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Old 13 January 2008, 12:49   #11
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This incident reminds me of a youngster drowning in a fishing pool last year.
two of these so called special community police officers looked on while the youngster drowned. the excuse was that they werent trained to jump in and
rescue this poor child. TWATS.and thenyou get the opposite on this ocasion
This country is well and truly F----d. May be with all the ribnet members on here we should sign a petition to get this brave VOLUNTEER reinstated.But if
i were him id tell em to shove it where the sun dont shine
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Old 13 January 2008, 13:52   #12
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Perhaps comparing the two organisations' chief execs gives a clue ...

Chief Executive - Mr Liam McIvor (Ambulance service)

Quote:
Mr Liam McIvor was appointed Chief Executive of the Northern Ireland Ambulance Service in October 2004 having previously held the position of Director of Operations from May 2001.

Mr McIvor was previously the General Manager for Ambulatory Care at the Royal Group of Hospitals and has held various general management positions in the public and private sectors.

(From NIAS website)
For the MCA, Peter Cardy..

Quote:
He spent the first part of his career working in adult education in the east of England and the north of Scotland. For twenty years from 1987 he ran the UKs major charities concerned with motor neurone disease, multiple sclerosis and cancer.

Mr Cardy has written and lectured extensively on the management of these uniquely complicated bodies, with their devolved structures, large numbers of volunteers and small staff, and their multiple goals of service improvement, research and policy change. He has been a member of many national and international professional bodies and foundations. In 2001, he was honoured with the Charcot medal of which fewer than a dozen have been awarded, all others to senior physicians.
Now I'm sure he's a grand chap, but not much experience there of what his guys on the ground are likely to face...

But then he goes on to say :

Quote:
But I learnt very early on about the unique qualities of the people who work in this very special sector, and I feel both honoured and daunted by the challenge of living up to the proud traditions of professionalism, skill and integrity we have inherited.
So as one of those "proud traditions" is saving lives, I expect we can see those concerned reinstated forthwith
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Old 21 January 2008, 07:00   #13
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Top banana View Post
This incident reminds me of a youngster drowning in a fishing pool last year.
two of these so called special community police officers looked on while the youngster drowned. the excuse was that they werent trained to jump in and
rescue this poor child. TWATS.and thenyou get the opposite on this ocasion
This country is well and truly F----d. May be with all the ribnet members on here we should sign a petition to get this brave VOLUNTEER reinstated.But if
i were him id tell em to shove it where the sun dont shine
http://news.bbc.co.uk/1/hi/england/m...er/7007081.stm


Is this the incident where the PCSOs watched on as a child drowned? As always, the media story doesn't always reflect the full story.

It's not hard to feel sorry for the PCSOs. Imagine responding to an incident in which a child is reported drowning, you arrive on scene after the boy has slipped under the water, some fishermen standing by who've watched the incident cant identify where he is and somehow you end up being pilloried by the nation's media for standing there and watching the child drown.

Hope Paul is re-instated, but as always suspect there is more to the story than is reported.

Ed
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Old 21 January 2008, 07:18   #14
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It's not so much what the coppers did or didn't do - it's what their bosses said. Basically - as in the coastguard incident - the manegement are putting health and safety laws first. Police have been told that they are NOT to rescue someone drowning unless they have the right equipment.
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Old 21 January 2008, 10:24   #15
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It's not hard to feel sorry for the PCSOs. Imagine responding to an incident in which a child is reported drowning, you arrive on scene after the boy has slipped under the water, some fishermen standing by who've watched the incident cant identify where he is and somehow you end up being pilloried by the nation's media for standing there and watching the child drown.

Hope Paul is re-instated, but as always suspect there is more to the story than is reported.

Ed [/QUOTE]

True!
My understanding is that he resigned after being "told off" for not waiting. Could have taken the bollocking anf got on with things. I think he is being a bit of a drama queen over it!
Im sure he did great work and my hat goes off to him but come on.......
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Old 21 January 2008, 13:56   #16
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Ed [/QUOTE]

True!
My understanding is that he resigned after being "told off" for not waiting. Could have taken the bollocking anf got on with things. I think he is being a bit of a drama queen over it!
Im sure he did great work and my hat goes off to him but come on....... [/QUOTE]

Why should he take a bollocking? He's a VOLUNTEER. As far as we know, his actions didn't put anyone else in danger. In his opinion the casualty was about to fall. His actions saved her.

On the other hand, if he'd have fallen and been injured then I'm sure he or his bereaved relatives would have been very quick to say that MCA didn't do things properly and claim huge compensation. No doubt that's what the sector officer/manager (for I assume it would be he that did the bollocking - sorry - telling off) was most concerned about. After all, had all gone wrong, this volunteer could have embarrassed some Very Important People within MCA hierarchy. And that would never do.

Perhaps the 'telling off' could have been done in a less upsetting way?

On the other, other hand. Perhaps our rescuer was one who scoffs at the safety routines used by CG cliff rescue teams, and perhaps this wasn't the first time?? I doubt we'll ever know the full story.
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Old 22 January 2008, 06:12   #17
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As with all incidents,

the only people who know 100% of the whole full story will be the Coastguard and the volunteer.

As, sadly, with relation to the press, sometimes things can get blown out of proportion very quickly.
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Old 22 January 2008, 16:47   #18
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The coastguard was not sacked, he chose to resign.

Anyone living in the UK these days is surely aware of the overkill on health and safety. Indeed 'white collar H&S' is a massive growth industry, worth many hundreds of millions. It involves worthless individuals coming around ordering management to be overly safety concious (they end up "safety FRIGHTENED TO BL**DY DEATH"). This came about 'cos lots of workers were dying due to poor H&S.

I dont blame MCA management for being so safety conscious, nor should this volunteer. Yes, he was very brave and saved a life, but his managers need to be careful to balance praise with DONT DO IT AGAIN!

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Old 22 January 2008, 18:43   #19
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The coastguard was not sacked, he chose to resign.

I dont blame MCA management for being so safety conscious, nor should this volunteer. Yes, he was very brave and saved a life, but his managers need to be careful to balance praise with DONT DO IT AGAIN!

pvm
Agreed, but it seems to me there was precious little praise for this chap, only a wagging finger.

As I said earlier in the thread, I find it significant that there were only three people turned up to go on the shout. Ever heard of an all weather lifeboat having to wait because there weren't enough crew? Well, I haven't. I think there could be a management problem within the CG in that area.

I'd like to think that there wasn't, but you have to remember that a significant number of CG officers are retired/redundant Petty Officers from the RN. In their first career they could shout and bully to their hearts content. Try that with a volunteer and he'll tell you to f*** off. And this one did - apparently.
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Old 23 January 2008, 04:42   #20
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This came about 'cos lots of workers were dying due to poor H&S.
Really ?

Lots of people were dying due to idiocy - if, as a worker, I removed a guard from a piece of machinery then got dragged into it, I'm a moron.

If I over reach on a ladder propped up with a couple of bits of wood, then fall off, that's idiocy.

Today's problem isn't that working environments are dangerous, it's that nobody seems to take responsibility for their actions.
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