Lifejackets - The most important Newbie Question!

[Mode]

Hi All

This is the most important newbie question I have asked!

I need to purchase 4 lifejackets:

Me: 6ft 4" and carrying a lot of holiday weight (for the last 10 years! )
Wife: 5ft 7" and small build
Son 1: Tall and skinny and a rake (5ft 9" and still growing)
Son 2: 10 year old

So, which would you all recommend - I have seen a few and they have different standards 190N etc etc

I am sure this thread will have been done before and I know that a visit to a shop is essential at some point - a good steer would be welcomed though!

Thanks in advance people!!

Mode

[Poly]

150N is standard adult LJ. Go autoinflation unless you plan to swim to-from the boat etc. If you are worried about spray (i) you probably don't need to be (ii) look at the Hamar, pressure activated options.

150N is designed to turn over a standard person to face up, but doesn't take account of wet weather gear etc. If you will be wearing a dry suit or other heavy kit that might affect that 275N is recommended. 190N is perhaps a bit of clever marketing or is aimed at people who aren't going equipped like an ocean going sailer or arctic explorer but are not in shorts and t-shirt either.

It is important it is comfortable. For some people it may also be important that it "looks right".

For kids I would go permanent foam rather that gas inflation - they will want to jump in at some point; fingers do get intrigued with the red toggle (the answer is it gives you a fright and then a bigger fright when you go to the chandlers for the rearm kit!); the foam helps keep them warm. The eldest may prefer a gas inflation - but if he's skinny that won't keep him warm.

Pockets are useful for a radio or plb, or a mars bar!

Fashion, budget, comfort (with what you will wear under it) etc will dictate the rest. On the fashion point, at 20+knots in the middle of the sea it probably doesn't matter. If you boat in an area where you'd rather* wear them to the pub at lunchtime than leave them in the boat it might.

* either because you don't want to leave a few hundred quid's worth of easily movable product lying around, or because you have to climb slippy ladders to get from boat to harbour - and its the most dangerous bit of the day...

[jeffstevens763@g]

look on force four chandlery they have a good range i have a seago active 190N with harness auto and manual inflation well made and comfy you might get a deal on four jackets

[Pikey Dave]

Whatever you get, make sure they have crotch straps & use 'em

[BIRPT]

Another vote for Seago Active 190

This is the version I went for:

Seago Active 190N Automatic No Harness Lifejacket - Seago Active Lifejackets - Discount Marine Chandlery and Sailing Equipment. Bargain Boat Spares and Clothing

Has all the basics covered i.e. auto inflation & crutch straps, comfortable to wear & reasonably priced

A word of warning/advice...if going for an auto inflation, ask for the expiry date before committing to the purchase. As close to 3 years as you can get

[GuyC]

If you're a big chap I'd go for a 275N jacket.

For the others I'd go 150N.

My two year old wears a permanent foam one but the others (10 year old inclusive) wear auto-inflate ones.

As others have said comfort is a big factor, with and without a wet weather jacket. My lifejacket has a zip on the front which is good from a fit point of view but is a PITA when I don't want my jacket done up.

With the kids I've tried to get into the habit of putting the jacket on before I get in the boat and only taking it off after I get off the boat.

[Mode]

That is all great info - thanks!

OK I admit - i weigh 130kg - assume I need the 275N?

[BIRPT]

I personally wouldn't (& didn't) bother with a 275N version. There's an interesting comment from the RYA in relation to them below:

"The RYA strongly recommends not wearing a 275 lifejacket, as this is very bulky when inflated and will impede you if you are trying to get into a liferaft."

Full article here:

When should I wear a lifejacket? | Up to Speed | e-newsletters | News & Events | RYA

And a useful overview from the RNLI too:

Lifejackets

[Pikey Dave]

Originally Posted by Mode

That is all great info - thanks!

OK I admit - i weigh 130kg - assume I need the 275N?

Not necessarily, although you're a hefty unit, you would still naturally float with lungs full of air. Life jackets are all about positive buoyancy. A 150N will give you 15kg of buoyancy, plenty for most people in "normal" clothes. The bigger LJs are needed when you are wearing bulky clothing or dry suits, which bizarrely give additional buoyancy, but this is in the wrong place. The larger jackets are required to overcome the inherent buoyancy of bulky clothing which would prevent you from floating in the correct attitude.

[Poly]

Originally Posted by BIRPT

I personally wouldn't (& didn't) bother with a 275N version. There's an interesting comment from the RYA in relation to them below:

"The RYA strongly recommends not wearing a 275 lifejacket, as this is very bulky when inflated and will impede you if you are trying to get into a liferaft."

Full article here:

When should I wear a lifejacket? | Up to Speed | e-newsletters | News & Events | RYA

And a useful overview from the RNLI too:

Lifejackets

In some ways a slightly odd comment to make given the document seems to be about small power craft which very rarely have liferafts. It is a valid concern that it would make reboarding harder. You can let some of the air out (and top up by mouth if unsuccessful), or the difficulty may be less with with others on board, engine legs to stand on etc.

That said PD is right and it's not your weight that is the issue, its the type of kit you will be wearing.

[jeffstevens763@g]

Originally Posted by BIRPT

I personally wouldn't (& didn't) bother with a 275N version. There's an interesting comment from the RYA in relation to them below:

"The RYA strongly recommends not wearing a 275 lifejacket, as this is very bulky when inflated and will impede you if you are trying to get into a liferaft."

Full article here:

When should I wear a lifejacket? | Up to Speed | e-newsletters | News & Events | RYA

And a useful overview from the RNLI too:

Lifejackets

all you need to know

[GuyC]

Originally Posted by Mode

That is all great info - thanks!

OK I admit - i weigh 130kg - assume I need the 275N?

We're gonna need a bigger helicopter!

Being of similar proportions and with the associated bulkiness of kit that comes with bigger proportions I'd always gone for the 275N lifejacket.

I'd seen the RYA guidance and accepted that getting into a liferaft would be more difficult with a bigger lifejacket. It's also hampered by boots and wet weather kit as well. Hopefully I'd have the presence of mind to deflate the jacket a bit and if the conditions precluded that, fear would help.

Interestingly I wonder whether the 190N jacket is to accommodate the growing population.

[willk]

Originally Posted by GuyC

I'd seen the RYA guidance and accepted that getting into a liferaft would be more difficult with a bigger lifejacket. It's also hampered by boots and wet weather kit as well. Hopefully I'd have the presence of mind to deflate the jacket a bit and if the conditions precluded that, fear would help.

I've always been a bit puzzled by the weight thing - I'd always kinda assumed that the bigger buoyancy was to counteract bulkier (possibly floaty) clothing, rather than to keep a heavier body afloat - after all, we all have approximately neutral buoyancy in the water. I'm still puzzled BTW, not making any statements!!

The RYA advice against 275N jackets is (IMHO) hilarious. If you make it to the raft, the jacket has done it's job well. You'll get in. I wonder how they square this advice with the SOLAS "ferry" lifejackets that are used for Sea Survival courses? They are the biggest, bulkiest things imaginable and EVERYONE makes it into the raft.

[jeffstevens763@g]

the key is willk having a desent ladder/access means available on the craft to get back in.
ive been thinking of late ive always got back in my ribs/sibs by holding the lifelines bobing down in the water a couple of times kicking my feet pulling on the lines getting my belly on the tube top and pulling myself in if i had no ladder, but getting older might not be ideal so ive just made a step out of a my transom wheel its low enough to step strait on with my right foot allowing me to cock my leg on top of the cone at the stern whilst pulling on the life lines to climb back in.theres plenty of rope ladders around but the ones ive used tend to push back underneath the hull.

[paintman]

Having witnessed how difficult it was for a fit RN air sea rescue winchman to get into my dory over the low transom I fitted one of the folding ladders to the transom in case I ever need to get back in!
My original plan was to use the permatrim on the cavitation plate as a step but the ladder is the easier option.

[willk]

Originally Posted by jeffstevens763@g

the key is willk having a desent ladder/access means available on the craft to get back in.

Liferafts have boarding ladders. Reboarding your vessel is another topic entirely but worth mentioning that if you have someone on board and you are still struggling to enter the boat, then they can partially deflate a tube to aid recovery.

I always thought that "cocking a leg on a cone" was an extreme way to highlight your ownership...

[jeffstevens763@g]

I always thought that "cocking a leg on a cone" was an extreme way to highlight your ownership...

its the old dog i me

not in favour of letting tubes down personnally i boat singlehanded now so reaching the valve would be difficult better just having a ladder of some sort IMO.
liferaft ladders are crap or at least the ones ive been on doing my sea survival

[chipko]

We carry on board a Rib-Step to aid re-boarding - as pic. Not really a ladder, more of a step up but very effective.
If motor is switched off, then you can always stand on the av. plate for a leg up.

Life jacket wise I use a 190N (certified 150N) auto which is ok with a dry suit as long you expel as much air as possible after donning. If we're messing around in the bay, in and out of the water, we'll use buoyancy aid/impact vests.

[mikew4]

What is it that you are doing that warrants a lifejacket? Crossing the channel? Why not use buoyancy aids, which are cheaper and less bulky. Both will keep you afloat. The only difference being that the lifejacket ensures your face is out of the water, in case you are knocked out.

[jeffstevens763@g]

The only difference being that the lifejacket ensures your face is out of the water, in case you are knocked out.

That being the point and the mask stopping you from drinking the ogin when you are the right way up