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Old 16 June 2016, 14:37   #31
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Hi willk.. Im not trying to upset anyone..and I genuinely hope its not coming across that way ?

I do believe Chinese glue is stronger than the material. Only a few month back..I tried to remove the PVC backing from the fixtures on my seago..I posted about it here at that time. Here is the picture I posted ..I had the PVC tube material gripped in a vice.. hauled and hauled as much as I could.. you can see what the result is in this photo.. the PVC laminates are ripping..something had to give as I was using a tyre lever as well. I gave up in the end. That is why I question the glue as being weak ...to me its stronger than the PVC . Is that wrong of me ?



I also genuinely think for a leak that is less than a quarter inch in diameter..there is no need for an internal patch in the first place. I remember reading somewhere that an internal patch is only require if the tear is 2 inches long..again that is why I was querying it with Office888

If the thread and my repair method is not appropriate ..do feel free to tidy it up ..I donít mind..I was trying to help others ..that was my intention..nothing else.

Re Officer..that was a genuine error..I type Jeff instead of his full name..I should be more careful and have typed Office. For that I do apologies..
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Old 16 June 2016, 16:04   #32
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Glue isn't weak it's its application that's weak I worked with underwater applied epoxy coatings for a while achieving 900 psi pull off the coating was good but all down to surface prep anyway gurnard if it works a result and a wee dram is the order of the day in fact I going to have one now in antisipation.

Cheers
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Old 17 June 2016, 06:04   #33
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Hi again Jeff.. while you had your celebratory drink.. I had another sniff of my Glue ..its not as good as the Gravy .. but it certainly does the trick as you will see in this photo.



The external patch is now in firmly in position ..I used Poly marine two part glue..and in the instructions.. it said.. if cut is 75mm or more put on an internal patch. I do follow instructions as best I can so I am absolutely certain this patch has repaired my boat. For info..the wee red dot on the patch..is to highlight where the leak was..and is around ľĒ diameter..so roughly to scale.I marked it on the photo..for info ..its not there in real life.

I confess..the glue was three months past its sell by date
but the bacon I had for breakast was a week past its date..and Im still living

Im also very happy another piece of my old seago slat floor has been re cycled and will still go to sea with me. Its the patch material.

Its worth remembering too..the floor board closed the original leak . which is how I managed to continue my 60 sea journey.. With the internal plug on the inside..the patch..and the floorboard all preventing it leaking.. im on a winner

It may look messy around the edges..Im not that messy a worker.. but there was glue left over ..so brushed excess along the edges.. it may not do much.. but Im not worried about looks ..its all under the floor boards.

I will put another patch along the rear edge..as the floor board has chaffed away the PVC at the red transom holder. No leaks there as no pressure or water in that area..but best to pad it out again. I will also sort the floor board so it is less likely to chaff my new patch
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Old 17 June 2016, 07:58   #34
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Of course..there is little point in repairing the hole ..without sorting the problem that caused it in the first place. The angled end of the Quicksilver aluminium floor trim is quite pointed and a bit worn.



So I took a file and rounded the edge ..plus lowered it the approx thickness of a piece of PVC patch material.



I find Sikaflex is the best thing to attach PVC to metal..so I stuck a patch over the edge to help pad it. Normally I would run cyano glue (superglue) round the edge..as its quick setting and holds the patch in place as the Sikaflex cures..which takes time. As I am out of cyano at present..I have to be more patient and use clothes pegs to hold everything in place.



I have spent a life time mixing glues of all types together.. and never had any issues..but I cant say if I weaken or strengthen the final joint..I donít test to self destruct.

I would recommend any SIB owner with a solid Floor to check these areas in their boat. The chaffing took me by surprise as I never noticed it.. but then..I wasnít looking for it...perhaps pre warned..you can solve any problems before a leak highlights it. It took twelve years for mine to wear through..so plenty time to check.

My thanks to everyone who offered suggestions and added comments ..Im certain the Gurnard will be at sea for a few more years yet
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Old 17 June 2016, 08:50   #35
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Well done Gurnard... a pragmatic and effective solution.
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Old 17 June 2016, 09:29   #36
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Quote:
Originally Posted by jeffstevens763@g View Post
Just my two pence why would you want another hole?
When you normally repair from the outside anyway not that I agree or disagree with the mixing ot two components purely because I never tried it but what I have tried is applying marine flex under water onto a ground piece of steel achieving 200 psi pull off since the repair is being pushed on by air it mearly needs to stick as for contaminated surface the internal repair fluids stick so why shouldn't gurnard's cocktail since he has proved the mix. Once he has the inside set and he's happy he then is reverting to a normal repair.
The main reason I suggested the mushroom was they are intended for internal repair they are shaped in such away that the air flattens the outer lip to form a seal if the glue doesn't dry air tight but it's the same thing as gurnard's way in a different format hope it works for you mate.

Cheers
To ensure strength of the repair.

Properly done, it will last as long as any other glued component, guaranteed by ISO and laboratory testing. It will not fail when you need it most.

Most factories cut 3-5 large slices (~150mm long) in the boat to install the baffles, which are patched with glued inside patches. They hide the cuts underneath the joint between the tube and the floor.
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Old 17 June 2016, 10:14   #37
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Hi Fenlander

If Pragmatic means cheap and cheerful .. well.. thats the way of the Gurnard.

Im happy with it.. the original glue holding the black PVC to red PVC was as sound as the day she was made so I donít expect air to pass that way. I rammed the edges of the chaff with my mix of Sikaflex and glue.. which will now be a solid plug from inside the tube to flush with the black PVC.. then a large overlapping patch stuck over the whole are.



Im in no hurry for the boat .. so on Sunday..I will fill the bottom corner with water ..( I may as well hose out the boat while I have the floor out).. pump tube up to full pressure. Leave for a day or two.. install floor permanent .. then forget it ever happened.


Hi Office888 I appreciate its not a professional job..and your way would outlast the life of the rest of this boat. As mentioned..its a Quicksilver and 12 years old. ..Im pretty confident my repair will see the boats life out though. My job is kind of messy looking too..but its under floors..so Im not troubled by that

Thanks for your comments..I do appreciate them although I didnt follow your method
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Old 17 June 2016, 11:16   #38
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Pragmatic... dealing with things sensibly and realistically in a way that is based on practical rather than theoretical considerations.

I reckon that's you to a tee!
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Old 17 June 2016, 11:16   #39
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Hi gurnard

I would be pleased with that repair not the easiest of places to repair and no sign of the internal repair either good job done.
I was thinking how you had done a temporary repair enough to allow your trip to continue which has lead me to think I will put some of the mushrooms in my kit knowing you pushed the some what stiffer PVC through the 5 MM hole these will go in a treat no glue will be needed in the short term as an emergency just a get you home they are available in large & small sizes I am away at the moment but will sort something next week & post some info.

Cheers
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Old 17 June 2016, 12:10   #40
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Hi Jeff..good idea on the plugs for temp repairs at sea.

I confess I have had one or two at sea( Not on the Quicksilver though).. but they dont bother me..I always have a hand pump with me.

Obviously PVC glue is useless in the wet conditions that you meet outside.
My trick in that instance is mix some quick setting Araldite Epoxy with one part PVC glue.. and ram that into the hole..and cover with a patch. OK..I have yet to cure the leak fully that way..but the epoxy sets quick and forms a plug to stem the airflow to a slow leak..and allows you to continue your journey..you may have to add a few puffs on the way..but nothing drastic

When you do the final repair..its easy to peal it all off the tube again..so no mess to clean

You dont learn that in technical manuals.. but an old salt will always know a way
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