Best Trailer for SIB? Bunked or Roller?

[Peter_C]

Originally Posted by beamishken

The seals on standard bearings run on the hub so the rusty shaft won't matter

The seals mount in the hub and ride on the spindle.

E: is the location the seal rides on. Yours are very rusty, and most likely pitted. The only way to make them work would be to install a seal saver, giving them a new sealing surface.



You can hit your spindle with a wire brush and see just how bad it is though.

[beamishken]

Originally Posted by Peter_C

The seals mount in the hub and ride on the spindle.

E: is the location the seal rides on. Yours are very rusty, and most likely pitted. The only way to make them work would be to install a seal saver, giving them a new sealing surface.



You can hit your spindle with a wire brush and see just how bad it is though.

Sorry but that may be correct for the hubs currently fitted but if he uses the hubs in the link then the shaft doesn't matter as the seal is fixed to the inner race & seals on the hub.
Totally different set up to origional hence he needs to carefully Check shaft diameter & stub length
If those hubs in the link fit then future bearings will be cheap as chips so it's worth investigating

[Peter_C]

Originally Posted by beamishken

Sorry but that may be correct for the hubs currently fitted but if he uses the hubs in the link then the shaft doesn't matter as the seal is fixed to the inner race & seals on the hub.
Totally different set up to origional hence he needs to carefully Check shaft diameter & stub length
If those hubs in the link fit then future bearings will be cheap as chips so it's worth investigating

Sorry, but that is backwards. The sealed bearings he currently has are sealed to the races, both inner and outer. A traditional tapered bearing has the inner seal against the spindle at the raised part, and the outer side is mounted into the hub. I will provide pictures. Please feel free to share a few photos proving me wrong otherwise. If you have ever worked on a typical car front end on rear wheel drive, or the rear on a front wheel drive, then you will understand how the different trailer bearing setup works.



Some good info on...

"Seal Saver System ; There is one thing that is worthwhile to consider installing also. This is called a Spindle Seal Service kit, and is made by Bearing Buddy. It is a thin stainless steel hollow cup with a hole the size of the spindle shaft on one end, and the other is just large enough to slip over the seal surface of the spindle. There is a small neoprene O Ring that goes between the inner lip and the saver. The inner bearing puts pressure against the saver and compresses the O Ring to keep water from coming in under the saver. What this does is give the seal a better surface to seal against. It being stainless, it will not rust or get pitted like the regular steel spindle, which can chew a new seal up. Being thin, it however does increase the shaft dia., requiring Bearing Buddy's own special seal.
2 - Trailer Axle Spindle Seal Repair Sleeve Kit Upgrade 2000# Axel 1.98 OD | R and P Carriages

What this was apparently designed for was, if you had bearing failure and the spindle got chewed up at the seal area, you could save the axle by simply adding this simple device. However it this persons opinion that these units should also be installed as a preventative measure at the same time as new bearings and seals are installed, especially if your trailer is more than a few years old and you use it in salt water.

One thing about the design and or that the instructions don't mention is that I have found that the neoprene O Ring sometimes does not seal out water from coming in behind and under the saver sleeve. It is my suggestion that at the time you install the sleeve, that you coat the spindle at the old seal and shoulder area with heavy chassis grease or a silicone gasket sealer. Then when the spindle nut tightens the bearings against the shoulder, this grease will act as an added sealant.

Replacement seals for Bearing Buddy can be purchased direct from Bearing Buddy for $1.75 each, plus shipping They will take orders by e-mail and credit card."




As you can see the seal rides on the raised part. The inner bearing slides over towards the raised part more. It is a tapered spindle but the function is the exact same.


This is the style of sealed bearing the OP currently has (Although I can't see the type of bearing inside). You can clearly see the inner and outer races, within the hub, in the photo by the OP.


OP I just gave you enough information to make an informed decision as to your purchase of hubs.

[beamishken]

Peter C please believe me uk trailers are nothing like US trailers I've been changing trailer bearings 35 years & you are confusing the issue
The hubs in the link are fitted with UK standard bearings which cost peanuts & the seals are fitted to the inner race & seal on the hub therefore the rusty shaft behind the shoulder is irrelevant
If the op fits those hubs his future bearing replacement cost for the whole trailer will be around £12 for a set of 4 bearings

[MrHeadsocket]

Thank you guys for all your comments! All have been extremely helpful I've decided to go with the 4" pcd hubs with taper bearings although I will clean up the spindle the best I can

[Peter_C]

Originally Posted by beamishken

Peter C please believe me uk trailers are nothing like US trailers I've been changing trailer bearings 35 years & you are confusing the issue
The hubs in the link are fitted with UK standard bearings which cost peanuts & the seals are fitted to the inner race & seal on the hub therefore the rusty shaft behind the shoulder is irrelevant
If the op fits those hubs his future bearing replacement cost for the whole trailer will be around £12 for a set of 4 bearings

Can you explain to me how the seal keeps water out of the bearing on the inside if it doesn't seal to the spindle?

Sure sounds American to me. Funny as it is the SAME bearings and seals my American trailer uses, for which i just bought a hub with bearings and spindle to use as a spare tire mount. Now if the UK decides to take an American product and screw it up, so be it! I have never worked on UK trailers, and will admit I do not care to work on British cars, nor British trailers. I will stick with German, Japanese, Korean, Chinese, and American, as they are more normal.

"Taper roller bearing hub, 4 stud with 4" PCD, 1" diameter bearings

Bearing Numbers: Outer 44643 And Inner bearing with seal 44643L "

OP use a seal saver like in the link I posted and you will be fine.

[beamishken]

Ive explained it twice the seal is totally different

take a look at these they are standard on the majority of small uk trailers

4 Standard 1" shaft trailer wheel bearings. | eBay

[bartiny]

Originally Posted by beamishken

Ive explained it twice the seal is totally different

take a look at these they are standard on the majority of small uk trailers

4 Standard 1" shaft trailer wheel bearings. | eBay

[Alzi]

Originally Posted by beamishken

Ive explained it twice the seal is totally different

take a look at these they are standard on the majority of small uk trailers

4 Standard 1" shaft trailer wheel bearings. | eBay

+1 from me

[Peter_C]

Originally Posted by beamishken

Ive explained it twice the seal is totally different

take a look at these they are standard on the majority of small uk trailers

4 Standard 1" shaft trailer wheel bearings. | eBay

You are right! I am 100% wrong.

The British took an American part designed to function one way and screwed it up Kinda like not having hydraulic disk brakes.

In 23 years in the automotive business, and living/working a farm with tons of machinery and trailers, I have never seen a seal system like that, and hopefully never do.

[beamishken]

Originally Posted by Peter_C

You are right! I am 100% wrong.

The British took an American part designed to function one way and screwed it up Kinda like not having hydraulic disk brakes.

In 23 years in the automotive business, and living/working a farm with tons of machinery and trailers, I have never seen a seal system like that, and hopefully never do.

Typical arrogant yank!

WHEN YOUR IN A HOLE & CANT GET OUT JUST STOP DIGGING!!!!!!!

[Poly]

Guys, as soon as you brought nationality into it and start throwing about insults you lost the argument.

[Peter_C]

Sorry gentleman.

[MrHeadsocket]

Just an update. I received new hubs (4"PCD) and taper bearings and they fit fine! I also fitted a new jockey wheel as well.

[Nick Hearne]

Originally Posted by MrHeadsocket

Just an update. I received new hubs (4"PCD) and taper bearings and they fit fine! I also fitted a new jockey wheel as well.

Nice one, cheep as chips too!

[hippyhunter]

Originally Posted by Poly

Guys, as soon as you brought nationality into it and start throwing about insults you lost the argument.

You like potato and I like potahto
You like tomato and I like tomahto
Potato, potahto, Tomato, tomahto.
Let's call the whole thing off........




Well done MrHeadsocket, glad you got sorted. where did you get the bits from? I need to source some running gear. I like that jockey wheel clamp, it saves drilling holes.

I reckon if you keep putting new bits on your trailer now and again....... clicky






p.s. I'm not taking the piss I'm genuinely chuffed you're sorted (in case anyone picks me up for going a bit OTT on my new trailer build thread on here and thinks I'm having a pop at people who "make do and mend")

I'll stop digging my own hole now and post this with just one more point, Peter_C might have got it a bit wrong on this thread but he's been invaluable on mine and I've appreciated his input, thanks Peter.




All the best,

Jim

[MrHeadsocket]

I got everything from eBay (or is it Fleabay on here?) Just waiting for the grease to arrive and then I will fit the new bearings! I only went with normal wheel bearing grease as the trailer won't be getting dipped I'll post a few links tonight

[MrHeadsocket]

Slight problem with regards to those bearings, they fit fine but the spindle is about 0.7mm too long!!!! (See picture) what should I do? Is there a spacer I could use?

[MrHeadsocket]

Here's the picture

[MrHeadsocket]

Scrap 0.7mm long, they are about 1cm too long