rip off uk??? - Page 2

Poly · 06 January 2007, 11:02

Tango,

GRP boats are labour intensive to build and so are inevitable slighly cheaper in other countries where labour costs are lower (and usually so are the standards of living / conditions for the people that put your boat together).

Bare boat price (ex VAT) though I think you will find that Leeway could make you an 8.3m boat for that price - with UK support/service/backup; much reduced delivery costs etc. The ability to enforce contracts if it all goes tits up - because it is English law. The ability to see similar boats he has built before, to see it in construction (so you know he is not skimping on materials), you know the tubes are built by a professional etc. He doesn't currently offer a 9m boat... He is probably the cheapest in the UK but hasn't built up a Brand etc as such.

I think the issues you will have in this potential purchase are: (1) who is going to CE/RCD certify this as an imported boat (2) the price you quote will be exclusive of VAT [and any other import duties] (3) transporting a boat from Russia will not be cheap. Assuming you are not planning to sail it back from the Baltic I expect a 9m rib is going to cost you at least another £1k (probably more) to get back from Russia. Add £2k for VAT. Add the cost/effort of dealing with RCD importation as well as the "risk" in a russian transaction, the lack of support (even if it is a legitiamite Revenger (unlikely) then don't expect Revneger UK to support a grey import), the inability to get parts (or probably anyone to service) a russian engine and saving a few pounds for a bare boat is no longer attractive. Oh, and beware that language/culture barriers may mean that a UK builder is quoting you a boat, with console, tubes, a frame etc - because they are all effectively prerequisites but the russian may not be.

All without a single bit of sentimentality or patriotism - just reality - if it was that easy then the builder would be marketing to the UK direct - raking in the money and everyone here would be saving thousands...

BogMonster · 06 January 2007, 11:08

Polwart,
To sum it up, "if it looks too good to be true then it probably is"...

Milan · 06 January 2007, 11:28

Yeah yeah we know when we've been Tangoed

AndyB007 · 06 January 2007, 11:31

I know I'll get shot to pieces for saying this, but here goes ....

Those of us of more 'mature' years will remember a very similar debate with the British Motorcycle industry following the first Japanese imports. British was undoubtedly best, but it didn't take long for the British 'head in the sand' attitude to bite them where it hurt, and pretty permanently too.

We face a global commercial threat from the so-called 'BRIC' countries (Brazil, Russia, India, China) and the sooner we face up to this the sooner we might be able to retain what little industry we have left in this country.

I await the torrent of abuse ...!!

Andy

ps - would I buy a RIB from Russia - NO! I wouldn't take the risk, but there's plenty who will.

tango1 · 06 January 2007, 12:37

when i find out more next week yous will be the first to know. i am not talking about importing ten boats just one for me. their are many ways of getting the boat here. tax etc is not as bad as it looks as you would get 20% off the price if it is for export ,and yes i still think we pay too much here for many things not just boats.guys we are all on the same side here arent we? ps i have to write them an email this weekend with what i want from them ie spec etc. when i have done this i will post a copy of it here for all of yous to read. pps here is a small pic of one of their boats.

bedajim · 06 January 2007, 12:46

Quote:

Originally Posted by tango1

when i find out more next week yous will be the first to know. i am not talking about importing ten boats just one for me. their are many ways of getting the boat here. tax etc is not as bad as it looks as you would get 20% off the price if it is for export ,and yes i still think we pay too much here for many things not just boats.guys we are all on the same side here arent we? ps i have to write them an email this weekend with what i want from them ie spec etc. when i have done this i will post a copy of it here for all of yous to read. pps here is a small pic of one of their boats.

Very small pic

Nick Hearne · 06 January 2007, 12:51

So how do we get UK boat builders to pay VERY low wages so you can have cheaper boats? The cost of living is much higher in the UK, so what we make will be more expensive!! It's not that hard to work out!

Stephen-RIB · 06 January 2007, 13:25

Quote:

Originally Posted by tango1

when i find out more next week yous will be the first to know. i am not talking about importing ten boats just one for me. their are many ways of getting the boat here. tax etc is not as bad as it looks as you would get 20% off the price if it is for export ,and yes i still think we pay too much here for many things not just boats.guys we are all on the same side here arent we? ps i have to write them an email this weekend with what i want from them ie spec etc. when i have done this i will post a copy of it here for all of yous to read. pps here is a small pic of one of their boats.

Well, you have sold it to me, I shall move to Russia to become a boat builder and live happily ever after!!

alt · 06 January 2007, 14:31

Quote:

Originally Posted by tango1

when i find out more next week yous will be the first to know. i am not talking about importing ten boats just one for me. their are many ways of getting the boat here. tax etc is not as bad as it looks as you would get 20% off the price if it is for export ,and yes i still think we pay too much here for many things not just boats.guys we are all on the same side here arent we? ps i have to write them an email this weekend with what i want from them ie spec etc. when i have done this i will post a copy of it here for all of yous to read. pps here is a small pic of one of their boats.

So you're buying a boat, from Russia, without EVER seeing it?

Wanna buy my car?

Poly · 06 January 2007, 14:44

Quote:

Originally Posted by tango1

guys we are all on the same side here arent we?

Well ignoring the ecconomic arguments for buying a UK or EU produced boat which support the 'local' ecconomy(ies), and the 'balance of payments'.

- the reason why people are being slighlty confrontational with you is: most people who post on these forums (especially new users) are either trying to get help/advice/information or are offering help/advice/information/recommendations.

YOU appear to be eaither (1) boasting about how much money you are going to save, when you haven't actually got a quote or worked out the other issues OR (2) trying to lure people into using you as a conduit to make these sales (or perhaps you are actually a russian boat builder).

When people have tried to offer advice or comments on the possible downsides of buying in russia you have been dismissive or ignored it.

If you have found such a great deal; don't want the rest of the world to know the details of the deal; don't want advice or help with the deal; etc then why post it on the internet - especially before you have all the facts

To further my suspicions a quick google suggests that list prices at russian boat builders is not enormously cheaper than the UK e.g. £3750 for a 3.9m bare boat rib; £7500 for a bare boat 5.5m rib. These prices will be excluding VAT.

Poly · 06 January 2007, 14:55

Quote:

Originally Posted by AndyB007

Those of us of more 'mature' years will remember a very similar debate with the British Motorcycle industry following the first Japanese imports. British was undoubtedly best, but it didn't take long for the British 'head in the sand' attitude to bite them where it hurt, and pretty permanently too.

Yes but individuals didn't go to Japan with a pile of cash to try and get a single bike on the cheap. Companies imported them to sell on (or the Japanese set up local distributors in the UK)- which is a different proposition. I would also suggest that Japan was more ecconomically developed, and founded on strong legal/business principles which (once understood) makes it more apealing to work with than Russia, where having bundles of US dollars in brown envelopes will probably help a lot. Finally my understanding is that Japan can make goods efficiently by using efficient processes, and possibly a different work ethos, but not through paying people a pitance.

Tomas · 06 January 2007, 15:48

Quote:

Originally Posted by Polwart

If you have found such a great deal; don't want the rest of the world to know the details of the deal; don't want advice or help with the deal; etc then why post it on the internet - especially before you have all the facts

I think that statement gets right to the point Polwart.

Deposits are now being accepted for CyberRIBS manufactured in Nigeria. It's a new process whereby the air is compacted into flotation without the need of a tube. These RIBS can be emailed avoiding all sort of nasty transit costs. Please PM me and I'll give you the routing number to deposit your checks!

Tomas

alt · 06 January 2007, 15:49

Tango - Tell ya what...

Buy the RIB
Bring it back to the UK
Post lots of pictures/videos
Drive it for a month
Bring us all for test run's
Boast about how much you saved
Give us contact details

Until then, keep it hush hush and it can be your own little secret!!!!!1one!!!111

tango1 · 06 January 2007, 16:12

please just look at my orginal post. i never said i was going to buy it.i never said british was crap.all i have said since is that i want to find out more about it and when i do i will be more than happy to tell all.

alt · 06 January 2007, 17:39

Quote:

Originally Posted by tango1

please just look at my orginal post. i never said i was going to buy it.i never said british was crap.all i have said since is that i want to find out more about it and when i do i will be more than happy to tell all.

Why don't you give us a link, and we'll find out for ourselves?

You said before that you don't want to go giving out a link/contact info because 'i will post the url when i have found out what i need to from the makers. after all if they get a lot of emails from the uk about their boats ,i think the price might just go up a little and after all i took me a lot of time to just get to this stage' .... But price shouldn't matter to you since you say you've never said you're going to buy one.

TROLL TROLL TROLL TROLL TROLL TROLL

tango1 · 06 January 2007, 18:35

Quote:

Originally Posted by Polwart

Yes but individuals didn't go to Japan with a pile of cash to try and get a single bike on the cheap. Companies imported them to sell on (or the Japanese set up local distributors in the UK)- which is a different proposition. I would also suggest that Japan was more ecconomically developed, and founded on strong legal/business principles which (once understood) makes it more apealing to work with than Russia, where having bundles of US dollars in brown envelopes will probably help a lot. Finally my understanding is that Japan can make goods efficiently by using efficient processes, and possibly a different work ethos, but not through paying people a pitance.

before making a suggestion about Japan please study basics of bissunes marketing

Powerboats · 06 January 2007, 18:39

Quote:

Originally Posted by tango1

before making a suggestion about Japan please study basics of bissunes marketing

Please explain???? Seems like we could all learn something from you?!

Andre · 06 January 2007, 19:04

I have my doubts that ribs on a large scale are made in Russia. There is an import and the leaders are Zodiac, Avon and perhaps some other. We have supplied some as well.

There are some SIB manufactures and one of them is: www.mnev.ru

My feeling is that Tango1 came across a web page of a Russian importer/distributor say of Revenger ribs. A Russian rib producer interested in exporting would of course had his web page at least in English and not only in Russian. Of course a link to the page in question will explain all. I do read and speak some Russian so would be interested in this link.

Poly · 06 January 2007, 19:23

Quote:

Originally Posted by tango1

before making a suggestion about Japan please study basics of bissunes marketing

I am totally confused by your comment. I assume that "bissunes" was intended to read "business". Whilst I don't profess to be an expert in the area I would suggest that I have a grasp of the basics - so please do elaborate... as I have absolutely no idea what you are getting at.

tango1 · 06 January 2007, 19:41

Sorry for wrong spelling. I meant that Japan which was never a very industrial country before the Second World War and which was a rip off by the Americans after the war could create a very fast industrial empire. So please don't assume it was a developed country!
As a said i would post my email to the company which a have now done and i will leave this to read at your leisure

Здравствуйте Светлана!

Я звонила Вам в пятницу по поводу.
Мы очень заинтересованы узнать побольше о лодке.
Если возможно я хотела бы задать несколько вопросов.
Первое как я поняла 15000 евро это стоимость лодки без мотора, не могли бы Вы посчитать ее стоимость вместе с встроенным дизель-двигателем приблизительно на 300 л.с. отечественого и/или импортного производства, включая стоимость установки этого двигателя. Еще нам бы хотелось увидет побольше фото и узнать какие сертификаты она имеет .

Просто для информации я выступаю как частный покупатель.

Большое спасибо заранее.