Boy Airlifted To Hospital After Rigid Inflatable Boat Overturns

[Poly]

From MCGA website:

Originally Posted by http://www.mcga.gov.uk/c4mca/press-releases?id=B211A710EADA9800&m=7&y=2008

Yesterday evening Holyhead Coastguard received a 999 call from a mobile phone concerning a group of three Rigid Inflatable Boats (RIBs) with 20 students and 3 instructors from the National Watersport Centre at Plas Menai reporting that one of the RIBs had capsized. The RIB had capsized on the Mussel bank which is outside the Menai Strait, but on the Caernarfon Bar.

The Coastguard were informed that all persons were accounted for but requested the attendance of Beaumaris RNLI ILB as a precaution.

The Llandwrog Coastguard Rescue Team along with the inshore lifeboat from Beaumaris were asked to attend with the team sent to Fort Belan to provide observation.

At just before 9.00 pm staff from Plas Menai advised the Coastguard that one of the casualties had hit their head when the RIB capsized and was drifting in and out of consciousness.

A rescue helicopter was immediately scrambled and the injured lad, aged 15, suffering from hypothermia with an Instructor from Plas Menai, were subsequently airlifted from the beach at Abermenai Point (a spit of sand opposite Fort Belan) and taken to Bangor hospital. The hospital later reported the boy was comfortable. All the 20 students were from the King Edward School in Bath.

Barry Priddis, Watch Manager at Holyhead Coastguard said

My concern is that the Coastguard were not informed of this event and weather conditions were South easterly winds of force 5 in a flooding tide.

Conditions on Caernarfon Bar were quite rough according to local crews. The capsized RIB has not yet been recovered, but full details are now held with the Coastguard as to its location.

[yoyo]

I recall that Jono Garton encountered a similar incident in this area a couple of years back, which shows even the very experienced skippers can be caught out!

I often see the NWC training in this area; the conditions are often rough with strong tides even on the nicest of days.

[PeterM]

So were there average 7 or 8 in each boat ? I would have hoped that in this case they were a good size (6m + at least )as in poor conditions with less then ' experienced' passengers I would not want 4 /5 in a boat. From what I have seen most of these types of outings run boats less that 6m.

Just my inital thought as I dont know the full story of what has happened.

[codprawn]

The late Shaun white always used to issue his passengers with canoists helmets and they proved their worth when one of his large RIBs capsized. a brilliant idea even though not a legal requirement.

[Top banana]

Originally Posted by yoyo

I recall that Jono Garton encountered a similar incident in this area a couple of years back, which shows even the very experienced skippers can be caught out!

I often see the NWC training in this area; the conditions are often rough with strong tides even on the nicest of days.

yes you recall correct, jono turned a 5m assault over on the bar, but the difference being, he was there surfing 3m standing waves, all in the form of pleasure, not with a boat full of school kids. It could of been far worse than had turned out.I allso think that the coast guard should of recieved a passage plan of the trip, esspecially with the ammount of kids involved.
Be interesting to find out the full story

[Poly]

Originally Posted by Top banana

It could of been far worse than had turned out.I allso think that the coast guard should of recieved a passage plan of the trip, esspecially with the ammount of kids involved.

the CG expressed a similar view - but I don't see what value filing a passage plan with the CG would have actually brought?

there were presumably people on shore at plas menai who knew where the boats were going, who was on board and when they would be back. Equally they weren't on their own they had 3 boats so, as they demonstrated, were capable of dealing with most emergencies reasonably well without external help. As far as I can tell from the press release and news reports they seem to have dealt with things fairly well once the preverbial hit the fan.

should they have been there? no doubt the MAIB will say no - but actually they were on some sort of adventure holiday - so I would expect they were doing all sort of things with a degree of risk/excitement involved. there seems to be some emphasis on the fact that these were "children". They were presumably reasonably fit and healthy teenagers so possibly more suited to this sort of activity and circumstance than many older people who pay good money for adventure rib rides.

the CG frequently complain that they don't get passage plans from people but we know from our discussions here they don't do anything with them anyway and I am not convinced in busy areas, at busy times that the CG could cope with everyone filing plans for every trip.

Be interesting to find out the full story

as ever we are guessing the exact circumstances! however if it anything like the investigation into the army cadet capsize in scotland last year it will take two investigations to even establish the facts!

[Top banana]

[

the CG frequently complain that they don't get passage plans from people but we know from our discussions here they don't do anything with them anyway and I am not convinced in busy areas, at busy times that the CG could cope with everyone filing plans for every trip.


But this isnt any instance, it was late evening in a quiet part of the country,
with adverse conditions reported on the bar and 20 or so"students" out on adventure activities. yet sheltered through the straits,no ones implying that they shouldnt of been there enjoying there activities, but had the coast guard been informed of there activities,then any initial reports of an incident could of been dealt with differently as a first response.and then argue later weather it was a waste of time or not.
thankfully events turned out ok.

[DGR]

Hmm...

As far as I know, Plas Menai's RIBS are not coded - operating under the RYA 'exemption' (or whatever it's called).

Surely that means that if the boats were running under these regs, then they should be using the RYA instructor/student ratios - 6/1 or 3/1, not 7 or 8/1.

When my RIB was coded, I had to have seats for all passengers - last time I saw Plas' RIBS they didn't have seats for more than 4.

It will be interesting to see what the MAIB come up with - and what they decide the boats were being used for. RYA activities (too many students) or commercial activity when not coded.

D...

[waverunner]

Yesterday evening Holyhead Coastguard received a 999 call from a mobile phone concerning a group of three Rigid Inflatable Boats (RIBs) with 20 students and 3 instructors from the National Watersport Centre at Plas Menai reporting that one of the RIBs had capsized.


Did they not have a VHF radio?

[Top banana]

Originally Posted by waverunner

Yesterday evening Holyhead Coastguard received a 999 call from a mobile phone concerning a group of three Rigid Inflatable Boats (RIBs) with 20 students and 3 instructors from the National Watersport Centre at Plas Menai reporting that one of the RIBs had capsized.


Did they not have a VHF radio?

Which makes you think did the other two vesells from plas menai that were allso on excersise first contact plas menai about the incident before contacting the coast guard, wasting valuable time.

[Poly]

Originally Posted by Top banana

Which makes you think did the other two vesells from plas menai that were allso on excersise first contact plas menai about the incident before contacting the coast guard, wasting valuable time.

OK good to see no one is jumping to conclusions with out most of the facts

there are several valid reasons why you would use a mobile rather than a VHF e.g.

* poor vhf reception
* CH16 busy
* radios busy between boats confirming all casualties retrieved/ok
* available responsble person not close to vhf when boat is busy with casualties and skipper is trying to retrieve people from water etc

original call wasn't a distress call as such - rather a "we've buggered up, everyone is OK, but can we get the lifeboat anyway" then the casualty deteriorated, as a result the chopper was used possibly - a precautionary over reaction since the media reported that the boy was back at plas menai the next day.

[Poly]

Originally Posted by DGR

Hmm...

As far as I know, Plas Menai's RIBS are not coded - operating under the RYA 'exemption' (or whatever it's called).

Surely that means that if the boats were running under these regs, then they should be using the RYA instructor/student ratios - 6/1 or 3/1, not 7 or 8/1.

When my RIB was coded, I had to have seats for all passengers - last time I saw Plas' RIBS they didn't have seats for more than 4.

It will be interesting to see what the MAIB come up with - and what they decide the boats were being used for. RYA activities (too many students) or commercial activity when not coded.

D...

I'm not an RYA instructor so don't know how the rules are applied.

- do the rules apply to number of instructors per boat or just to the course overall (i.e. can they be left onshore)?
-do the rules apply only to "syllabused" courses (i.e. for general training/coaching are the same ratios applied)? e.g. I'm not sure many sailing clubs work these rules for normal training rather than courses.
- could these boats have been local authority coded rather than MCA coded?

whilst the MAIB report will be interesting it will probably make bizzare observations like "the students were all wearing bouyancy aids - this is innapropriate for use outside sheltered waters" and "had the boats been MCA Coded they would have been required to carry Liferafts" and other bizzare comments that really have little to do with the cause of the incident or preventing its recurrance.

[Top banana]

[QUOTE=Polwart;256173] OK good to see no one is jumping to conclusions with out most of the facts

there are several valid reasons why you would use a mobile rather than a VHF e.g.

* poor vhf reception
* CH16 busy
* radios busy between boats confirming all casualties retrieved/ok
* available responsble person not close to vhf when boat is busy with casualties and skipper is trying to retrieve people from water etc

I know the weather is appalling most of the time in scotland,which is why we abandoned our rescent trip, but you really must get out more. or move onto
some other reading material instead of vhf afloat.

I find jumping to conclusions, saves so much time.

I wonder if they had there mobiles safelly stored in a freezer bag.

[Northern Tim]

**Don't shoot**

I've just got back from volunteering at an outdoor activity and sailing centre for the last 10 days. We regularly carry 8 or 10 people on a RIB depending on the number that the boat is rated for (sitting on the tubes). The RYA are happy with this. We always have a crew member on board besides helmsman and the rule is that the passengers must hold onto something metal in the boat (ie grab handles). I'm guessing that Plas Menai will be doing similar.

In my experience, Plas Menai staff are experienced and know the local waters well although maybe they should have gone up the straits rather than out over the bar. It's easy to sit and judge.

[Poly]

MAIB have just released the report:

http://www.maib.gov.uk/publications/...enai_rib_6.cfm

Haven't read it all yet - but the synopsis seems to blame Human Error/Judgement?

[JSP]

Can be a bad stretch of water. Once described as the most dangerous in the world. But that was well before it was marked out.

[codprawn]

Originally Posted by Polwart

MAIB have just released the report:

http://www.maib.gov.uk/publications/...enai_rib_6.cfm

Haven't read it all yet - but the synopsis seems to blame Human Error/Judgement?

Yup an inexperienced instructor who had all the right bits of paper - experience seems to count for nothing.....

She slowed too much when turning and a wave caught up behind and slewed them around. The fact she was standing to the side of the console probably didn't help much either.

These reports should always be essential reading - learn by OTHER people's mistakes!!!

The late great Shaun White always insisted on his passengers sitting on the tubes and wearing white water style helmets - the one time they had a capsize it paid dividends - people were thrown clear of a very heavy RIB and no injuries.

[codprawn]

It also mentions in the report that although many people were carrying mobile phones "none were suitably waterproofed". Dare I mention freezer bags again???

[Poly]

Originally Posted by codprawn

Yup an inexperienced instructor who had all the right bits of paper - experience seems to count for nothing.....

the phrase instructor may be misleading - she was not a PB instructor. The error was not really that she was inexperienced (she was perfectly competent for the original task) it was the change of plan without taking that into account - and without keeping her under closer supervision.

Actually - the actions of the two more experienced instructors in how they chose to respond to the unfolding events was probably more concerning. Perhaps there was a degree of the opposite - these guys have been doing it for ever - we don't need to worry about ensuring they are trained what to do if the preverbial hits the fan.
[/quote]

It also mentions in the report that although many people were carrying mobile phones "none were suitably waterproofed". Dare I mention freezer bags again???

I thought of you when I read that bit

I thought you might have had something to say about the recommendations to consider 150N inflatable l/js for similar activities in the future? I think the realities of the situation are that 50N bouyancy aids still would be the preferred solution if i was running a centre for "kids" esp. if operating multiple boats together like this (reducing risk). "Tamper free", and lower cost to maintain (presumably no "formal" inspection required, no costs from inquisitive youngsters playing, no costs every time someone gets one wet getting out at the beach), permanent bouyancy so no risk it doesn't go off, and probably reduced risk of entrapment under the boat. And both before and following any dunking - better insulation. I also think its easier to get good fitting bouyancy aids for children/teenagers than lifejackets unless you go with crotch strap - and thats not going to happen (or happen effectively) with a bunch of teenagers.

[K&S]

Originally Posted by codprawn

It also mentions in the report that although many people were carrying mobile phones "none were suitably waterproofed". Dare I mention freezer bags again???

To quote from Vincent by Don Maclean 'perhaps they'l listen now..la la la'

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=dipFMJckZOM

As for the white water helmets i've long been a fan of using them before hearing about Shaun White using them