Reply
 
Thread Tools Search this Thread
 
Old 18 September 2010, 09:05   #31
Member
 
HUMBER P4VWL's Avatar
 
Country: UK - Wales
Town: N Wales Chester
Boat name: Mr Smith
Make: Humber
Length: 6m +
Join Date: Feb 2009
Posts: 5,013
Quote:
Originally Posted by Polwart View Post
Ah you've missed the fact that Willk has managed to cram those posts into about 2.5 year whereas RW has been talking drivel for nearly 7...

...Willk is in fact spouting rubbish and abuse at a far higher rate than RW is managing, but RW has been doing it for longer To be fare to Stu he does occassionally post some helpful or constructive stuff too, and he doesn't have the added responsibility of being the one man Redbay marketing machine.
so IYHO who is the most annoying member statistically?

What percentage of posts from each ended in the bilges?
__________________

__________________
HUMBER P4VWL is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 18 September 2010, 09:07   #32
Member
 
Country: UK - England
Town: Southampton
Boat name: Tornado
Make: Ribcraft
Length: 7m +
Engine: 250hp Suzuki
Join Date: Feb 2010
Posts: 133
Quote:
Originally Posted by alystra View Post
No, they don't.
Commercial operators have many more restrictions placed on them than leisure craft, in terms of area of operations, wind strength, sea state they are allowed to operate in. Their boats are generally built or equipped to much higher standards than leisure boats. They are inspected regularly and defects have to be fixed before they are allowed to continue. They operate in familiar waters. This regime has as much effect on safety as the skippers ticket. Overall, these requirements are expensive and restrictive and would be onerous for the average leisure owner.

There are more call outs to leisure craft because there are very many more leisure craft around at sea than there are commercial craft. A better measure of accident statistics would be to compare the number of leisure craft accidents to the number of leisure craft in use. I think you will find that the leisure craft are not anywhere near to ten times more likely to have an accident than commercial craft.

A while ago, the RYA compared leisure boat accident rates form various countries, most of which had compulsory 'driving' tests for skippers. The results showed a much higher accident rate in those countries with these tests than in the UK, where education is the preferred way.

The reason for this is that, in order for the tests to be acceptable, they have to be very simple. Once passed, there is no incentive to learn any more, as one is 'legal'. In a compulsory state organised scheme, few if any skippers would bother with further education. How many drivers, for instance, bother to do an advanced driving course and test? A very small percentage, I'll warrant.

The voluntary RYA schemes start simply, but at each stage, the student is made aware that there is still much to learn, and there is a way to get that knowledge.

Insurance companies have a part to play, and do, in persuading skippers to gain some sort of training and qualification, by severely penalising those without with much higher premiums.

Legislation is not the way forward.
Cant simply count the number of boats.......... a private rib that goes out once a month verses a commercial rib that is out probably at least 20 days every month. Need to count the number of hours on the water if you want to get too scientific with the data !

And if you take your argument to the full why not do away with the car driving test and just penalise drivers though their insurance if they can't be bothered to take it ? IMO the sooner some minimum legal requirements are inforced before being allowed to set to sea the better !
__________________

__________________
sarahscottiedog is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 18 September 2010, 09:43   #33
RIBnet admin team
 
willk's Avatar
 
Country: Ireland
Make: Redbay Boats
Length: 9m +
Engine: 370hp
Join Date: Feb 2008
Posts: 12,928
RIBase
Quote:
Originally Posted by HUMBER P4VWL View Post
so IYHO who is the most annoying member statistically?

What percentage of posts from each ended in the bilges?
You can add "banned" to that list of criteria - make it more interesting...

In fact, who did his Lordship create the bilges for?

__________________
willk is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 18 September 2010, 09:58   #34
Member
 
Country: UK - Scotland
Town: Inverness
Boat name: none
Make: none
Length: 5m +
Engine: none
MMSI: none
Join Date: Mar 2007
Posts: 1,908
Quote:
Originally Posted by sarahscottiedog View Post
Cant simply count the number of boats.......... a private rib that goes out once a month verses a commercial rib that is out probably at least 20 days every month. Need to count the number of hours on the water if you want to get too scientific with the data !
This is one of the problems with statistics. You could also argue that there are far more leisure boats than commercial which also skews the figures.
The fact that boating callouts happen most frequentely when winds are force 3 or below probably means that this is the time most folk go out in nice weather. It is also the time when the least prepared and least experienced venture out.
I don't believe in legislation, it isn't proved to reduce accidents and there is no need for even more red tape around yet another area in addition to the many already introduced in recent years.
You have to look at the risk and there is a low risk of injuring folk on the water but a high risk on the roads when untrained.
If no-one had sat a driving test would you feel the odds were on your side driving to work each morning about managing it in one piece?
Alternatively what are the chances of the same when untrained on a boat of reaching your destination unscathed by another boat, a lot higher I'll bet!
__________________
BruceB is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 18 September 2010, 11:39   #35
RIBnet admin team
 
Poly's Avatar
 
Country: UK - Scotland
Boat name: imposter
Make: FunYak
Length: 3m +
Engine: 2 stroke YAM 20 HP
MMSI: 235089819
Join Date: Sep 2005
Posts: 10,114
Quote:
Originally Posted by HUMBER P4VWL View Post
so IYHO who is the most annoying member statistically?

What percentage of posts from each ended in the bilges?
Bilged posts don't get counted in the stats...
__________________
Poly is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 18 September 2010, 12:45   #36
Member
 
Country: UK - Wales
Town: Southampton
Boat name: DynaMoHumm/ SRV/deja
Make: Avon8.4, 5.4 & 4.777
Length: 8m +
Engine: Cat3126 Yam 90 &70
MMSI: 42
Join Date: Dec 2003
Posts: 6,556
Quote:
Originally Posted by sarahscottiedog View Post
IMO the sooner some minimum legal requirements are inforced before being allowed to set to sea the better !
seconded there should be a test, not neccasarily compulsory Basic Training though, the problem I guess is policing ad all the Admin that involves. makes iy unrealistic. I however in theory agree with you.

I'm very much in favour of the slipways that insist onseeing your insurance before you launch
__________________
Here it comes again, I don't stand a chance
Soul possession, Got me in a trance
Pullin' me back to you - Deja Voodoo
Rogue Wave is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 18 September 2010, 12:50   #37
Member
 
Country: UK - England
Town: Mighty Penryn
Boat name: Little Joe.
Make: Avon Searider
Length: 4m +
Engine: Honda BF50
Join Date: Aug 2005
Posts: 8,841
Quote:
Originally Posted by willk View Post
You can add "banned" to that list of criteria - make it more interesting...

In fact, who did his Lordship create the bilges for?

Nope, it's your show. Run with it.
__________________
Mollers is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 18 September 2010, 12:55   #38
Member
 
Country: UK - Scotland
Town: Inverness
Boat name: none
Make: none
Length: 5m +
Engine: none
MMSI: none
Join Date: Mar 2007
Posts: 1,908
Quote:
Originally Posted by Rogue Wave View Post

I'm very much in favour of the slipways that insist onseeing your insurance before you launch
I don't. Slipways in Scotland are generally free and council owned. Introducing a check means charges to pay for the actual check and I don't see how this benefits anyone.

I am insured and well qualified so I am not arguing against legislation because it doesn't affect me (ie pulling the ladder up behind you) but very much in principle instead.
I have enough regulation and legalese every day without introducing it somewhere it really doesn't have any projected benefit.
Also if it cannot be policed, and I cannot see how it could except in very limited areas, then the system has no point as it can be ignored by the very persons it was aimed at!
__________________
BruceB is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 18 September 2010, 13:33   #39
Member
 
Country: UK - Wales
Town: Southampton
Boat name: DynaMoHumm/ SRV/deja
Make: Avon8.4, 5.4 & 4.777
Length: 8m +
Engine: Cat3126 Yam 90 &70
MMSI: 42
Join Date: Dec 2003
Posts: 6,556
I'm not obtuse to the difficulties in making it happen but nothing will make me change my mind that it is a good thing in theory.

I bought my first RIB cos I ws going to buy an EVO but realised I'd be dead or banned within 3 months. I realised I could push my luck on the water without any serious recrimination, so I bought a RIB (42 knots) and fillled my boots. No training, insured only in case it got stolen and not really caring about other water users. I was 45 at the time so old enough to know better If I had to have a ticket to get on the water I might not have been such a nuisance or maybe a danger to other water users, but if I was it would have been through choice and not ignorance/stupidity.

Diferent folks differnt strokes I guess, but I am not advocating compulsory trainig so I can get more work as a powerboat instructor I'm advocating a compulsory test and ticket so that people hit the water with knowledge. Having checks on a paid for well run slipway in my world is OK
__________________
Here it comes again, I don't stand a chance
Soul possession, Got me in a trance
Pullin' me back to you - Deja Voodoo
Rogue Wave is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 18 September 2010, 13:46   #40
Member
 
Country: UK - Wales
Town: Southampton
Boat name: DynaMoHumm/ SRV/deja
Make: Avon8.4, 5.4 & 4.777
Length: 8m +
Engine: Cat3126 Yam 90 &70
MMSI: 42
Join Date: Dec 2003
Posts: 6,556
Quote:
Originally Posted by HUMBER P4VWL View Post
-
-
Many others in the area who are local to water and been on it for life don't use kill cords on dorys or in any of the ski craft/leisure craft to this day. Many fisherman convincingly argue against life jackets etc

.
I guess these salty dogs were of the same opinion was in those waters that dau and it was quite calm


http://www.telegraph.co.uk/news/worl...oat-sinks.html
__________________

__________________
Here it comes again, I don't stand a chance
Soul possession, Got me in a trance
Pullin' me back to you - Deja Voodoo
Rogue Wave is offline   Reply With Quote
Reply

Thread Tools Search this Thread
Search this Thread:

Advanced Search

Posting Rules
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

BB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is Off
Trackbacks are Off
Pingbacks are Off
Refbacks are Off





Copyright 2002- Social Knowledge, LLC All Rights Reserved.

All times are GMT -5. The time now is 20:01.


Powered by vBulletin® Version 3.8.8 Beta 1
Copyright ©2000 - 2017, vBulletin Solutions, Inc.