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Old 19 November 2007, 07:43   #1
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How could this be avoided ?

Hi,
i've just viewed a clip where a rib gets turned over by a face on wave.
Here :

It looks terrible. But my question is, could they have avoided flipping over? If the boat was more nose heavy, or less tail heavy, or if they took the wave differently could it have been a different story?

I assure you, I hope never to be out in the same conditions.
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Old 19 November 2007, 10:49   #2
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Pablo

If the RNLI can get it wrong with all their training, what chance do us leisure boaters stand.

I've done exactly that in a 4m RIB in smaller seas, and I can assure you it happened so quickly I don't think I could have done anything about it. I was however out in a steep sea where the conditions were probably too much for the boat and my abilities.

I've also very nearly done it in my 6.5M with several Ribnet people on board, that again was very steep seas in very shallow water and I should have avoided heading directly into it.

Nasher
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Old 19 November 2007, 11:38   #3
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On one of my less than intelligent jaunts, a few friends and I headed out of a little river harbor to go abalone diving. Conditions were horrible, but we knew a spot where a large rock should have offered protection from the swell, so we navigated the river channel (3 boats, 7 divers) and headed out into the cove. Wave faces were 10, maybe 12 feet, shotgunning into the cove. The result was that the nearshore stuff was huge, and steep, and the outer part of the cove was just scary. At one point, I looked back to see if the last boat had made it out, and all I saw was the entire hull of the boat, bow to outboard, hanging vertically above the water. It came back down tailfirst, and flopped back down and contiinued. I found out later that the second diver on the boat had been up front to get some weight there, and during the hang had fallen loose, to end up sitting on the bench seat next to the pilot.

Needless to say, I abandoned any idea of doing the 2 mile run to our ab spot; it was bad enough just trying to get back into the river.

Not really something I'd like to repeat, though I never felt that my boat was misbehaving. It was, however, an awful lot of work trying to keep things under control.


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Old 20 November 2007, 09:17   #4
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Pablo View Post
Hi,
i've just viewed a clip where a rib gets turned over by a face on wave.
Here :

It looks terrible. But my question is, could they have avoided flipping over? If the boat was more nose heavy, or less tail heavy, or if they took the wave differently could it have been a different story?

I assure you, I hope never to be out in the same conditions.

In my opinion the most important decision one ever makes is wether to go out or not!

If that boat was going out in an emergency situation, or training for extreme conditions, then fair enough, but if a leisure boater were to go out in those conditions without good reason I would say they were asking to end up upside down!

A small RIB with twin outboards is always going to be a bit tail heavy, although two smaller outboards aren't necessarily heavier than a single it is a fairly light boat, and even with a crew member hanging on the front those waves were always going to be a challenge!

By the way that video has been discussed at some length on here before I think!
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When a boat looks that good who needs tubes!!!
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Old 20 November 2007, 10:36   #5
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How should one approach a strong head sea (not necessarily as bad as that!)? should you take the waves at more of an angle or is it more to do with wind direction that dictates what angle of approach one should take?

Chris
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Old 20 November 2007, 10:49   #6
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I have never tried it but I would guess at about 20 - 25 degrees

I would also like to hear from those that do play in the big stuff as to how to approach them and also, as you need a fair bit of speed on, what happens ( or what do you do) when you have reached the top?

Tim
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Old 20 November 2007, 10:57   #7
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How should one approach a strong head sea (not necessarily as bad as that!)? should you take the waves at more of an angle or is it more to do with wind direction that dictates what angle of approach one should take?

Chris

Good question - I must say first that I look at things from a racing (both sprint and endurance style) point of view.

With a RIB there is the added disadvantage of lift from the tubes when the wind is coming from the side, but in my experience when faced with steep large waves taking the waves at an angle can mean the difference between having to reduce speed so much that you have to come off the plane and just dropping over the waves, or maintaining planing speed at an angle to the waves and keeping up a higher average speed as a result. Of course everything is a compromise and it is the skippers choice to compromise speed, angle of attack and above all safety of the crew - the best decision may be to turn back and go downwind which is a whole other issue!

We encountered really steep waves in the Red Sea last year trying to get to the start of the second leg after repairing the saddle from damage suffered on leg one (overnight by Kitten and James on a beach shin deep in water!). I desperately wanted to start the race, but even using this technique it was too dangerous, so we turned back to where we repaired the boat, refueled there and joined in with the others after getting the OK from the safety crew. It was so bad that we couldn't keep on the plane with 150 litres of ballast in the nose, and there was a real possibility of being blown over backwards or sideways - we found out later gusts of 52 knots had been measured - we didn't feel so bad at turning round then!
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When a boat looks that good who needs tubes!!!
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Old 20 November 2007, 11:28   #8
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I think the worst waves I have encountered were coming out of Cowes I headed out of mouth of the Medina towards the Gurnard North Cardinal and with wind over tide it made for some pretty heavy stuff. I was with a freind and his dad both of whom are sailors. Basically my freind was helming his dad on the jockey behind and me standing behind that Jockey. His dad started telling him what to do and he was halfway up a wave and cut the throttle to turn around and tell his dad to shut up Danny Boy slid back down the wave into the trough arse first and took on a load of water.

At this point I took over and turned us back to run with the waves. we soon got rid of the water.

However through all of this I never once felt insecure in the boat.

My concern I guess is that I know these boats can handle rough seas and I really like going out when its more of a challenge, however I also want to know the limits and what to look out for.

I was thinking of doing an Advanced course this winter up in the Menai Straits as I feel this would benefit me.

Chris
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Old 20 November 2007, 14:06   #9
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Chris,
I did my PB2 at Plas Menai with F8 and wind over tide - there can be plenty of challenging conditions up there, so a good location to do advanced imho.

Tim
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Old 21 November 2007, 05:24   #10
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I'm sorry, I didn't know that this video has already been discussed here. I would like to find the thread. I'd be grateful if I could have some clues for the search.

For people wanting to go out in rough conditions I would think the Race off Portland would be a good place provided theres a bloody big safty boat close by capable of getting you out of trouble.

That rib does look very tail heavy though, it just drops down vertically. Even with the self righting bag on the A-frame, the crew are in big trouble. I'm not sure I want to know the outcome.
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