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Old 12 February 2012, 04:21   #11
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Originally Posted by Seabay View Post
Having been involved in Motorsport for many years,

I am noticing the Service barges (Vans/Landrovers/Estate cars carrying Tyres, Tools and teapots) towing Rally cars on trailers that they all have stickers near the drivers doors that say " Not for Hire of Reward " When I asked a few drivers they said that it was to avoid fitting a Tacho. Most of these travel the whole of the UK. So aslong as you dont charge for your towing duties wouldn't it be the same?
If they were doing it as part of their hobby ie "Not for Hire of Reward" then no tachograph would be require as long as the combined GVWs of vehicle and trailer did not exceed 7500kg. If there was any reward or possibility of reward involved (there was a case recently where a horse box owner got prosecuted as they were travelling to a show with a possibility of winning a prize) then a tachograph would still be required.
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Old 12 February 2012, 04:58   #12
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If they were doing it as part of their hobby ie "Not for Hire of Reward" then no tachograph would be require as long as the combined GVWs of vehicle and trailer did not exceed 7500kg. If there was any reward or possibility of reward involved (there was a case recently where a horse box owner got prosecuted as they were travelling to a show with a possibility of winning a prize) then a tachograph would still be required.
http://www.dft.gov.uk/vosa/repositor...0low%20res.pdf
Not so - from page 8 case study #1
Karen is the owner of a horse that she regularly transports to competitions, using a 7.5 tonne gross vehicle weight horsebox. She considers this very much to be her hobby, travelling to events mainly at weekends. She wins some prize-money occasionally, which goes towards the upkeep of her horse and transportation costs. From time to time, she also transports her friendís horse, which enables them to share the fuel costs. Karen doesnít have an operatorís licence and doesnít use the tachograph which is fitted in the vehicle.

The circumstances under which Karen uses her horsebox mean that she doesnít need to be authorised by a goods vehicle operatorís licence. She doesnít transport her horse, or any other horse, as part of any business venture. As such, she canít be construed to be doing it for hire or reward or in connection with a trade or business, which is the main criteria for requiring an operatorís licence. She does attract some very modest income from time to time in the form of the occasional prize-money or small fuel contribution, but these sums of money are not enough to take her into the realms of operating commercially.

She is also entitled not to use the tachograph which is installed in the vehicle because the weight of the vehicle doesnít exceed 7.5 tonnes and she isnít operating on a commercial basis.

Karen does, however, need to ensure that her horsebox is maintained in a roadworthy condition and that she has at least category C1 entitlement on her driving licence.
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Old 12 February 2012, 05:18   #13
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This is a very grey area. See below extract from VOSA website:

"Unfortunately, "modest prize money" has never been formally defined or quantified for the purpose of goods vehicle operator licensing. Nevertheless, where it is clear that there is only the prospect of nominal winnings which are merely incidental to the amateur activity, then VOSA would not consider that an operator's licence would be required.

Where there is the likelihood of winning prize money is on a more regular basis (whether or not the activity is on an "amateur" basis) and any such success has attracted sponsorship - or any other form of corporate support - this may be construed as having a commercial element to it, where an operator's licence may be required (N.B. this may include the vehicle bearing the sponsors name - in return for the financial support received"
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Old 12 February 2012, 05:39   #14
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Originally Posted by SW RIB Charter View Post
This is a very grey area. See below extract from VOSA website:

"Unfortunately, "modest prize money" has never been formally defined or quantified for the purpose of goods vehicle operator licensing. Nevertheless, where it is clear that there is only the prospect of nominal winnings which are merely incidental to the amateur activity, then VOSA would not consider that an operator's licence would be required.

Where there is the likelihood of winning prize money is on a more regular basis (whether or not the activity is on an "amateur" basis) and any such success has attracted sponsorship - or any other form of corporate support - this may be construed as having a commercial element to it, where an operator's licence may be required (N.B. this may include the vehicle bearing the sponsors name - in return for the financial support received"
As with anything - each case would have to be proven that the driver was not complying with the law beyond a reasonable doubt
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Old 22 May 2012, 13:15   #15
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Just been busted by the police on this today - £200 fine for the privilege too, but no points.

Have a LWB, High Roof Transit, a trailer with a lawn mower on / in it [the trailer].

We were OK on driver time, as our main activity isn't driving.

But our combined GVW (without the Police using a weigh bridge) would have been more than 3500 kg, and as we had travelled just over 50 kms or 31 miles on business - Ka-ching - £200 please.

Getting quotes for two tachos to be fitted asap to a couple of vans now.

Stable door and horse bolted is a phrase that springs to mind.

What it shows, is that the cops clearly know about this and are willing to stop vehicles to check - because nothing else was wrong with the van or trailer or the driving!

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Old 22 May 2012, 13:41   #16
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Originally Posted by Silverfox View Post
Just been busted by the police on this today - £200 fine for the privilege too, but no points.

Have a LWB, High Roof Transit, a trailer with a lawn mower on / in it [the trailer].

We were OK on driver time, as our main activity isn't driving.

But our combined GVW (without the Police using a weigh bridge) would have been more than 3500 kg, and as we had travelled just over 50 kms or 31 miles on business - Ka-ching - £200 please.

Getting quotes for two tachos to be fitted asap to a couple of vans now.

Stable door and horse bolted is a phrase that springs to mind.

What it shows, is that the cops clearly know about this and are willing to stop vehicles to check - because nothing else was wrong with the van or trailer or the driving!

Quote:
EU 561/2006

article 13

(d) vehicles or combinations of vehicles with a maximum
permissible mass not exceeding 7,5 tonnes used:




ó
for carrying materials, equipment or machinery for
the driver's use in the course of his work.
These vehicles shall be used only within a 50 kilometre
radius from the base of the undertaking, and on
condition that driving the vehicles does not constitute
the driver's main activity;

So was it outside the 50 km RADIUS?

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Old 22 May 2012, 15:09   #17
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Silverfox
Just been busted by the police on this today - £200 fine for the privilege too, but no points.

Have a LWB, High Roof Transit, a trailer with a lawn mower on / in it [the trailer].

We were OK on driver time, as our main activity isn't driving.

But our combined GVW (without the Police using a weigh bridge) would have been more than 3500 kg, and as we had travelled just over 50 kms or 31 miles on business - Ka-ching - £200 please.

Getting quotes for two tachos to be fitted asap to a couple of vans now.

Stable door and horse bolted is a phrase that springs to mind.

What it shows, is that the cops clearly know about this and are willing to stop vehicles to check - because nothing else was wrong with the van or trailer or the driving!

So did you get done for weight or having no tachometer
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Old 22 May 2012, 15:50   #18
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Got done on tachometer because we were over 3500kg
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Old 22 May 2012, 16:00   #19
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What area were you in please?
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Old 22 May 2012, 16:12   #20
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Stopped on the M6 near Knutsford, Cheshire.
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