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Old 06 May 2014, 18:42   #51
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Going back to the original post, would Simon confirm whether or not he did offer to cut down the transom on this new inflatable to accommodate the short shaft motor?
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Old 07 May 2014, 04:00   #52
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Quote:
Originally Posted by martini View Post
Going back to the original post, would Simon confirm whether or not he did offer to cut down the transom on this new inflatable to accommodate the short shaft motor?
hi martini
inflatable boats have a solid marine plywood transom, they are shaped during manufacture to accept either a short or long shaft engine, then they have a rubber covering strip glued over the top once the job is finished.
what we have done in the past for customers who want a 15" transom on a 20" boat is to shorten the transom thus:
peel back the rubber cap, measure and cut the plywood transom down to size allowing for side to side movement of the engine, it is important to have smooth curves at the stress points, then re-seal the capping to make water tight and fit a stainless steel plate across the centre where the engine sits. this has 2 benefits
1. the customer can use their short shaft engine
2. there is less torque imparted on the transom for the same hp due to a lesser moment from the shaft length. so in effect it is stronger and safer.
this is a quick, easy, efficient job which when finished and sealed properly gives a boat which is exactly the same as one made direct from the factory in short shaft. except to finish ours we put a stainless plate over the top which is the part that gets the most wear so lasts a lot longer.
i would add one caveat in that it is first important to know how much freeboard is available when the engine is fitted and the boat is loaded with the maximum weight it is rated to. in the case of the 430HD seapro this is 8 adults - so max 1 ton. with this weight and an outboard there is still 10" freeboard at the stern with the 15" transom as the boat is so beamy. And this boat is generally made in short shaft straight from the factory so we know beyond equivocation that it is safe from a buoyancy point.
final word of warning: this is a very easy job compared to shortening the shaft on a fibreglass transom - as the fibreglass adds strength to the transom it should only be undertaken by a boatbuilder or professional.
if anybody is interested i can post images on how the marine ply transom is properly shortened along with some after shots.
best
simon
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Old 07 May 2014, 05:21   #53
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Simon, you could not dig a bigger hole for yourself with a swing shovel.


Telling Martini how a transom is built and how to chop it, is tantamount to telling Granny how to drop her falsies into a glass of Sterident.

You're not dealing with 'no nothing' punters here. If I were you, I'd get on yer trick cycle and back peddle the f'k out of here.
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Old 07 May 2014, 05:53   #54
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Quote:
Originally Posted by simonhigham View Post

what we have done in the past for customers who want a 15" transom on a 20" boat is to shorten the transom thus:


this has 2 benefits

1. the customer can use their short shaft engine

2. there is less torque imparted on the transom for the same hp due to a lesser moment from the shaft length. so in effect it is stronger and safer.

this is a quick, easy, efficient job which when finished and sealed properly gives a boat which is exactly the same as one made direct from the factory in short shaft.

Just from reading the posts on here, the OP said that you supplied the engine as well. If the boat was built with 20" transom, why not supply a long shaft motor, or did the OP specifically request a short shaft?
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Old 07 May 2014, 05:57   #55
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Quote:
Originally Posted by tonto View Post
Just from reading the posts on here, the OP said that you supplied the engine as well. If the boat was built with 20" transom, why not supply a long shaft motor, or did the OP specifically request a short shaft?

....& why not do all the magic transom butchery before fobbing it off onto the client??


Scent from my iBone sow iguana any typos whore bed spillings
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Old 07 May 2014, 06:10   #56
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Quote:
Originally Posted by tonto View Post
Just from reading the posts on here, the OP said that you supplied the engine as well. If the boat was built with 20" transom, why not supply a long shaft motor, or did the OP specifically request a short shaft?
I enquired about the Seapro HD 430 and a suitable outboard, and that was the recommended package put together for me... I was told it's a good buy as short shafts 2 stroke in that HP range is hard to get. I went with it based on their professional recommendation as an ideal package.
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Old 07 May 2014, 06:15   #57
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i refuse to get into this slanging match
i was asked how it would be done, i answered without bias or malice
if you wish to continue with this acid tone i will not reply to you
to answer your questions:
Tonto:
the reason the transom was not altered before the customer collected is 2 fold:
1. this was a brand new batch of boats and this being the first out we did not realise that they had been made with long shaft transom
2. if the shaft length had been ascertained first we could have offered chris the option of either a long shaft or a short shaft after the transom was altered (some prefer the shorter shaft so that the engine more easily fits in the boot)
Pikey Dave:
i don't think thats a fair comment so i will not answer that. i am not in the business of trying to fob people off with anything
Chris:
short shaft is best if its going in your boot, so i would still stand by that. also the boat should have been short shaft, not long shaft.

i hope this clears things up

best
simon
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Old 07 May 2014, 07:13   #58
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Originally Posted by simonhigham View Post
i refuse to get into this slanging match

simon
Welcome to the internet

I have been using your company since the 90's and have always been happy with your work and the parts supplied, without your help, advice and families encyclopedic knowledge of ageing 2 strokes I would have been a lot worse off. I said this right at the start of my post on this thread in your support.

Its good that you have decided to stick your head up on here and your apparant offer of a full refund to the OP is a step towards repairing your name.

The problem is that you even sent out this package in the 1st place, especially with a newbie.

I dont know what level of 'respray' you offered the OP, but the standard of work on the engine is appaling. You say it was a new sprayer that did the work, in that case you need to look very carefully at your recruitment systems and even more importantly your quality control checks. How any one could think that respray was acceptable is beyond words and to let it leave the church is asking for trouble and damage to your reputation.

The lack of knowledge of the boat you sold is even more worrying. You are a big importer and seller of these inflatable boats, how could you not know what the transom size is ?!? Surely you have a PDI system in place, or do you just stick a new label on the unopened box and post it on to the new owner without even checking ?

Your reasons for using a short shaft engine are sound, but its not a justification for letting your apprentice loose with a jigsaw and a tube of silkaflex on the transom. And lets face it, having seen the work on the engine, I doubt the transom would have been any better. If you supply a boat with a long shaft transom, you should supply a long shaft engine, simples. Offering to cut the transom down and then trying to justify it makes you look like a cowboy. People chop (Or build up) transoms out of desperation on knackered projects, not on new sibs supplied by a main dealer.

If you want to come out of this with any respect from Ribnet you need to accept your cockups, make it right for the OP and learn from your mistakes. I have no desire to see your company in difficulty, we need to keep operations like yours going for the good of the pastime, but the internet is a powerful medium and you need to get ahead of this, rather than making excuses for work that cant be excused.

Finally I know that I'm just a faceless name on a forum, but I used to own a business that your family used on a daily basis, if they ever complained about a genuine problem (which they quite rightly did from time to time) I would do everything in my power to put it right and as a result you continued to be my customer. Own up to the mistakes, put it right and move on.
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Old 07 May 2014, 07:37   #59
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Originally Posted by simonhigham View Post
i refuse to get into this slanging match
Sorry, but you have to stand up and take the flogging, I admire you for having the courage to come on here and save face but you sold a boat to someone inexperienced without even knowing if it was seaworthy, in this instance it's been really inconvenient and you've put your customer in an awkward situation, you could have put him in a dangerous one.

This thread will have done you a huge favour, a tiny proportion of your customers or potential customers will see what's been put on here so doubt you'll loose much business from it, but having this issue brought to your attention will enable you to improve procedures and offer a better service in the future.
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Old 07 May 2014, 07:46   #60
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Hi there Simon.

Since you respond on here so will I.

Quote:
Originally Posted by simonhigham View Post
the 430HD is built with a short transom, however, our latest batch have been made with long transom by mistake, the first we knew of this was your boat
Bill Highman said to me over the phone there was some boats made for the RNLI with long transom as they use long shaft engines and I must have gotten one of them or are they made by mistake as you state? You mention latest batch, but when I talked to you over the phone about having the sib with the alloy bow section as you state on your website that "all other inflatable boat manufacturers cheat with the front part and make it from wood" you said to me thats old stock as all new sibs comes with a wooden bow section as the alloy bow section causes damage to the tubes, so how is this the latest batch as mine have alloy bow section? Oh, and thanks for knowingly selling me a sib with a problem part known to cause damage.


Quote:
Originally Posted by simonhigham View Post
with regard to the engine paint job, we have recently taken on a new spray man, this is unacceptable paint finish and he will be addressed about it.
Sorry, I dont buy that. I am no painting expert but when I wanted to see the engine running in your tank I was told it was just painted that morning. It's sprayed over the greased areas in some places, wipe the grease off and theres no paint underneath. That clearly tells me the engine was put together, greased up etc and then painted last. It's not just the painter that did a sub standard job but your whole process and management of it. Do you not quality check products before leaving the shop? I find it difficult to believe that at no point any member of staff raised concern about the low standard of the finished product or is stuff like that considered normal/acceptable in your company?


I believe an honest mistake re the transom/engine choice could have been made which is totally acceptable as we are only human beings as you state. However you are talking in circles and does not take away from the issues re the poor paint, quality control and total misleading and dishonest selling. Why when I first ask a member of staff what I get in the package the bow bag and seat bag are included. And then when I get the box thats been opened those items according to you are sold separately? Thats just trying to rip the customer for more money!

I am sorry but this is like adding salt to injury, you are here in defence accusing the members on here giving their opinion as a witch hunt as if you are the victim now. When I first saw you posted I thought you were a real gent, manning up to your companies unprofessional service to me but in my opinion your intent is damage control.

I'll not discuss this matter further on here as my intention was never to start a witch hunt as you call it, it was simply to ask for advice which the members on here kindly gave me. I am getting my money back so I am satisfied with the outcome from you, thank you.

Regards.
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