Boat Co-ownership

[9D280]

Originally Posted by deeyup

servicing done at a dealer and split the cost. Or do the work together.

Originally Posted by lauchiemb

The best part of being in a syndicate, apart from it being cheaper, is that you always have someone to go boating with. And if it breaks down it is less of a worry since you have less of a financial commitment and more help to get it fixed.

These two half quotes sum up my only experience of part ownership. Admittedly it wasn't kept at either of our places, and we took it winter about to store the engine. Virtually all the work was done as a team as we had to arrange to go up to the boat, so usually made a weekend of it, did the repairs Saturday, and once the hangover cleared went for a spin on Sunday. If time wasnlt on our side, we agreed on throwing it at a dealer, otherwise split the cost of the spares. Worked great......

....except it ws a Dory, and we both got fed up getting hernias launching the d@mn thing, so sold it. (Which reminds me, anyone want a cheap 1970s 20Hp longhsaft Johnson? )

It worked I suspect because of two reasons - 1)We both think along remarkably similar lines and 2) None of the costs of ownership were in the "sharp intake of breath" category.

[Erin]

Originally Posted by willk

Boat Sharing, a terrible idea, worse than wife swapping because you'll love the boat...

Spoken form experience?

I've been involved in a share of a 32' motor boat. It worked relatively well, primarily because it couldn't (easily or enjoyably) be driven single handed and as such any trips were generally undertaken with both parties involved. There were some typical grumbles about sharing the maintenance and the standard of work/improvements done but I suppose that could be easily taken care of by having all work contracted out. The partnership dissolved mutually and I bought out my co-owner.

The RYA have guidance notes and standard agreements for boat sharing (either joint ownership or ownership in common) so I'd take a look there.

[willk]

Originally Posted by Erin

Spoken form experience?

I've been involved in a share of a 32' motor boat. It worked relatively well, primarily because it couldn't (easily or enjoyably) be driven single handed and as such any trips were generally undertaken with both parties involved. There were some typical grumbles about sharing the maintenance and the standard of work/improvements done but I suppose that could be easily taken care of by having all work contracted out. The partnership dissolved mutually and I bought out my co-owner.

I know a few boating shares that ended in tears. The stories were fairly pathetic - refusal to maintain safety gear, denied damage, uncleaned dirt, and in one case, the loss of the vessel from it's moorings through pure negligence.

Grumbling about maintenance and poor work would ruin any pleasure I had from a boat. I'd rather stick to my tender than share rib.

[Poly]

Originally Posted by willk

Grumbling about maintenance and poor work would ruin any pleasure I had from a boat. I'd rather stick to my tender than share rib.

John sounds like we won't need to include Willk in the Admin-rib-share-scheme

[Mollers]

Originally Posted by willk

I know a few boating shares that ended in tears. The stories were fairly pathetic - refusal to maintain safety gear, denied damage, uncleaned dirt, and in one case, the loss of the vessel from it's moorings through pure negligence.

Grumbling about maintenance and poor work would ruin any pleasure I had from a boat. I'd rather stick to my tender than share rib.

Agreed on all points.

It all sounds great in theory with a sensible head on.

I know a few who have tried, all ended badly.

[PeterM]

I own half the bombard 380....mostly I use it and the other owner doesnt ! ( unless its with me).


Probably due to low cost but never had any issues....

The SR4 was half owned which was OK until the half owner decided he wanted his money back , before the boat was sold. Again low value stuff, but caused a slight grumble from me and a minor cashflow issue when I just paid him out.

[Mollers]

Originally Posted by PeterM

I own half the bombard 380....mostly I use it and the other owner doesnt ! ......................never had any issues....

[Maximus]

Originally Posted by Nos4r2

I tried it many years ago. It was such a bad experience that I wouldn't attempt it again. The boat itself (a nearly new Shakespeare speedboat hull) never even made it to the water.

''Never Even Made The Water''!!!!

[Pikey Dave]

Originally Posted by 9D280

anyone want a cheap 1970s 20Hp longhsaft Johnson? )

Nah, I'm sorted thanks

[willk]

Originally Posted by Pikey Dave

Nah, I'm sorted thanks

Rebored 1950's unit?

[Pikey Dave]

Originally Posted by willk

Rebored 1950's unit?

Probably seized

[willk]

Originally Posted by Pikey Dave

Probably seized

Well, if you can crank it by hand and you've still got that spark, there's hope...

[bigjarv]

Thanks very much for your help and advice. Where do I find MGN280?

I'll get onto google right now! Sincerely appreciate your help.

[Nos4r2]

Originally Posted by Maximus

''Never Even Made The Water''!!!!

Oh, it was so pathetic it was shocking.

The conversation went something like this:-
Me. 'so, we've bought this hull. As we agreed before we paid for the hull,the motor is MINE and it stays that way because you've got the mechanical knowledge of a retarded toothbrush. I don't mind it being used, and I want to make sure it's maintained properly.'
#1 'Cool lets go do stupid things very fast'
Me 'Ok, lets bolt on the motor and go play. Where's the drill?'
#2 'Yes, but I want to change the engine every time I take it out so I can potter up the Thames'
Me.'You don't own another motor, and you wouldn't get your hands dirty changing a car radio let alone an outboard. Why didn't you say you wanted a river boat before we paid for it?!'
#2 ' Well you wouldnt have let me buy into it. I'm buying a share of the outboard off you'...
Me 'No you're not. You knew that wasn't part of the deal and it's not for sale'.

Along wanders random mate of #2, also known as 'B***sh** Billy. He thinks he knows everything about every boat, ever and says he owns a huge Ribcraft that does over 100mph.

BB 'Look inside the boat, it's got osmosis and it's dangerous' (the hull's probably only ever been in the water twice and it's spotless but this doesn't deter our 'osmosis' expert.
Me. 'oh?' (expecting trouble)
#2 'I don't want it. Get rid of it. It's not safe. Scrap it.' (metaphorically sticks fingers in ears). Leaves.
#1' He's talking crap isn't he.'
Me 'Yes. WTF are we going to do with this hull? He'll want it if finish it.'
#1 'Dunno.'
Me. 'Soddit, lets give it away'.
#1 'Ok.'

Advert goes in the Trade-It as 'free to collector, may be a good sandpit'.

The man that picked it up couldn't believe it was a freebie. He kept trying to hand me money saying 'but there's nothing wrong with it' while I said 'I know, I just want the thing gone to end the idiocy of the shared ownership.'

8 hours later, I owned my own boat again...

[Dhf]

retarded toothbrush and BB
Brilliant!! everyone should explain their situations like that, much easier to understand.

I've been watching this thread with interest as i'm thinking of offering shared ownership with my rib, just got few things to sort out first.

[Poly]

Originally Posted by bigjarv

Thanks very much for your help and advice. Where do I find MGN280?

I'll get onto google right now! Sincerely appreciate your help.

Here is the link: http://www.dft.gov.uk/mca/mgn_280-2.pdf

Relevant bits:

“Officer”, in relation to a body corporate, means -
(a) a director, manager, secretary or other similar officer of the body corporate, or a person purporting to act in any such capacity, or
(b) an individual in accordance with whose directions or instructions the directors of that body corporate, or of any other body corporate which is its controller, are accustomed to act;

“Pleasure vessel” as defined in the Merchant Shipping (Small Commercial Vessels and Pilot Boats) Regulations 2004, means;
(a) a vessel which -

(i) is owned by an individual, and
(ii) at the time it is being used -

(aa) is used only for the sport or pleasure of the owner or the immediate family or friends of the owner, and
(bb) is on a free voyage or excursion;

(b) a vessel which -

(i) is owned by a body corporate, and
(ii) at the time it is being used -

(aa) is used only for the sport or pleasure of employees or officers of the body corporate, or their immediate family or friends

, and
(bb) is on a free voyage or excursion;

(c) a vessel -

(i) which is owned by or on behalf of the members of a members’ club,
(ii) which, at the time it is being used, is used only for the sport or pleasure of a member
of that club, his immediate family or his guest, and
(iii) for the use of which no payment is made other than a payment into the funds of the
members club which funds are applied for the general use of the members club.

In this definition, “free voyage or excursion” means a voyage or excursion in respect of which -

(a) subject to paragraphs (b) and (c), no money is paid, and no goods or services are provided, by any person;
(b) the owner of the vessel engaged in the voyage or excursion may pay money, or provide goods and services, to any person; and
(c) the owner of the vessel engaged in the voyage or excursion may only receive -

(i) money for, or in connection with, the operation of the vessel or the carrying of any person in the vessel as a contribution to the direct expenses of the operation of the vessel incurred during the voyage or excursion, or
(ii) goods and services which are used or provided on the vessel during the voyage or excursion.

3.1.3 Pleasure vessels are excepted from the code, and included in the definition of pleasure vessels are those vessels wholly owned by or on behalf of a members club. Reference should be made to the Regulations for a proper description of the conditions that need to be met for a members’ club vessel to claim exception as a pleasure vessel. Where any exception to the Regulations or the Code is claimed, the Administration will, if necessary, seek to use the provisions of section 290 of the Merchant Shipping Act 1995 to establish the facts.

“Proprietors club” means any club that is not a members club;
3.1.2 The Regulations apply to vessels operated by proprietors’ clubs and associations whether the owner/managing agent is corporate, private or of a charitable nature.

[Mollers]

Originally Posted by Nos4r2

Oh, it was so pathetic it was shocking...........................

Sounds fairly typical.

[kubcat]

I have a shared boat. We have had it for a few years now and we kind of evolved into it as my boating partner is a very good mate and we do a lot of our boating together including racing offshore powerboats. With the racing we had to have pretty high levels of trust.

We do have a number of other boats each and I am not sure if that changes things.

We have a simple way we run the partnership. We each do whatever we can and pay for whatever we want to do to it. I don't know if I pay more or he pays more but I am definitely paying less than the full amount and so is he. The boat gets spoilt and it is far better now than when we first purchased it.

I guess it helps we are both pretty hands on and have the knowledge, space and tools to maintain it. Also having a beer and working on the boat is almost as good as being out on it and it is something we often do together.

[Ribochet]

Originally Posted by willk

. I'd rather stick to my tender than share rib.

Dam - there goes that idea and I was going to let you choose which engine you wanted

[willk]

Originally Posted by Ribochet

Dam - there goes that idea and I was going to let you choose which engine you wanted

Oh, I've seen you fettle and polish that bad puppy! I'd be the layabout half share in your boat ANY day!