New SIB experience

Simon Guest · 13 March 2006, 21:27

So, my problems are solved, so what do I now think of my new little Zodiac Classic 3.8m Mk2C SIB with the Mariner 15HP 2 stroke? Frankly, I'm chuffed to bits. Here are a few thoughts in case it helps anyone else ...

The SIB purchase was a down-size from a Ribcraft 4.8m with 60HP 4 stroke, for family fun around the Solent with 2 adults and 3 children (3 seasons happy use terminated by scumbags cutting the engine off the back, and trashing the RIB in the process). My initial concerns included: would the SIB be big enough (yes it is, fairly comfortable for us, but we won't be taking extra passengers). Would the 15hp Mariner be enough to get us on the plane (yes it is, but only after changing the standard 9" pitch prop for an 8" pitch). Would we have as much fun as we did with the Ribcraft (yes, we seem to be doing so, but the missus insists it's not so comfortable, and we're going more slowly).

Other SIBs we considered (following recommendations on Ribnet), and rejected: anything without an air floor (too much hassle assembling those panel floors), the Quicksilver aerodec (can only get this up to 3.4m, too small for family of 5), the Zodiac Futura Fastroller (allegedly better performance that the Classic, but it weighs in at 70kg rather than 50kg, which is quite a difference).

Other engines we considered, and rejected: any 4 stroke (want max power to weight ratio, 4 strokes too heavy), anything bigger than 15hp (too heavy to lug around easily), anything smaller than 15hp (duh!). I guess the Yamaha 15hp 2 stroke would have been good, but I'm quite happy with the Mariner.

Other tips: yes, the LVM high volume pump is very good, but it doesn't do the high pressure floor. I can't be doing with pumping this up manually, so bought a Bravo HPP pump, even more expensive than the LVM, but certainly worth it.
Just dial in the pressure and the floor's pumped up in a minute or so. Here: http://www.polymarine.com/products/index.cfm?p=1744
Yes, you need a pair of launching wheels. I didn't fancy drilling my own holes for a pair of up-and-over Trem wheels, so bought the standard Zodiac ones, which are just fine. Attaching/detaching them on land is easy, so too if the boat is floating in deeper water, just don't try and do it if the boat is standing in shallow water.

Final thought: perhaps it doesn't really matter what you have, as long as you can get out on the water somehow ...

cheers,
Simon

ian parkes · 13 March 2006, 23:36

Having a similar time to you Simon down here in Cornwall .

Just got a new 3.8 honda with a honda 20 . Very pleased with it indeed .
Ended up with that same Bravo pump after footpumping once , good innit

Sorry to hear about your rib , one of the reasons I went for a sib .

Now here is my current dilemma , and I have a had a few

Here is the scene I imagine like last weekend we are out playing off a local headland in some fairly rough sea . All seemed very safe and the boat didn't even feel challenged . However I have this vision we hit a big wave get thrown out of the boat . Ok engine stops because iam wearing my safety strap and Iam only a few metres from the boat but due to winter gear wind or current I just can't swim enough to get back to the boat ,

Iam tempted to atach myself to the boat with a longish line , maybe a small throwline through velcro belt or wrist strap etc . I can see problems here but that vision of the boat blowing away from me is not good .

Opinions please

Nos4r2 · 14 March 2006, 02:58

line round neck=snap+dead.

Richard B · 14 March 2006, 06:55

Hi Simon,

Sorry to hear about the incident with the engine theft, that's a bit of a shocker.

The new SIB sounds great. I've just returned to SIBs after a three year absence too. Slightly different approach to yours, I've gone for a smaller boat thar I can almost throw over my shoulder (2.3m weighs about 23kg), similar inflatable floor. And powered with either a 2hp or a 5hp - I'll see how that goes! Likewise I haven't been too impressed with the LVM inflator, although I have a cheap one I found on Ebay, but on the basis that I'll need a foot pump anyway, I'll stick with that I think... I can inflate the boat in seven minutes by foot pump.

Ian - another consideration for you is getting back on board. I would suggest keeping a short loop of rope attached to the lifelines (or another attachment point, you may like to experiment with your setup) to use as a "stirrup" - I think Meme has something similar attached to his RIB. http://www.rib.net/forum/showthread....der#post134776. When you're in the water and tired, it's a long way up...

As for attaching by a lanyard... hmmm, not sure! Supposing the engine lanyard doesn't stop the engine and you're dragged along attached to the boat...

One thing I prefer for SIBs is a manual life jacket rather than an auto. There's less likelehood of knocking yourself unconscious, and if/when you need to swim back to the boat you woun't have the inflated jacket to hinder you, or have an extra task to deflate it. This assumes that you're a strong and confident swimmer. If not, either keep with an auto or take up knitting instead!

Simon Guest · 14 March 2006, 14:39

Quote:

Originally Posted by ian parkes

Here is the scene I imagine like last weekend we are out playing off a local headland in some fairly rough sea . All seemed very safe and the boat didn't even feel challenged . However I have this vision we hit a big wave get thrown out of the boat . Ok engine stops because iam wearing my safety strap and Iam only a few metres from the boat but due to winter gear wind or current I just can't swim enough to get back to the boat ,

Iam tempted to atach myself to the boat with a longish line , maybe a small throwline through velcro belt or wrist strap etc . I can see problems here but that vision of the boat blowing away from me is not good .

Opinions please

Ian,

That's why you wear a lifejacket, isn't it?

cheers,
Simon

Simon Guest · 14 March 2006, 14:46

Quote:

Originally Posted by Richard B

Hi Simon,

Sorry to hear about the incident with the engine theft, that's a bit of a shocker.

The new SIB sounds great. I've just returned to SIBs after a three year absence too. Slightly different approach to yours, I've gone for a smaller boat thar I can almost throw over my shoulder (2.3m weighs about 23kg), similar inflatable floor. And powered with either a 2hp or a 5hp - I'll see how that goes! Likewise I haven't been too impressed with the LVM inflator, although I have a cheap one I found on Ebay, but on the basis that I'll need a foot pump anyway, I'll stick with that I think... I can inflate the boat in seven minutes by foot pump.

Hi Richard,

I think the worst part of the whole incident was the reluctance of the insurer to pay out in any reasonable way. Took 9 months of letter writing, next one was to the Financial Services Authority, I think that's all that persuaded them. Suffice to say, I'm now with a different insurer.

Anyway, I'm now seeing many attractions of a smaller boat ... as are you, it sounds. (Are you selling Blue Ice, then?)

cheers,
Simon

Northern Tim · 14 March 2006, 17:21

Simon,
come on then, dish the dirt. Who was the unhelpful insurer? Just so the rest of us don't send them our money!

Cheers,
Tim

Richard B · 14 March 2006, 17:21

Would you be willing to name and shame the insurance company?

No plans to sell Blue Ice - have just bought the SIB to use as a tender.

jyasaki · 14 March 2006, 17:58

If you folks have a dive shop nearby, see about getting hold of an old but serviceable cylinder and regulator. A buddy of mine uses this to top off his Pro 16.

jky

Simon Guest · 14 March 2006, 19:12

Quote:

Originally Posted by Richard B

Would you be willing to name and shame the insurance company?

Well, my policy was underwritten by AXA Insurance UK (TG), managed by Towergate Marine. I'm not quite sure of the relation between Towergate and AXA, but it was the claims office at Towergate who I had to deal with. I didn't think I was asking for too much by demanding to be put back into a financial position equivalent to that before the incident, but Towergate did not agree, and stonewalled for months.

Anyway, I finally got a fair settlement by writing to the Head of Customer Care at AXA, threatening to take the case to the ombudsman, mind you.

Obviously this is just one man's story. However, information like this is never available when you're choosing your insurer, is it?

cheers,
Simon

le_forban29 · 14 March 2006, 19:19

Hello Simon, did you knock the Bombard Aerotec 380 off your list as well or isn't it available in the UK ? I used one with a 25HP Suzuki and I have sweet memories of this setup.

Simon Guest · 14 March 2006, 20:49

Quote:

Originally Posted by le_forban29

Hello Simon, did you knock the Bombard Aerotec 380 off your list as well or isn't it available in the UK ?

Yes it's available, although for some strange reason the Bombard people decided not to have one at the London Boat Show, so I haven't seen one. But looking at the spec I found it was much narrower than the Zodiacs of the same length, so not so good for squeezing the whole family in, which was my reason for rejecting it.

cheers,
Simon

ian parkes · 14 March 2006, 20:52

Re my question about a line or leash .
Simon Obviously we all wear life jackets but that doesn't get you back to the boat .

Its not climbing back into the boat that is the problem , its physically getting to it .

I guess what mede me think of this was last year i went for a walk on the beach on a pretty windy day . The beach Lifeguards were all stood outside their hut watching their rescue Sib disapear down the coast . They had been out playing in the surf , flipped the boat and then found it was blown faster than they could swim , they said should have used a leash .

I was thinking about a velcro wrist strap with a metre or so of elastic and about 5m of thinish line in a throwbag .
The elastic would be a weak point and it could have other weak points tied in .
I have reservations but the alternative could be dying from Hypothermia or drowning in surf etc etc

roycruse · 14 March 2006, 21:45

I think a leash sounds like a good idea - only need to wear it on a windy day. Not sure id like to be physically attached to a SIB in surf though - it could rip your arm/leg off.

Or what about a sea anchor stowed in a pouch on the transom and attached to you along with kill cord - if you go over you pull and deploy the sea anchor as you go.

Interesting you should mention beach lifeguards. I have witnessed some serious "abuses" of RNLI equipment on beaches around Cornwall - mainly the beach rescue craft you talk about.

It infuriated me that money that was given to save lives was being wasted by a bunch of hooligans who were obviously only lifeguards to look cool and pull chicks.

Richard B · 14 March 2006, 21:48

Quote:

Originally Posted by roycruse

...only lifeguards to look cool and pull chicks.

Isn't that in their contract as "benefits package"?

ian parkes · 14 March 2006, 22:42

Roy the sea anchor idea sounds reasonable.
I thin piece of cord joining the "safety line" would allow it to break if there was a big pull as in surf , also a velcro wrist strap would come undone if it wasn't too strong .

I can just imajine a sib in say a force 4 being blown faster than anyone could swim .

And yes some lifeguards do not impress me , especially when Iam the local tax payer subsidising them being there just to rescue holiday makers who use no common sense at all . probably why I now have to pay to park at my local beach after a lifetime of free beach use .
And they say Cornwall needs the income from the tourist trade , it costs most of us dearly

Ed the Duck · 16 March 2006, 09:24

Ian,
Please do not attach youself to the boat! If you forget to attach the kill cord and fall out when underway then you are likely to be dragged along and drowned. Even if the kill cord works your swimming style in surf would be seriously restricted by 10m of polyprop rope wrapped around your body.

Sea Anchor
I agree with Roy, the sea anchor idea works well. It is wind that carries the SIB away from you (you drift at the same speed as the boat with the tide) and a sea anchor slows the wind driven drift.

I use my SIB in the surf quite a lot and have been bounced out once and capsised twice. On all occasions I have found a sea anchor to be of massive benefit.

I have the sea anchor attached to a short line that runs from the bow eye, along the deck, back to me. The anchor is wrapped in a velcro strap. The velcro strap is then tied to my bouyancy aid.

If/when you stuff the boat and get thrown out, the velcro releases the anchor and massively slows the boats drift.

I keep the line delibrately short (12ft in a 14ft boat), so that there is no chance of the anchor deploying under the boat and snagging the prop. This reduces the holding of the anchor (it can snatch out of the water), but is sufficient to slow wind driven drift and keeps the SIB head to sea in surf upto about 1.5m.

Use of lifeline to stay with boat, get back onboard

Once you get back to the boat, you need one of these http://shop.lifejackets.co.uk/acatal...Lifelines.html to make sure you stay with the boat. You may be tired, and unable to get back onboard and a lifeline will keep you with the boat and make search and rescue much easier.

You can then use the life line to make a strop to help get back onboard. Clip each end of the lifejacket lifeline to the boats life line. It helps if you connect either side of two gluing points. The lifejacket lifeline will hang down in a loop and you can use it as a step. (similar to MeMe's http://www.rib.net/forum/showthread....der#post134776 - but a lot easier to get your foot into.)

Will take some photos this afternoon.

Hope this helps

Ed

Ed the Duck · 16 March 2006, 14:05

Here are the photos of the sea anchor.

Ed

ian parkes · 16 March 2006, 21:08

Ed thanks for the reply.
this subject seems full of holes . I was hoping that there was a tried and tested method .

I agree if i forget the kill clip Iam in trouble , but if i forget the kill clip then the boat is iether going to disappear over the horizon or come back and cut me up so covering for that is dificult , personally In such a situation i would rather trust the weak pint built into or get try to release a wrist strap than simply get left to drown or be hit by the boat.

The sea anchor idea seems ok in theory but still rasies some questions . with it velcro strapped to your BA you could still get caut up in the line and there are loops to get an arm or leg through.

If you are in 1.5m surf with a lifejacket on there is no way you would ever swim back to the boat , you just go wherever the waves and current want you to , hopefully in to the beach , but not always .

I can't see a sea anchor holding a boat head to sea in surf , surely the breaking waves would pull the sea anchor around towards the shore and turn the boat stern to the waves . Al least the boat would end up on the beach in surf a sea anchor would be better deployed over the stern

The lifeline is a good idea to get back in I have used a climbing sling many times to help kayakers get back in . but a line with 2 heavy metal clips i feel is not a good idea as they would flail about in surf and hit you or tangle . i would have the clip attached to the boat and carry a simple tape sling that you can clip to it to use as a step .

I have got to practice getting back into my SIB , it looks easy but I bet its not going to be , I shall wait untill the weather is better first .

Biggles · 16 March 2006, 22:47

Quote:

Originally Posted by ian parkes

And yes some lifeguards do not impress me , especially when Iam the local tax payer subsidising them being there just to rescue holiday makers who use no common sense at all . probably why I now have to pay to park at my local beach after a lifetime of free beach use .

Your just paying for your local incompetant council.