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Old 25 January 2006, 12:55   #41
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Rogue Wave
I'd say that was a conclusive answer, whether you choose to accept it or not is up to you!

Also Chris your original question was is the Monkey correct about the chain and the answer is conclusively yes.

Unfortunately that Silver tounged devil Bigsurf is putting a strong and eloquent case for his side, which has certainly got me thinking. I guess the answer lies within the caravan club

Listen I don't give bananas out to just anybody!!!

I will see what Mr Plod says then go from there!

Go on have another banana!


Chris
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Old 25 January 2006, 13:00   #42
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Jono
I'm not quite sure where the "doubt is"..
A secondary means of coupling (Normally chain for heavier trailers and wire rope for lightweight trailers)) is provided for unbraked trailer to provide some control over the trailer in the event of primary coupling detachment.
Sorry that doesn't add up.

Why use a chain for a trailer weighing less than 750Kg??

Surely it is cheaper to use wire strop??

Chris
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Old 25 January 2006, 13:06   #43
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I was in the euroterminal in southampton docks picking up an imported boat for a dealer in the Midlands and there was a bigger boat on a trailer next two it and it had two short strong chains coming from just behind the tow hitch and I can remember being impressed by it and thiking it was a good idea.
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Old 25 January 2006, 13:11   #44
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Rogue Wave


....two short strong chains coming from just behind the tow hitch and I can remember being impressed by it and thiking it was a good idea.
Yankie style....... And yes, I feel it's a better idea than a run away trailer with just the brakes applied... but there's logic......and there's the Law....
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Old 25 January 2006, 13:14   #45
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Originally Posted by CJL
Sorry that doesn't add up.

Why use a chain for a trailer weighing less than 750Kg??

Surely it is cheaper to use wire strop??

Chris
Why do you mention cost? Chain or Wire... as long as it does the job it doesn't matter does it?
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Old 25 January 2006, 15:50   #46
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Quote:
Originally Posted by CJL
Listen I don't give bananas out to just anybody!!!

I will see what Mr Plod says then go from there!
In my experience the police aren't necessarily the most clued up people when it comes to trailer and towing legislation.

A good source of information is The National Trailer & Towing Association www.ntta.co.uk

Excerpts from their web site:

Unbraked trailers
Unbraked trailers manufactured after 1 Jan 1997 must be fitted with a secondary coupling that will provide some residual steering in the event of an unplanned uncoupling. This device should also prevent the ball coupling hitting the ground in similar circumstances. It must be connected to the towing vehicle when the trailer is being towed.

Braked trailer
An emergency breakaway cable must be fitted to the parking brake linkage and the other end clipped or fixed round some fixture on the towing vehicle so that, in the event of the trailer becoming detached from the towing vehicle, the cable will apply the parking brake automatically, before snapping itself. It is not recommended to loop the cable round the towball. (But do so if there is no alternative attachment point.) It is a separate offence not to use the breakaway cable provided.

A secondary coupling must be fitted to a braked trailer manufactured before 1982 that has a manual handbrake arrangement . (A secondary coupling can also be fitted to a braked trailer with hydraulic damping, manufactured after 1982. In such cases, great care should be taken to ensure that the secondary coupling is appropriate in terms of the weight of the trailer (esp. If it is over 1000kg.). Also the operation of the breakaway cable is likely to be prejudiced.)


You can read it all at http://www.ntta.co.uk/law/trailers/brakes.htm

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Old 25 January 2006, 17:21   #47
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In my experience the police

John
So how much experience have you actually had with the police, cos I didn't think they had enough evidence the last time?
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Old 25 January 2006, 17:31   #48
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Okay, a complete picture (wrong word; I have no image of the setup, so this will be a mental picture) of my California-legal, single axle, braked trailer's coupleing system:

Tow vehicle (Toyota 4-Runner, 2003 model) has a built-in trailer hitch. The hitch is (I think) a bolt-on affair, the business part of which is a square receiver tube, with a 1/4" steel "loops" below and to either side of the receiver.

Trailer has an Attwood hydraulic surge brake coupler, with a built-in breakaway cable for brake activation in case of separation. (see http://shop.easternmarine.com/index....categoryID=150)

Attached to the trailer tonge are 2 chains, about 2.5 feet long or so, with J hooks at the ends.

Connection is straightforward: Couple the coupler, cross chains under tongue, attach one J hook to each of the steel eyes, and connect the breakaway cable to one of the eyes.

If the trailer comes loose (ball fails, coupler fails, receiver pin fails and receiver comes out of tube), two things happen: The trailer tongue falls onto the chains, which cradle it in the "X" formed by crossing the chains. While the tongue falls, the breakaway cable is pulled from the coupler, applying the brakes.

Result is that the trailer remains attached to the truck, trailer brakes are applied which means the trailer won't overtake the vehicle (unless vehicle brakes are applied more aggressively than the trailer brakes will slow the trailer), and everything remains sort of under control.


On the forced uncoupling issue, have heard from several people who trailer to ramps with an abrupt transition from flat to slope that the problem exists. Usually, it occurs with multi-axle trailers (and hence, heavy boats.) As the center of the wheel arrangement drops onto the ramp, the trailer tries to re-equalize the weight on the trailer wheels, which translates into levering the tongue skyward, and the tongue ends up pulling up on the coupler with quite a bit of force. If you've ever looked the actual coupling part of the coupler, it probably won't surprise you that it is a fairly weak spot in the system.

A single axle trailer should not have this problem, as there won't be any equalizing to be done, so no force on the coupler, as long as the max angular offset between the ball and coupler are not exceeded (which would, I believe, make for a *really* steep ramp.)

Sorry for the overly long post;

jky
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Old 25 January 2006, 22:45   #49
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Originally Posted by Polwart
... So if you get stopped and KNOW you are right then you're not really taking a chance at all - other than possibly having to go to court and make the aforementioned traffic cop look stupid ...
And you are happy with all that hassle?

Quote:
Originally Posted by JK
..A secondary coupling can also be fitted to a braked trailer with hydraulic damping, manufactured after 1982. In such cases, great care should be taken to ensure that the secondary coupling is appropriate in terms of the weight of the trailer (esp. If it is over 1000kg.). Also the operation of the breakaway cable is likely to be prejudiced.
Cool.
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Old 28 January 2006, 13:04   #50
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Hi guys sorry for no reply for a while but I've had a family emergency recently!!

I haven't asked a "normal" copper at all because as John says, they know nowt!! I've asked the commerical vehicle unit and a traffic unit. I can also ask VOSA later this week.

Chris
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