.

The cost of repairing probably depends on a whole load of variables, but to throw a number out there I'd have thought you could DIY a repair to a single valve for 50 ish. If its got 5 chambers it would cost less to do all 5, but not a whole lot less. RIBShop, Paul Tilley, Henshaws (all members here) etc would be able to quote for repairing as well as refurbishing the tubes if thats what was needed, if they had pictures and details. I doubt from the way you are talking that you'd want the expense of replacing the tubes completely.

Quote:
also I noticed the tube is coming away from the fibreglass hull on one side (is this an easy fix or costly)?
Should be a relatively straightforward fix if the material/fabric is still intact. Its all about the preparation and using the right glue. Glue, solvents etc would cost less than 50 and you'd possibly need these anyway for valve repairs or any future patching.

Quote:
Then we come to the Mercury 20hp engine (blue writing on the side, mid 80's possibly?)

At some stage it had steering and throttle to a centre console, the console is still there but the cables have snapped or siezed.
replacement throttle and gear cables will be somewhere in the 15-30 each range depending on length and quality. Vert straightforward to fit. Steering cable is a bit more expensive - and may be trickier to get the old one off depending how rusted it is (I'm assuming we are talking "teleflex" here not actual cable steering. If its thin wire cables you'll need to talk to someone like 9d280 who has an unhealthy interest in vintage outboards!
Quote:
The engine itself looks to have a gear issue as you cant seem to select reverse (without it running as I havent got that far yet).
I notice the fuel line attachment is damaged which is an easy enough fix and the pull start does move and turn the egine over.
i'd want to see the engine running. Assume its going to need a service and impellor change as a minimum (if you DIY it the parts will be about 30 quid - if you pay someone it will probably be the wrong side of 100). The gear could be as simple as a badly ajusted linkage or it might mean its about to need a new gearbox. Is the gearbox oil clean or milky? I'm guessing this engine hasn't seen much tlc recently. This could be a problem, even if there is nothing serious wrong with it, you need to get the bottom half off to replace the impellor (should be done every 1-2 years in theory). The mechanical people here would also suggest you want a compression test on the engine - this should tell you if its about to get very expensive.

Quote:
All I want the boat for is to trundle up esturies with my two boys (4 and 6) and get a little fishing in.
a controvertial suggestion round here - but a RIB may not be the most appropriate boat for that?

One other thought with one adult + a 4yr old + 6 yr old; I'd really want seats for all: does this provide that? Perched on top of a tube is not a good place for little uns.

Anyone suggesting a cost to fix will be guessing. It could be as little as 20 to fix the tubes (if turns out that the valves are fine, or at least holding air long enough not to bother) but if its got lots to fix and you want a pro to do it then it could run to several hundred. New tubes would cost atleast a few thousand (assuming its small as it has a 20hp engine).

The engine end of things I'd expect a minimum of 200 to get it all connected back up and ready to run again. But potentially much more, I'm guessing if the gearbox is nackered you are lookign at finding a spare bottom half at a breakers. Worst case you might be able to replace the whole engine with something of similar vintage (and hence risk) for around 500 ish?

If its on a trailer I'd assume the wheel bearings need replaced as a minimum (assuming you DIY that will be something like 40-50 for the pair). Obviously tyres, etc may need replacing too if they are in a similar state to the boat.

Now you'll also want life jackets (x3 at least) so thats probably well over 100.
Most people here would strongly suggest and anchor and rope (50 ish), a handheld vhf (80 ish), and possibly a GPS (100+), as basic equipment. When you add in ropes to tie it up with, spare spark plugs, a few tools, a paddle, and all the other bits n pieces then I think you are lookign at another 100. And we've not even covered nice-to-have like a fishfinder (100)

All in if someone is giving you the boat FOC then you will still need a budget of 500 to get you started IF you are very lucky. If it needs a lot of work and you're not that confident it could be a 1500+ project.
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Old 06 July 2010, 04:19   #6
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Originally Posted by Nos4r2 View Post
It'd help to know what boat it is, or if you don't know that, a few pics would help.
The boat is a Narwarth or Narwal (does this sound right?
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Old 06 July 2010, 04:28   #7
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Originally Posted by Polwart View Post
are you sure its the valves not the thing becoming porous? If its the inflation valves this is a relatively easy fix (search here and you'll find threads on valve replacement - depending on the design you may need to get the knife and glue out which I imagine will be intimidating for a beginner at tube repair). Indeed its possible that its just crap in the valve seals and a careful clean will fix it. I've never heard anyone complain of leaking over-pressure release valves. Doesn't mean it doesn't happen though. If it is fitted with them and its over a period of a few days it goes soft, or certainly overnight, then it may just be them working as the tube heats up and the contents expand.

How long does it hold air for?
Can you pump it up and wash it down with soapy water (washing up liquid) to look for leaks at the seams, tiny pinholes or the whole thing going porous.
If you can pump it up does each chamber inflate separately or have any of the internal baffles gone?

Do you know if it is Hypalon / Polyurethane (PU) / PVC ? The lifetime of the tubes varies with material, as does the specifics of the repair.

The cost of repairing probably depends on a whole load of variables, but to throw a number out there I'd have thought you could DIY a repair to a single valve for 50 ish. If its got 5 chambers it would cost less to do all 5, but not a whole lot less. RIBShop, Paul Tilley, Henshaws (all members here) etc would be able to quote for repairing as well as refurbishing the tubes if thats what was needed, if they had pictures and details. I doubt from the way you are talking that you'd want the expense of replacing the tubes completely.


Should be a relatively straightforward fix if the material/fabric is still intact. Its all about the preparation and using the right glue. Glue, solvents etc would cost less than 50 and you'd possibly need these anyway for valve repairs or any future patching.

replacement throttle and gear cables will be somewhere in the 15-30 each range depending on length and quality. Vert straightforward to fit. Steering cable is a bit more expensive - and may be trickier to get the old one off depending how rusted it is (I'm assuming we are talking "teleflex" here not actual cable steering. If its thin wire cables you'll need to talk to someone like 9d280 who has an unhealthy interest in vintage outboards!
i'd want to see the engine running. Assume its going to need a service and impellor change as a minimum (if you DIY it the parts will be about 30 quid - if you pay someone it will probably be the wrong side of 100). The gear could be as simple as a badly ajusted linkage or it might mean its about to need a new gearbox. Is the gearbox oil clean or milky? I'm guessing this engine hasn't seen much tlc recently. This could be a problem, even if there is nothing serious wrong with it, you need to get the bottom half off to replace the impellor (should be done every 1-2 years in theory). The mechanical people here would also suggest you want a compression test on the engine - this should tell you if its about to get very expensive.

a controvertial suggestion round here - but a RIB may not be the most appropriate boat for that?

One other thought with one adult + a 4yr old + 6 yr old; I'd really want seats for all: does this provide that? Perched on top of a tube is not a good place for little uns.

Anyone suggesting a cost to fix will be guessing. It could be as little as 20 to fix the tubes (if turns out that the valves are fine, or at least holding air long enough not to bother) but if its got lots to fix and you want a pro to do it then it could run to several hundred. New tubes would cost atleast a few thousand (assuming its small as it has a 20hp engine).

The engine end of things I'd expect a minimum of 200 to get it all connected back up and ready to run again. But potentially much more, I'm guessing if the gearbox is nackered you are lookign at finding a spare bottom half at a breakers. Worst case you might be able to replace the whole engine with something of similar vintage (and hence risk) for around 500 ish?

If its on a trailer I'd assume the wheel bearings need replaced as a minimum (assuming you DIY that will be something like 40-50 for the pair). Obviously tyres, etc may need replacing too if they are in a similar state to the boat.

Now you'll also want life jackets (x3 at least) so thats probably well over 100.
Most people here would strongly suggest and anchor and rope (50 ish), a handheld vhf (80 ish), and possibly a GPS (100+), as basic equipment. When you add in ropes to tie it up with, spare spark plugs, a few tools, a paddle, and all the other bits n pieces then I think you are lookign at another 100. And we've not even covered nice-to-have like a fishfinder (100)

All in if someone is giving you the boat FOC then you will still need a budget of 500 to get you started IF you are very lucky. If it needs a lot of work and you're not that confident it could be a 1500+ project.
Wow, thats awesome advice, I will try out a few things tonight and let you know.

The rib is a Narwal or something like that. I think the internal baffels have gone. The pressure release value does his away and it took two days to go down. Its a big white value held in with loads of philips head screws. It you stick you finger in it you can feel the presure build behind it.

I will let you know how I get on.
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Old 06 July 2010, 04:35   #8
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Originally Posted by Gungemyster View Post
The boat is a Narwarth or Narwal (does this sound right?
Yes - so something like these:

http://inflatables.apolloduck.com/di...tml?aid=150255
http://inflatables.apolloduck.com/di...tml?aid=145004
http://www.boatsandoutboards.co.uk/view/PAA6526

But with a smaller engine.

Looking at those ads the boat you were looking at would need to VERY cheap to consider it - when "ready to use" boats (with bigger engines) are costing only slightly more than your worst case repair costs.
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Old 06 July 2010, 04:45   #9
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The rib is a Narwal or something like that. I think the internal baffels have gone. The pressure release value does his away and it took two days to go down. Its a big white value held in with loads of philips head screws. It you stick you finger in it you can feel the presure build behind it.
That sounds more like the inflation valves (which you can use to deflate the boat by poking something in it) than "pressure release valves" which are designed to "blow off" if you try to over-inflate / hit something hard / leave it in the sun etc.

Internal baffles are not 100% essential - but they are certainly desirable. If you get a puncture anywhere the whole tube will deflate if the baffles are shot. If the baffles are intact you only lose the 1 chamber. You want to at least get a clamshell puncture kit then - to do emergency repairs at sea. Its unlikely to be economical to get the baffles fixed, and its not really a DIY job for beginners.

Here is the manufacturer's website: http://www.narwhal.es/narwhal.php?page=--inicio&ln=EN
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Old 06 July 2010, 05:46   #10
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Thank you so much for your help.

The tubes are Hypertext.

I think you are right, its too much for a begineer, especially when the guys hasnt given me a price yet. I know he paid 800 at auction and as it is, I would not want to give much more than 100 with the work that needs to be done.
I think it is save up a few more pennies and get one running and ready to go. There isnt even a winch on the trailer and it doesnt sit well on the trailer.
I will post up some pics shortly.
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