A Passage into the wind. With or against the tidal stream.

Bremar · 18 August 2018, 08:46

Hi all,
I have looked through past posts but couldn’t find the answer to this question.
I was planning a short passage from Salcombe to Dartmouth for the Regatta and back the following day. I was looking at Start Point and the tidal streams and wind direction.
You can’t choose the wind direction. It’s going to be whatever it’s going to be but you can often choose the time you go in any time (within limits).
On the way to Dartmouth we will probably be going with both the wind and current which in my opinion is ideal. On the way back it is likely to be against the wind but I could try to hit start point at slack when the current is on the turn (with luck) but otherwise I need to choose to either drive against both the wind and current or against the wind and with the current.
The question is “which produces the worst driving conditions.”
Any help would be appreciated. Thank you.

Poly · 18 August 2018, 09:20

Wind against tide creates worse waves. Whether that is enough to be a problem depends on the wind strength, fetch (distance it has been travelling over open water), tidal stream, the depth of the water, your boat and likely the swell (which is influenced by how long the wind had been blowing for). The worst think will be around headlands (or between islands) where the tidal steam increases or two different streams converge.

If it really bad consider trimming the boat (load or tilt pin) differently.

jwalker · 18 August 2018, 17:42

+1 Wot he said....

Bremar · 18 August 2018, 20:26

Thank you for the reply’s. I think I understand what you are saying.
Worst case is always wind over tide so by inference if you have got to go into the wind to get to your destinatiin choose a time when the tidal flow is with the wind as small as possible I guess)
Coping with conditions will obviously be better in a bigger boat (mine is a 4.2m zodiac pro with 40hp) but I guess the size of boat should not effect the principles above
Thanks. Bremar

Nos4r2 · 18 August 2018, 20:51

I'd aim for slack water to round Start Point if I had the option.

midlife · 19 August 2018, 07:09

Especially in a boat that size as can be nasty off start even on a nice day with moderate wind

Lee argyle · 19 August 2018, 08:38

As already noted wind over tide can get lumpy, avoid overfalls and races in strong tidal conditions.
Going into a head sea trim down, a following sea trim up and try to avoid stuffing the bow, good luck

Bremar · 19 August 2018, 08:57

Ok so I think I’ve got it.
the plan on the return journey from Dartmouth to Salcombe which will I’m sure be into the wind is to arrive at start point just before slack when the tide and wind will be against me, then cross on slack then, rest of journey to Salcombe will be into the wind with current going with me but against wind. So wind over tide scenario back to Salcombe, tho the current turning and therefor slack should last maybe an hour which is enough to get back to Salcombe from Start Point
I appreciate sometimes there no perfect answer. Thanks everyone.
Bremar

GuyC · 19 August 2018, 10:42

If it was me doing the trip, looking at the tidal stream diagrams courtesy of Visitmyharbour, I think would be leaving Dartmouth river mouth a couple of hours after HW Plymouth if I was governed by the tide only. If the wind is SW, the I'd leave an hour earlier to stay in a slow moving but generally NE tidal stream.

Bremar · 19 August 2018, 20:23

Thanks guyC. And others. I was thinking of going 1 1/2 HRs after HW Dartmouth (10.54 on 2nd Sept) so I hit slack. Which is close to what your suggesting. Thanks for the confirmation. This has taken me about 2-3 hour of thought. Guess it took you 10 mins. (But all on the premis of the wind being against me)
Thanks everyone Bremar