Marina Berth / Bilge Pump / Trunk Question

woot · 29 October 2007, 22:13

I have recently put my Ribcraft 5.85 in a marina berth. I have just been searching through past posts on bilge pumps and battery flattening problems. My set up seems to be an on/off arrangement with no automatic option as currently wired.
In my ignorance I thought I wouldn't need the pump on automatic anyway. I thought that if I left the elephant trunks down that the worst that could happen is that the well at the transon would fill up and anything over this level would empty via the trunk. Am I missing something here? I am doubting myself beacause the nice people at the marina phoned me after a torrential downpour here on the weekend to tell me that they had lifted my elephant trunk up because the boat was filling with water via the trunks.

Nos4r2 · 29 October 2007, 22:19

Is your trunk above water when it's down?

Andy · 29 October 2007, 22:25

I have seen small auto bilge pumps powered by a solar panel on top of the a-frame ... seemed to work well. Not fast but works given the length of daylight

Andy Moore · 29 October 2007, 22:33

Our Rule pump is an automatic one. It flattens the battery if we leave it on.

So we don't.

woot · 29 October 2007, 23:01

when the boat is at rest and dry I think that he bottom of the trunk hole is level with the waterline

jwalker · 29 October 2007, 23:09

Quote:

Originally Posted by woot

...I thought that if I left the elephant trunks down that the worst that could happen is that the well at the transon would fill up and anything over this level would empty via the trunk.

Given your last post about the trunk level, when some water flows in and fills the well, as you suggest, the stern will then be heavier and lower the trunk deeper into the water. Consequently, you'll get more water in there than you anticipated.

woot · 29 October 2007, 23:35

Given the buoyancy of the tubes I hoped it wouldn't drop much. I think what I may do next time I am at the marina is put a hose in the boat with the trunk down and see what happens if I keep filling ie if the water finds its own level and where it is. I really don't fancy having a flat battery every time I get to the boat or fannying around with solar panels!

codprawn · 29 October 2007, 23:44

We get far more rain than most. My boat also has a huge deck area and no cover - in 1 day it is possible to collect about 1,000L or 1 tonne of water!!! I have a 120amp/hr battery and even when we have had loads of rain the battery will last about 2-3 months.

The pump is an auto Rule 500 and if it doesn't have water to pump draws negligible current - would probably last about 8 months or more.

To give you an idea on solar Panels our local Tesco has the whole roof covered in them - cost £2 million and today when it was fairly sunny for the time of year they were generating 3kw. It will take them 300 years to break even....

I have a 5w panel which I have taken off as it was next to useless. It would be great in sunny weather - but you don't need the pump then!!!

The best answer is a cover.

Nos4r2 · 30 October 2007, 00:04

Quote:

Originally Posted by woot

Given the buoyancy of the tubes I hoped it wouldn't drop much. I think what I may do next time I am at the marina is put a hose in the boat with the trunk down and see what happens if I keep filling ie if the water finds its own level and where it is. I really don't fancy having a flat battery every time I get to the boat or fannying around with solar panels!

Might be worth adding a float switch in the well (assuming that's where the pump is)-at least then it'll only pump when it needs to rather than the 'load/no load' auto pumps going off every few minutes.

codprawn · 30 October 2007, 00:07

Quote:

Originally Posted by Nos4r2

Might be worth adding a float switch in the well (assuming that's where the pump is)-at least then it'll only pump when it needs to rather than the 'load/no load' auto pumps going off every few minutes.

The auto pumps aren't a problem - mine will last for ever like that - it's when it has to pump out a tonne of water a day the trouble starts!!!

woot · 30 October 2007, 07:31

As I said earlier I have read all the previous posts regarding pumps and panels what I was trying to understand is why can't I just leave the trunks down? If it is not going to get any worse than the well being full and anything above that leaving via the trunks I think that I could live with that but was just trying to check I wasn't missing something.

Tim M · 30 October 2007, 08:30

I personally would install a float switch to the pump you already have, and then leave it on "auto" mode whenever the boat is left on the mooring. I have had exactly the same problems over the last year, and the only way to ensure your boat stays dry is to use some sort of auto pump. It shouldn't drain your battery if you use the boat reasonably often. An elaborate other option is to get shore-power installed in your boat and have a charger to keep the batteries permanently topped up. NautiBouy did this with his last Parker.

DJL · 30 October 2007, 10:25

Quote:

Originally Posted by woot

As I said earlier I have read all the previous posts regarding pumps and panels what I was trying to understand is why can't I just leave the trunks down? If it is not going to get any worse than the well being full and anything above that leaving via the trunks I think that I could live with that but was just trying to check I wasn't missing something.

Are you sure the trunks are above water level? They aren't on mine, although I have a slightly heavier engine.

I've never had any problems leaving my 1100 Rule on auto - although I don't think I've left it for a month or more.

peter 24/7 · 30 October 2007, 11:58

When your trunks are left down the water will come in with your set up, the bottom of the trunk is under the water, leave them pulled up.
I have two pumps and they are left on all the time and I have no battery issues.
The other issue if you leave water flow in is that when the depth increases, the water will flow into the under deck trunking and after a while the water level increases and at some stage when under way, some will find its way into the console via the exit of the cable trunking.

talk to ribcraft about the bilge pumps they use.

RJH · 31 October 2007, 20:50

After an experience I had with a previous boat I would certainly advise caution and regular checks even in a marina. A leaky fuel filler pipe led to a fuel leak after filling the tank. The petrol ended up in the bilge and although pumped out automatically, damaged and eventually totalled the pump - petrol and plastic don't mix. This led to the pump failing while on the berth which led to a boat full of water after heavy rain. As someone has already said, the more water in the boat the lower the freeboard and if rear on to the prevailing weather, leads to rapidly filling rib. This then led to contamination in the fuel tank via a faulty fuel sender which led to water being pulled into the engine and bu**ering up the fuel injection system. This then led to several breakdowns and the boat being out of the water for several weeks whilst they traced the fault and replaced fuel pump but missing half the season.

All ended up ok in the end but wouldn't want to repeat that, so regular checks if left in the water. Anyway, I thought trunks were only useful whilst moving?

woot · 31 October 2007, 21:44

Thanks for all the info guys as always very helpful, It sounds like I had better try and sort the pump and see how it goes with regard to flattening the battery.

Roy Smith · 31 October 2007, 21:56

What about an all over boat cover bit of a pain to put on
but it should keep 99 % of the water out

Biggles · 31 October 2007, 22:12

Woot,

Why not put a spare battery in the consol. Wire everything to that and if it flattens it its not a problem. Put the spare battery in the boot of your car when your out in the boat.

Just an idea.

NR.

Rodan · 31 October 2007, 22:56

i am on a marina berth and have had problems with rain water, with these little pumps of around 500 gph it will take a very long period to flatten the battery.
main problem is the pumps - in 2 2years i have had 4 rule 500 auto ones and since the last one gave up i have given up on rule, these things are cheap crap and not worth the risk. of the ones i had the problems were:
1 burnt out motor
1 just died
2 suffered electrical faults and lost the ability to switch on off.

all were kept clean and only pumped occasional rain water, from reading other forums this seems a common problem.

i have now bought a johnson ultima 600, just taking it out of the box showed how much better it is. much more solid, more servicable etc.

i a;so have a solar pannel which tops up the battery and works a treat.

advice is:
don't leave the trunk down, it will flood the boat
use a solar trickle pannel to keep battery topped up
get a pump - but avoid small rule auto ones