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Old 06 August 2007, 18:14   #11
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At the risk of getting flamed.

I carry but do not usually wear lifejackets. Having said that I usually am doing no more than 2-3 nautical miles around these islands. I still carry phone (in a bag), flares and radio. BUT, at what point Ox do you want to turn into the nanny state. People have to have choices (and live with the consequences). I would never take a child in the boat without a lifejacket - but thinking adults should have a choice.

How much more do you want your life to be controlled and governed by HM Government?

I understand everyones point of view but I don't want to enforce my opinion upon others. Can you look in the mirror and say the same?

Ian
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Old 06 August 2007, 18:36   #12
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Whilst you do and should have a choice on many things when you actions have an impact on so many others then maybe on this subject there should be some rules.

Look how many other people had to come to the aid of this vessel.
All putting their own lives on the line.
Report suggests they hit a well chatted bouy of some sort.

Again I am sure I may get flamed but IMHO it scares me silly with some of the sights I see on the water.
Lack of life jackets, no communications, clearly no training.

A guy this weekend in Herne Bay had is two kids in his ski boat ( both under 10), he un-tied the boat and prep-ed it at the top of the ramp then just as he was about to back down the slip removed the winch strap from the eye, so nothing holding the boat onto the trailer. As he climbed into his 4x4 I asked if he realised he had nothing holding his boat to the trailer, thinking it may be an oversight, he said "yes its fine I know what I am doing!!!!"

You can't take a 50cc scooter on the road without some formal training but you can take a speedboat on the water with none at all, is that really a good idea?

I am not saying it would have but a little bit of training may have stopped this from happening.

All IMHO of course.
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Old 06 August 2007, 22:20   #13
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Whilst you do and should have a choice on many things when you actions have an impact on so many others then maybe on this subject there should be some rules.

Look how many other people had to come to the aid of this vessel.
All putting their own lives on the line.
Report suggests they hit a well chatted bouy of some sort.
Do you think less people would have come to their aid if they had been wearing lifejackets? Of course not.

As to putting their own lives on the line nobody would join the RNLI/rescue services if they didn't want to!!!

Yes they were totally irresponsible - but then again so is the idiot mountain biking down a boulder strewn track.
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Old 07 August 2007, 03:40   #14
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Do you think less people would have come to their aid if they had been wearing lifejackets? Of course not.
Sorry I may have not got my point across.
No your right the same amount of people would have come out.
IMHO its a dam fine job those boy's and girls do and it is second to none anywhere else in the world.

My point is that the early indications are that they "may" have hit a charted mark!
With no GPS on the vessel they had no chance of not hitting it in the dark.
As I said training may or may not have helped here, we will never know I guess.
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Old 07 August 2007, 03:50   #15
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I have been on the water in cowes this week and looking at a mix of yotties and powerboaters, it would appear that not wearing a lifejacket is almost standard.
I would guesstimate that 70% of people dont bother.

Nick.
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Old 07 August 2007, 06:50   #16
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It all comes down to a personal level of "Risk"

I would imagine when we were younger and less experienced we all drove cars faster than we should, as a single young adult who doesnt have to look after anybody else, personal "Risk" levels are quite high, as you get older / get married / have kids the level of "Risk" you are willing to take generally gets lower as your responsibilities to others increase.

This combined with experience means that the more you know the less "Risk" you are willing to take. ie you purchase more safety equipment / analysis the "What if ... " scenarios / Attend Training courses etc in other words you start "Managing the level of Risks"

Maybe these guys were unlucky and none of us are perfect, the sea does take prisoners, and when you look at the stats its surprising how few accidents actually do happen (or get reported) - Ignorance is Bliss

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Old 07 August 2007, 07:31   #17
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I don't think the wearing of life jackets is the issue here. A sufficient number should have been on board for the number of passengers, of course.

Operating a vessel, in open waters, at night with no means of determining a fairly exact location and no means of alerting others to that location ie: flairs and VHF is the rub. Accidents happen to the well prepared and to the ill prepared. One would think that wanting to know where one is in the dark would be instinctual. The degree to which these people were prepared to do what is required to keep on living is yet more proof that Charles Darwin was correct. The gene pool will be thinned based on members ability to adapt and survive.

That said, I've learned some lessons the hard way myself

Government regulation cannot trump stupidity.
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Old 07 August 2007, 07:52   #18
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Maybe these guys were unlucky and none of us are perfect, the sea does take prisoners, and when you look at the stats its surprising how few accidents actually do happen (or get reported) - Ignorance is Bliss Pete ><(((>
Be interesting to know what they actually hit to cause a boat to sink (given they were only couple of hours before HW). There should have been a couple of metres of water over the top of the submarine barrier.

There was an Extreme 26 called Deep Purple but not sure if this is the one.

Pete
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Old 07 August 2007, 07:58   #19
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sounds like they hit the submarine barrier... again... don't know why they don't blow it up?!!
Wasn't the submarine barrier !!! On launching the best position coastguard could give us from the information recieved from the man on his mobile was that they were somewhere between Portsmouth Harbour and Cowes.

Chances are there's a buoy out there with a serious fibre glass rash !!

Fortunately we were able to DF the Royal Marine RIB that was onscene and eventually obtained a lat/long.

They are without doubt seven very lucky individuals.
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Old 07 August 2007, 08:09   #20
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I would still like to know why the hell so many of these buoys aren't lit???

Let's face it how many speedboats or PWCs carry charts or chartplotters?

Having said that it is suicidal to run around at high speed at night unless you have FLIR/Radar/nightvision/chartplotter.
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