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Old 19 May 2013, 05:13   #61
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But in this case an 'automatic' engine cut out would very likely have saved two lives, two serious injuries and immeasurable personal anguish, not to mention a substantial amount of public money. So there is at least a respectable argument for saying that the safety system is 'broken' or, at the very least, that there is room for improvement.

Just an idea, how about a system that requires a periodic (once a minute?) affirmative action, perhaps a push button, absent which the throttle is retarded to idle (or ignition cut completely).
With respect, so would have the current system if it was used correctly.

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Old 19 May 2013, 05:37   #62
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With respect, so would have the current system if it was used correctly.

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Absolutely and exactly, precisely. Well said and +1.
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Old 19 May 2013, 05:41   #63
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There is a definite advantage in having a mechanical fail-safe. By all means add electronic back-up, but they would always play 2nd fiddle. Like seatbelts and airbags.There is a lot of discussion about proximity sensors in cars, they are not safety items, merely security. The safety comes from the seatbelt and knowing that wearing it will save your life.
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Old 19 May 2013, 05:43   #64
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There is a definite advantage in having a mechanical fail-safe. By all means add electronic back-up, but they would always play 2nd fiddle. Like seatbelts and airbags.
Maybe but the suggested idea of pushing a button every minute or the engine stops dead, seriously ? That's a killer right there.

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Old 19 May 2013, 05:59   #65
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The "fly by wire" wireless top mounted throttles as well as having no interlock move very easily where as the side mounted cable ones are far stiffer. A slight knock could very easily knock it wide open.

Anyone know why they don't have an interlock?
But you can press the button (which is not that likely to be done by accident) and it's throttle only and no gear selected.

It's the few seconds of connecting a cord or pressing a button (that people don't do) that will always cause drama....
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Old 19 May 2013, 09:00   #66
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I'm in the "it isn't broken why try and fix it with complicated stuff" camp

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+1 Keep it simple ....



+ another 1
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Old 19 May 2013, 09:01   #67
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Maybe but the suggested idea of pushing a button every minute or the engine stops dead, seriously ? That's a killer right there.

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Agree, I was thinking more about having a kill cord and MAYBE using an electronic proximity as a backup ( just not the electronics on their own ).
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Old 19 May 2013, 15:55   #68
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Maybe but the suggested idea of pushing a button every minute or the engine stops dead, seriously ? That's a killer right there.

www.BoatsandOutboards4Sale.co.uk
I think that reaction is a bit unimaginative. The reaction needn't be "engine stops dead", which I agree could cause another problem. It could be a gradual retardation of throttle back to idle/neutral.

There are several incontrovertible facts;

1. However good/safe/simple the kill cord safety mechanism is, it is self-evidently not "idiot proof".

2. A truly idiot proof system installed in the accident boat would have saved lives.

3. Technology exists today that was simply not available when kill cords were introduced.

An electronic solution on the lines I have suggested could be incorporated quite easily and inexpensively in higher end boats. I agree it's not an answer at the lower end but it does provide a partial solution. There may be better ones. I don't claim my suggestion is perfect but I think there is some mileage in it. By all means critique it, but constructively please.
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Old 19 May 2013, 16:09   #69
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2. A truly idiot proof system installed in the accident boat would have saved lives.
If it truly is that easy then it would be done, truth of the matter IMO is that you will NEVER have an idiot proof system, you can't legislate or design out IDIOTS.

While this accident is incredibly emotive, and I really hope it changes the behaviour of many boaters, from the MIAB own statistics earlier in this thread, there were something like 19 preventable deaths by non use of the kill cord in the last 5 years (forgive me if I have that stat slightly wrong) however how many lives have been lost on our roads in the UK, in the same period of time?
If you have some clever ideas to get rid of , by design or legislation then can I be bold enough to suggest you make a much bigger impact and start on our roads instead of our waterways?
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Old 19 May 2013, 16:38   #70
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I think that reaction is a bit unimaginative. The reaction needn't be "engine stops dead", which I agree could cause another problem. It could be a gradual retardation of throttle back to idle/neutral.

There are several incontrovertible facts;

1. However good/safe/simple the kill cord safety mechanism is, it is self-evidently not "idiot proof".

2. A truly idiot proof system installed in the accident boat would have saved lives.

3. Technology exists today that was simply not available when kill cords were introduced.

An electronic solution on the lines I have suggested could be incorporated quite easily and inexpensively in higher end boats. I agree it's not an answer at the lower end but it does provide a partial solution. There may be better ones. I don't claim my suggestion is perfect but I think there is some mileage in it. By all means critique it, but constructively please.
1....nothing is

2....yes, but it doesn't exist

3....yes, but not implemented ( maybe because it isn't any more effective)

Partial solution isn't the answer unfortunately......with all respect.
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