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Old 03 November 2011, 01:52   #1
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SBS trailer parts

Has anybody got a good contact for 'odd' parts for AL-KO trailer axles?

My SBS R2-1800B has got an AL-KO 5x165 PCD axle with M16 studs (same as a LR Defender axle - at my request - not the std axle for this trailer) and somebody loosened the wheel nuts the other week and I nearly lost a wheel - I didn't, but it has damaged the threads on one side.

I need to find out if you can replace the studs in the hub (I think so - but its not clear whether they are available from the parts list on the SBS website, there are M16 studs listed but it says they are for Avonride/Peak trailers) or whether you need to get a whole new hub (and if so - what part number to get the right hub)

Ta
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Old 03 November 2011, 02:03   #2
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Try:

Trailertek

Email Karl,
sales@trailertek.com

He is very helpful and if you need the parts shipping to you in the FI and he is not keen then I can pick them up and do that part.
Mention me (Ben Gillam) if you want to, he will do his utmost to help if he can.
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Old 03 November 2011, 03:33   #3
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Thanks, email sent

I see they have 3 M16 studs on the website none of which are for Alko but hopefully he will know which one is needed!
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Old 03 November 2011, 05:54   #4
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Thanks, email sent

I see they have 3 M16 studs on the website none of which are for Alko but hopefully he will know which one is needed!
Without overstating the bleeding obvious Have you tried SBS direct. I've used them for spares, bearings & brake shoes etc & found them competitve & decent service.
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Old 03 November 2011, 06:20   #5
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Would they not be actual "Landrover" studs ?

just the Hub re-drilled to suit?

Landrover studs are Available in 40mm, 45mm and 60mm 'Wolf' studs part no FRC5926 , which usually fits Rangerover Classic , Defender and Earlier Discoverys.

Knock a damaged one out to check


Its worth a look ...

Alan.
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Old 03 November 2011, 06:52   #6
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Deffo M16 too? A lot of LR wheel studs are 5/8".
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Old 03 November 2011, 09:49   #7
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Without overstating the bleeding obvious Have you tried SBS direct. I've used them for spares, bearings & brake shoes etc & found them competitve & decent service.
Yes - first thing I did. I don't know whether they aren't getting my emails or what, but this is the third or fourth time I have sent an email about various things in the last few months and not got a reply. I was trying to get some other parts for it a few months back but I gave up after a while. I sent an email on this on Monday (I think) but nothing as yet. May try ringing them tomorrow if I am in range of a phone during working hours but I need the stuff delivered to a UK address by Tuesday hence the enquiry on here

They might be LR studs but the trailer is at home and I'm not, so I can't check and I want to get some parts delivered to a London address so that I can pick them up next week when I am there briefly on the way home. LR studs have a 16.5mm spline diameter which is one of the two sizes I've found in M16 studs - the other being 16.2mm - so they MIGHT be the same but I don't know. I think all recent LR studs are M16 - the imperial ones were on the older stuff - and the new vehicles like Freeloaders etc are something else but not sure what - maybe M14. The object of the exercise was to be able to fit 16" Defender steel wheels and bigger tyres to give the boat a better ride and it worked fine - the 13" pram wheels might have the load capacity but with 65psi in, they aren't a magic carpet ride

The other alternative is a 16.5mm splined stud and my bench grinder
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Old 03 November 2011, 12:38   #8
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Got a reply from Karl (super efficient) saying they have never been asked for these before and it took ages to figure out the right ones but when they eventually found them on the system they have a 25 day lead time from Alko

Angle grinder it is then

Meanwhile I have ordered an M16 x 1.5 die to clean up the old ones and will see what they look like - the nuts weren't right off and the studs are an inch longer than they need to be so given I only tow it about a mile to the beach at low speed I'll probably double up the nuts and wait till I can get the bits to sort it out properly.

Thanks Ben
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Old 03 November 2011, 12:52   #9
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Is it all 5 for one side you need?

I appreciate it's not what you want (so feel free to say no!), but I've got several 5/8" ones you can have, gratis, if you cover the cost of postage to wherever they're going.

The thread length is 35mm, over all stud (excluding the shoulder) is 50mm. But I'm fairly sure they're 5/8". Anyway, I figured if you changed all 5, then it wouldn't really matter what they were!

Let me know. Ben
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Old 03 November 2011, 13:21   #10
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Is it all 5 for one side you need?

I appreciate it's not what you want (so feel free to say no!), but I've got several 5/8" ones you can have, gratis, if you cover the cost of postage to wherever they're going.

The thread length is 35mm, over all stud (excluding the shoulder) is 50mm. But I'm fairly sure they're 5/8". Anyway, I figured if you changed all 5, then it wouldn't really matter what they were!

Let me know. Ben
Yep, five for one side.

Thanks for the offer - I'll have to have a look when I get back but the thought of changing them had occurred to me as well. The bit I'm now not sure about is that there are at least 2 different types of spline - 16.2mm and 16.5mm - and I don't know which ones are fitted to the Alko hubs so I'm going to have to pull it to bits for a look.

One question you might be able to help with - should the drums just slide off over the studs? When I fitted the bigger tyres a few months back I tried to get the drums off to inspect the brakes but gentle tugging escalating to repeated beating with Land Rover Special Tool No. 1 failed to produce any sign of movement so rather than bugger up the trailer I left them, but obviously it's going to have to come to bits now! Maybe they are just frozen on with corrosion, but it is a pretty hard frost...
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Old 03 November 2011, 13:41   #11
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The studs should be fitted to (through, from the inside out) the drum. I'd be surprised if you had a hub, fitted with studs, and then a drum fitted separately, for the shoes to act against.

If you've got 5 x 165mm PCD, on an Alko drum, then I'm assuming you've got 230mm drums? (ergo 230 x 60mm brakes etc)

And just to clarify, they're wheel studs rather than wheel bolts? Wheel studs stick out from the drum and are permanently fixed, whereas wheel bolts wind in to the drilled and tapped drum. Granny, eggs, I know, but just wanted to make sure we're talking about the same thing! I only ask, as I don't think I've ever seen an Alko drum with studs and nuts, they've always been wheel bolts!

Alko Drum, drilled for wheel bolts:




Peak drum, with wheel studs fitted:



Ben
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Old 03 November 2011, 13:44   #12
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Oh, and reference the stuck drum - I have a hub puller that weighs over 70lbs on it's own, and yes, I have to use it on some drums that just don't want to come off, so I wouldn't be surprised if they were well and truly on there . Sorry!
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Old 03 November 2011, 15:05   #13
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Got a reply from Karl (super efficient) saying they have never been asked for these before and it took ages to ........

Thanks Ben
No worries.
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Old 03 November 2011, 15:21   #14
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The studs should be fitted to (through, from the inside out) the drum. I'd be surprised if you had a hub, fitted with studs, and then a drum fitted separately, for the shoes to act against.

If you've got 5 x 165mm PCD, on an Alko drum, then I'm assuming you've got 230mm drums? (ergo 230 x 60mm brakes etc)

And just to clarify, they're wheel studs rather than wheel bolts? Wheel studs stick out from the drum and are permanently fixed, whereas wheel bolts wind in to the drilled and tapped drum. Granny, eggs, I know, but just wanted to make sure we're talking about the same thing! I only ask, as I don't think I've ever seen an Alko drum with studs and nuts, they've always been wheel bolts!

Alko Drum, drilled for wheel bolts:




Peak drum, with wheel studs fitted:



Ben
Yep they are studs - the studs and nuts look identical to Land Rover items so I am kind of hoping they are as I have five reserved at home for when I get back. I'm not in the islands at the moment but I'm pretty certain it's a ribbed drum like the Alko one you pictured.

If I understand what you said correctly, the hub and drum are all one unit? i.e. the wheel bearing is fitted into the centre of the drum and the studs fit in through the back of the drum? This isn't what I was expecting, which explains why I can't get it off....

This is what it looked like when I got home after the last run out - a bit too 'fin close for comfort!

Ah well, it might have loosened everything up so the drum might fall off now...
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Old 04 November 2011, 04:18   #15
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[QUOTE=BogMonster;428346]
If I understand what you said correctly, the hub and drum are all one unit? i.e. the wheel bearing is fitted into the centre of the drum and the studs fit in through the back of the drum? This isn't what I was expecting, which explains why I can't get it off....
QUOTE]

Apologies for the tardiness of the reply, Thursday night is water polo night

Yes, sir, you are absolutely correct. This morning I took a picture of the back / inside of a Peak drum for you, so you can see how the studs are fixed and what the centre boss looks like (that houses the bearings). The studs are just drifted in, so to remove them, just thump 'em from the outside, in to the drum. In the bottom left you'll see one of those gratis studs, should you require

All the best.

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Old 04 November 2011, 05:19   #16
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Thanks, that is what I thought, a picture is worth a thousand words

I have a couple more questions...

- On these sealed bearings, does the seal at the back of the drum go onto the stub axle or is the bearing completely self sealing, in other words if you take the stake nut off the outer end of the stub axle and pull the drum off, are you disturbing the waterproof sealing or not? On a conventional taper roller bearing on something like a LR, I'd always change the hub seal when I took it off unless it was almost brand new.

- In the SBS trailer service manual (which is based on the std axle) it says that you shouldn't press the bearings out of the drum as you will damage the drum. I guess you can change them but they just need to be drifted out? The SBS parts manual only lists a complete hub/brake drum, not just the bearing, however I ordered (via Osprey) and received a spare pair of wheel bearings when I got the boat so they must be replaceable?

I guess the easiest thing is probably to get a whole spare hub for a quick service fix so when I figure out what I need, I think I'll just order a pair if the cost is reasonable.
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Old 04 November 2011, 05:51   #17
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You won't find a seal, as pictured above, on your hub. You'll find a large circlip (poss two). The bearings are an independently sealed unit - much like a modern car bearing. There's no taper roller bearings, as per a LR. When you press the bearing out (which you can obviously do, ignore the statement that you can't) they'll come out in a complete cylinder. As it happens, there's one sat next to me. This is what it'll look like:

To get them out (once you've got the hub off), remove the circlip(s) and press from the front of the hub out towards the rear of the hub.


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Old 04 November 2011, 15:43   #18
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Ta - that is the same as the ones Roy sent me which I have somewhere at home, but what's the big seal in the back of the drum in post #15 - that looks more like a conventional hub seal of the sort you'd expect on a taper roller bearing hub?
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Old 04 November 2011, 15:57   #19
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Ta - that is the same as the ones Roy sent me which I have somewhere at home, but what's the big seal in the back of the drum in post #15 - that looks more like a conventional hub seal of the sort you'd expect on a taper roller bearing hub?
That's cos it is! You're bang on. It's a Peak hub, with standard taper roller bearings (hence the rear seal), I just posted it up so you could see how the studs would be fitted in your drum.

Your drum will have no rear seal, just a circlip (possibly two) and a sealed bearing, as pictured above.
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Old 04 November 2011, 16:36   #20
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That's cos it is! You're bang on. It's a Peak hub, with standard taper roller bearings (hence the rear seal), I just posted it up so you could see how the studs would be fitted in your drum.

Your drum will have no rear seal, just a circlip (possibly two) and a sealed bearing, as pictured above.
Ah - all clear now, ta

I prefer taper rollers, probably due to being old fashioned. Can't see those silly sealed bearings being very well sealed, though I must admit in the 20 or 30 launches I have done since getting the boat, I've not had a problem with the bearings, just the bloody wheel falling off
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