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Old 08 October 2013, 18:10   #21
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Well with the help of all you guys who have posted advice for me so far I've come to the conclusion that I'm after;
A roughly 2.5-3.5 mtr SIB with ideally a 4stroke, but definitely petrol engine, of equal or less than 5hp.

After a couple of days of hounding ebay, other second hand websites, and boating forums, it seems my budget of 500 quid will get me what I'm after... just.

I'd hoped that for 500, I might get the SIB & outboard, a couple of lifejackets, and cover the cost of picking it up. But realistically I think that 500 quid will just about be enough for the boat and engine, and I'll have go beyond what I wanted to spend, to get the boat home, and for the rest of the kit (Mainly waterproofing stuff and lifejackets).

I agree about the electric motors. From what I gather, they seem to do for going on the back of kayaks or for being quiet for fisherman who want to be stealthy, but aren't ideal or for zipping, or pootling down the river on the back of a SIB without serious practicality issues.

I have found a couple of SIBs which I am currently trying to barter down the seller to under 500 quid so I will keep you posted on how that works out.

In terms of usage once I've gotten the thing, what are the running costs, and fuel economy? I imagine a tenners worth of petrol will last for a good few miles? and if we've established that an anchor and VHF radio aren't completely necessary for what I'm expecting to do, what sort of stuff do I need/ should I have, in the boat beyond a lifejacket, and waterproofed mobile phone?

Both the engines on the boats I'm looking at are 2-3hp honda 4 stroke units. What are these like for maintenance?

I'm still unsure on the licensing etc for use on the river wye. I can't seem to find a specific answer or checklist online anywhere. I will no doubt insure it anyway as a matter of safety. The thought of paying 8 quid a day, on top of fuel, maintenance costs, and the initial outlay of buying the thing and transporting it to the river each time, is frustrating, especially if it also inhibits my freedom to just jump on the water at the spur of a moment.
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Old 09 October 2013, 17:35   #22
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Originally Posted by ReadySalted View Post
Well with the help of all you guys who have posted advice for me so far I've come to the conclusion that I'm after; A roughly 2.5-3.5 mtr SIB with ideally a 4stroke, but definitely petrol engine, of equal or less than 5hp. After a couple of days of hounding ebay, other second hand websites, and boating forums, it seems my budget of 500 quid will get me what I'm after... just. I'd hoped that for 500, I might get the SIB & outboard, a couple of lifejackets, and cover the cost of picking it up. But realistically I think that 500 quid will just about be enough for the boat and engine, and I'll have go beyond what I wanted to spend, to get the boat home, and for the rest of the kit (Mainly waterproofing stuff and lifejackets). I agree about the electric motors. From what I gather, they seem to do for going on the back of kayaks or for being quiet for fisherman who want to be stealthy, but aren't ideal or for zipping, or pootling down the river on the back of a SIB without serious practicality issues. I have found a couple of SIBs which I am currently trying to barter down the seller to under 500 quid so I will keep you posted on how that works out. In terms of usage once I've gotten the thing, what are the running costs, and fuel economy? I imagine a tenners worth of petrol will last for a good few miles? and if we've established that an anchor and VHF radio aren't completely necessary for what I'm expecting to do, what sort of stuff do I need/ should I have, in the boat beyond a lifejacket, and waterproofed mobile phone? Both the engines on the boats I'm looking at are 2-3hp honda 4 stroke units. What are these like for maintenance? I'm still unsure on the licensing etc for use on the river wye. I can't seem to find a specific answer or checklist online anywhere. I will no doubt insure it anyway as a matter of safety. The thought of paying 8 quid a day, on top of fuel, maintenance costs, and the initial outlay of buying the thing and transporting it to the river each time, is frustrating, especially if it also inhibits my freedom to just jump on the water at the spur of a moment.
You could always give it a go until someone asks to see a licence, claim you didn't know. You might get a couple of free outings before you need to get one or you might never get asked!

I wouldn't normally do this but have done on the Welsh Dee before because I think Cheshire council charging 150 a year to use 5 miles of river is daylight robbery.

Are you sure a 3hp engine will get you back upstream? Especially if there's a bit of extra flow in the river.
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Old 09 October 2013, 18:16   #23
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Insurance is not a popular consideration if your on a budget, but important to considers others claims against you as we'll as peace of mind for your new investment. May be close to 50pa.
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Old 09 October 2013, 20:44   #24
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So since my last message, I have managed to get myself a small boat.

I found for sale, within my budget, and within an hours drive, a sib, and outboard. I haggled a bit with the seller, and arranged to pick it up this afternoon.

The seller was fantastic, and on arrival (despite being late for work due to traffic delaying me), had the outboard set up, and ran me through the running, and shutting down of the engine which was very handy since I've never used one before, he showed me the boat (which is mint condition, and used only twice since new), and the launching trailer.

The dinghy itself is less than 3m, and the engine is (I think), a two-and-a-bit hp, 4 stroke model, which from the sounds of things, will not be getting me anywhere fast, but will atleast get me from a-b without paddling which is all I initially want it for. I can always upgrade the engine anyway, but for now, it meets the specs I had in mind looks relatively new, and according to the seller who used it on the sea, was quite nippy. What struck me about the seller was how helpful he was, and obliging. Even taking the time to text me on the way home to say that if I need any help, or am unsure of anything to call at any time. I'm not used to that kind of conscientiousness when buying something over the internet, but this guy and his wife were great. Perhaps it's a boating community thing, but it definitely gives me confidence in my purchase.

I'm very exited to give it it's first use this weekend, maybe on llangorse lake, or on the river wye if the water's high enough. I will post photos when I have time, and let you all know how I get on, but it's nice to have my first boat, and perhaps when I've cut my teeth with this, I'll trade up to something bigger and more powerful.

All that remains now is to buy lifejackets.

Quick question; what is the difference between a life jacket and a typical kayaking or canoeing boyancy aid? Are the cheaper ones as safe as the more expensive ones? If looking at buying two, what a some well priced, basic models?

Also I'm planning to make up a small waterproof box to have in the boat at all times. This may sound a bit of an OTT preparation but it will be handy to have. In it I plan to put;
-Whistle
-Spare pull cord
-Laminated copy of insurance docs. and maps/charts of where I happen to be
-Old waterproof mobile phone with credit
-Waterproof torch
-Puncture repair kit for dinghy
-Small binoculars
-Small hip flask for when it gets really dicey! lol

Anything else I should have?
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Old 10 October 2013, 02:19   #25
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Personal floatations devices (buoyancy aids and life jackets etc) have a newton rating. They will also have a weight weighting, latter is more common with buoyancy aids where fit is more determined by body size.

The newton rating is how much floatations the device gives when used with the weight weighting. This will give an indication on suitability in a number of conditions when wearing different clothes. Iirc crewsaver website has a good table of this. A buoyancy aid is typically 50ish, a life jacket, 150 ish. However, a life jacket could be much more, say 275n. This will rance from a buoyancy aid that will give you additional buoyancy when conscious in flat conditions (ie lake/non tidal river) to a device that will keep an unconscious persons face clear of the water even if wearing thick oilskins.

So it is important to choose a unit suitable for what you think your needs are and making sure it fits properly and comfortably ie you need to try it on not buy sight unseen.

For you, an 50N decide would be good, but youngsters, go for a 100N lifejacket. If going on sea, consider a 150N.

As for lifejackets vs buoyancy aids, a life jacket is designed to try to turn you on your back even if unconscious, but a buoyancy aid does not and simply gives additional buoyancy. In that respect, a life jacket is much better but life jacket can be difficult to swim in and may hinder you in circumstances where you could rescue yourself. However, in that circumstances, you could partially deflate a lifejacket to make it easier to swim.
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Old 10 October 2013, 02:23   #26
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As for mobile phone, use 112 for emergency number as it has many benefits over 999 such as the phone using the best signal strength network irrespective of your service provider.
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Old 10 October 2013, 03:16   #27
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No it doesn't. It's exactly the same. They will both use any available network, and if you have registered you can use either number to send emergency texts.

The only benefit is that 112 is a universal emergency number across the EU and some other countries too.

http://www.ofcom.org.uk/static/archi...s/emer1002.htm
"Note: When 999 is referred to in this document the comment applies equally to 112."
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Old 10 October 2013, 04:01   #28
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Thanks for that both. Having the ratings explained certainly makes things much more understandable.

I'm thinking buoyancy aid with a reasonable rating for rivers and lakes, and lifejacket for sea and anything choppy.
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Old 10 October 2013, 07:26   #29
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No it doesn't. It's exactly the same. They will both use any available network, and if you have registered you can use either number to send emergency texts.

The only benefit is that 112 is a universal emergency number across the EU and some other countries too.
Ive been told different by an emergency services trainer. Notably, 112 has priority over 999 calls (so in event of a serious emergency such as 7/7 where airwaves get congested, 112 has better chance of getting through than 999) and handsets have special functionality built in for 112 that 999 does not such as the ability to roam the strongest network signal irrespective of SIM card network provider. I think there was also something about location data being sent but that may have applied to both.

Of course, my emergency services guy may have been talking bollox.
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Old 10 October 2013, 07:30   #30
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There's a lot of it about!
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