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Old 23 April 2006, 10:22   #41
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OK here are some pictures taken this morning of the tube on the other side.

You can see along the same zone, the fabric has a sort of "distressed" appearance to it, I reckon it is very shortly going to do the same thing in the same place on the other tube.

I shall fire all these off to Humber and see what they say about it. I was talking to somebody earlier this morning who reckoned the people supplying his boat told him they would re-tube it for free if there was a tube manufacturing defect up to 25 years old. Fingers crossed then!!!!
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Old 24 April 2006, 04:19   #42
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Hi Stephen

I have seen this problem on quite a few ribs which have been in for repair. The problem more than likely is that the internal seam has become hard and brittle either from a build up of glue or the fabric itself, this hard edge on the internal seam is now rubbing it's way through the outer seam during propulsion through the water. This problem occurs more in PVC tubes where the fabric is more prone to becoming brittle but it does occur in Hypalon tubes too.
Ultimately to overcome this problem will require opening the tube and replacing the internal seam.
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Old 24 April 2006, 07:18   #43
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Quote:
Originally Posted by ribraff
Hi Stephen

I have seen this problem on quite a few ribs which have been in for repair. The problem more than likely is that the internal seam has become hard and brittle either from a build up of glue or the fabric itself, this hard edge on the internal seam is now rubbing it's way through the outer seam during propulsion through the water. This problem occurs more in PVC tubes where the fabric is more prone to becoming brittle but it does occur in Hypalon tubes too.
Ultimately to overcome this problem will require opening the tube and replacing the internal seam.
Oh b^%&%^ks. That sounds like it is only gonna get worse, and the solution proposed is way beyond my skills (or anybody else in this part of the world) I wouldn't even have a clue where to start on pulling a tube completely to bits for something like that, and I guess its the sort of job where you need a heated workshop to fit the boat in as well to make sure everything sticks properly

Now you mention it, it does sort of look like it has been folded repeatedly over a hard edge (on both tubes) and if you deflate the tube and squeeze it together it folds sharply along the line where the failure occurred, while hardly folding at all on either side of this.

I suppose slapping another layer of fabric over the top will be a stay of execution anyway, at least the seam will have to wear its way through that as well before I have to throw the boat away...

Thanks for the advice

No reply from Humber so far this morning.
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Old 26 April 2006, 10:48   #44
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Ho hum

Three days pass and still I have yet to receive any acknowledgement from Humber....

can some of the tube people give me an idea of the basic technique involved in cutting the back out of the tube and putting a new one in?

I have been thinking about my options and it seems that in principle there is no reason why you couldn't just shorten the tube by three or four inches to get rid of the knackered section, i.e. chop out the bad bit, stick the end of the tube back in a little further in, and then put big wear patches underneath to stop it happening again. I just can't see how you would go about sticking a whole end in a tube - how is it done when they are made/repaired by the pro's?

otherwise plan B is just to fill the effn thing up with expanding foam and make the "R" bit a bit larger and the "I" bit a bit smaller - more than one way to skin a cat as they say!
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Old 26 April 2006, 11:16   #45
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The reason there is that double joint is to change the section from a cylinder to a cone without introducing darts or crinkles. You will be hard pushed to get the cone to join directly, especially a Destroyer one because the cone is so short. Just do an outside repair, fit the reinforcement underneath and keep the tubes inflated nice and hard.
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Old 26 April 2006, 13:26   #46
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Quote:
Originally Posted by jwalker
The reason there is that double joint is to change the section from a cylinder to a cone without introducing darts or crinkles. You will be hard pushed to get the cone to join directly, especially a Destroyer one because the cone is so short. Just do an outside repair, fit the reinforcement underneath and keep the tubes inflated nice and hard.
Hmm yes I see what you mean, looking again the bit that is bladdered is the middle of the three bits of fabric not the main part of the tube. Teach me to have a vague idea without checking it out properly [slap self on head]

Expanding foam it is then

thanks
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Old 26 April 2006, 13:31   #47
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If your talking about filling the whole tube with foam you might want to consider getting a "bladder" made for it instead. Avalible from geminieindustries.com
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Old 26 April 2006, 14:41   #48
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What ever you do DON'T fill it with expanding foam!!
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Old 26 April 2006, 15:50   #49
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What ever you do DON'T fill it with expanding foam!!
It was very much a tongue in cheek comment...

But actually, why not?

It ain't gonna leak whatever you do to it
It will be completely unsinkable!
permanent - no messing around with tube pressures and stuff

The only negative might be a slightly bumpy ride plus an increase in the weight of the boat oh of course and the fact that if you put too much in there would be a colossal #kin bang and foam/tube everywhere!!!

But don't worry that will be the "last resort/massive fit of temper option" a little way off yet
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Old 26 April 2006, 18:44   #50
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Stephen

A few thoughts

Firstly I will mention your concerns as a polite reminder when I have my call with the folks at Humber tomorrow. They are a pretty good bunch with strong moral values. I have to say, from personal observation, that on the downside a lot of shouting when the actual cause is unknown does not help.. this not as a personal rebuke to you but a fact of life.

It is fair to note.

1. The vessel is 6 years old. This may not seem a lot but has to be put against the use that the vessel has been through. You also do not detail as to what you use the boat for.
2. You have not defined the history of the vessel but one would asume that it has had regular inspections or if you bought it second hand you had a survey prior to purchase. Thus are we suggesting a rapid failure as there has been no event for 6 years ?
3. The weed growth on the tubes as in the picture can become an issue as this does attack the outer layer of the hypalon.
4. The Polymarine glue is Ok and in our experience is not quite the same as 2402 but works better in damp conditions ie. our prefernce is 2402 in good conditions but to effect "in the field repairs" Polymarine is better.
5. There needs to be empathy with your situation in being in a distant shore with lesser facilities and above what is required is a solution. I am sure this can be found.
6. Humbers have been supplied even further south that you to the Antartic Survey vessels.

If you want me to call to offer guidance or to find a solution then in the first instance feel free to e-mail.

Regards

John

www.quinquarimarine.co.uk
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